UKC Forums - What can you do?

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Posted by Balsamgrove on 03-17-2012 09:07 AM:

What can you do?

3 dog cast. You turn all three dogs down to the creek no feeder present. dog A strikes first, Dog b strikes 2nd, then dog c strikes. Dog A and dog c tree. Their tree has coon and is plussed. Just as they are being handled from the tree dog b split trees. Dog a and c were turned to him because the judge declared he wasn't tree soon enough. The 5 minutes elapses and dog b is still treed and the other dogs never were treed. Dog b then gets faced barked extremely badly by dog c as hunters are making their way. Dog b leaves just long enough to let the 2 minutes get him. and then is retreed. and dog a falls treed with him during this 5 min. What should've really happen. Should dog a and c even been recut, should dog c been scratched, should dog b's tree been minused, and should dog a got 75 plus for the tree?

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Posted by Bill(Chew) on 03-17-2012 09:44 AM:

Dogs a & c should not have been recast because dog b was treed before they were released.

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Posted by Hey Preacher!!! on 03-17-2012 09:58 AM:

'B' EITHER WAS CALLED TREED BEFORE RECAST OR WAS NOT!!! CAN'T BE BOTH!!! DID THE JUDGE 'SEE' THE AGESSIVE BEHAVIOR??? WHY WEREN'T OTHER DOGS CALLED TREED, FAILURE TO CALL DOGS??? IF DOG 'C' IS AGRESSIVE WHY NOT SAME BEHAVIOR SECOND TIME AROUND???

Posted by Balsamgrove on 03-17-2012 02:23 PM:

Dog A and C were still in the handlers hands when Dog B was declared treed and dog C was the judges dog and all that could be heard was a really growlly sounding bark right at dog B while he was treeing

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Posted by GA DAWG on 03-17-2012 02:27 PM:

You can't scratch em for a really growly sounding bark. If he was treed before while they were on the leash. They can't re cast.

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Posted by JiM on 03-17-2012 02:33 PM:

Dogs A & C should not have been recast.
Dog B gets minused when the two caught him. Even if dog C ran him off, he still gets minused.
Based on " all you could hear was really growly bark" nobody gets scratched.
Dogs A & C would have been scratched for casting with all dogs treed if you had questioned it. You may have had to take it to the MOH and maybe even gone on to a Formal Complaint if the MOH doesn't scratch them but when it FC gets settled, A & C are gone.

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Posted by JSTARR on 03-19-2012 04:16 PM:

IF dog b was treed ,should a,c been recast?

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Posted by buffaloriver on 03-19-2012 04:40 PM:

Split tree cannot be shined until Judge
arrives. After five minutes, first dog’s tree may be
checked and that dog kept on leash until tree is
scored, then he must be turned loose with other dogs
that are opening on trail and will receive 25 points credit
or discredit as deserved, or next available position.
However, if dog(s) are already treed, handlers have the
option to release dog(s) so long as at least one dog is
still out trailing.
Copied and pasted from UKC nite hunt rules clearly states dogs can only be turned back out if there is a dog still trailing no dog was trailing so they should not have been turned out but I am not sure how this effects dog B it left the tree and there is no proof why so dog b minus tree points Dogs A and C should delete any strike and tree points because they should not have been turned out but turning dog out to a treed dog is not listed under reasons to scratch a dog
This is just one person's opinion

Posted by JSTARR on 03-19-2012 04:48 PM:

Can interference be called on a, c for being recast?

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Posted by goodtimekennel on 03-19-2012 05:20 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JSTARR
Can interference be called on a, c for being recast?

N

NO
BUT DOGS A & C SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN RECAST, THIS HAPPENS BECAUSE PEOPLE DONT NO THE RULES AND LET DUMB CRAP LIKE THIS HAPPEN , ITS AMAZING TO ME HOW LITTLE SOME PEOPLE NO THE RULES

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Posted by JSTARR on 03-19-2012 06:05 PM:

btt

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Posted by kayapellijed390 on 03-19-2012 06:32 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by goodtimekennel
N

NO
BUT DOGS A & C SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN RECAST, THIS HAPPENS BECAUSE PEOPLE DONT NO THE RULES AND LET DUMB CRAP LIKE THIS HAPPEN , ITS AMAZING TO ME HOW LITTLE SOME PEOPLE NO THE RULES

Hell some of the Master of hounds I have dealt with don't even know the rules. I was at a zone and had a question that the two masters of hounds answered dead wrong as confirmed by Todd Kellam on Monday. Nothing I could do about it since there is no appeals process at the zones. One of those Master of Hounds treated me like I was an idiot for thinking I was in the right. At another hunt we had 1 dog open as soon as he was realeased and then proceeded to blow through two and a half sections of land running wide open in a matter of minutes and not one other dog in the cast made a peep. It was VERY obvious the dog was running a deer and we had to call timeout and chase him down in a truck to catch him. The majority of tue cast voted to scratch the dog for off game even though we never saw the deer. The guy didn't question it but when we got back to the club the Master of Hounds chewed us out for scratching the guy. The Advisor plainly says we where in the right. Know your rules and buy and READ the advisor might make the difference in winning or loosing a hunt someday. I always havey copy in the truck at every hunt now.

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Posted by JSTARR on 03-19-2012 07:06 PM:

btt

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Posted by Balsamgrove on 03-19-2012 07:11 PM:

you can know the rules all you want but if your a kid and its two against one you'll get taken advantage of 9 times out of 10

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Posted by KRAINES on 03-19-2012 07:45 PM:

your definetly right about that last part but if the dogs cant be seen when the agressive act is taken place then your just screwed and you have to hope your dog can hang with it. I was in a hunt saturday and a little english female jumped all over my dog and was snapping at him. My dog growled back at her even though he shoudn't have and noone got scratched. SHe obviosly started the agression because the other dog in the cadt wouldn't go close to her and she snapped at him when she was handled. People are to chicken to scratch dogs that are mean.

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Posted by wrinkletreeknls on 03-19-2012 08:49 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by kayapellijed390
[B The majority of tue cast voted to scratch the dog for off game even though we never saw the deer. The guy didn't question it but when we got back to the club the Master of Hounds chewed us out for scratching the guy. The Advisor plainly says we where in the right. . [/B]

Was this a nite or grand nite cast?

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Posted by kayapellijed390 on 03-19-2012 09:30 PM:

Nite Ch cast but it doesn't matter either way offgame = scratch. Many people think you have to see the offgame to scratch but the Advisor says different.

Posted by JSTARR on 03-20-2012 07:55 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by JSTARR BACK TO THE SITUATION
IF dog b was treed ,should a,c been recast?

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Tom Stevens and John Starr

PR GRANDNITECH STARRS RED HOT DES HTX
NITECH PR S&S LITTLE BLUE JEAN
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Posted by wrinkletreeknls on 03-20-2012 02:57 PM:

I was asking that question because if it is a registered cast, you dont scratch, you minus the points

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Posted by JSTARR on 03-20-2012 04:21 PM:

Re: What can you do?

quote:
Originally posted by Balsamgrove
3 dog cast. You turn all three dogs down to the creek no feeder present. dog A strikes first, Dog b strikes 2nd, then dog c strikes. Dog A and dog c tree. Their tree has coon and is plussed. Just as they are being handled from the tree dog b split trees. Dog a and c were turned to him because the judge declared he wasn't tree soon enough. The 5 minutes elapses and dog b is still treed and the other dogs never were treed. Dog b then gets faced barked extremely badly by dog c as hunters are making their way. Dog b leaves just long enough to let the 2 minutes get him. and then is retreed. and dog a falls treed with him during this 5 min. What should've really happen. Should dog a and c even been recut, should dog c been scratched, should dog b's tree been minused, and should dog a got 75 plus for the tree?

Dogs A,C are out of the hunt for being recast .B takes its first minus,then retreeed and scored ,Then hunts the remaining time by itself.

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NITE CH. PR S&S BIG TIME TROUBLE

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