UKC Forums - Dog Wormers "End All to Be ALL" LOL Ivermectin ect

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-- Dog Wormers "End All to Be ALL" LOL Ivermectin ect (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928302579)

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-09-2013 04:20 PM:

Re: wormer

quote:
Originally posted by M MUELLER
Just wonder if anyone has tried that Mearicle brand wormer?

I bought a 50# Sack and while I had 3 females in heat for 24 days I fed it to them every day .. I did a fecal float test on each female when I locked them up .. 2 females had Round worm eggs and one other female showed both Round worm eggs and Tape worm eggs ..

After the full heat cycle "All 3 females were Pened together" .. I put aleast a 1/2 a pound of thru those 3 females .. I did a Fecal Float on all 3 and All 3 were infested with rounds and tapes .. So 24 days thats atleast 2 hatching of worms..

Thus the reason for the post "Real Worming Meds" I have about 25# of that Dust left ... I tried it on a few other hounds .. Never made a dent ..

__________________
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Posted by M MUELLER on 03-10-2013 03:03 PM:

wormers

Thanks Steve for the good info, how did that work out taking that wormer?

__________________
coondog

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-10-2013 03:57 PM:

Re: wormers

quote:
Originally posted by M MUELLER
Thanks Steve for the good info, how did that work out taking that wormer?

Well I did not check it out !! lol

But the Wife has 22 cats and is always cleaning cat boxes .. So I showed her what Hook worm larva looks like on Humans. She ask if I had anymore of those tablets !!! She took one !! lol

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-10-2013 04:50 PM:

Here are the Photos I showed the Wife !!

It all started when one of her cats passed some blood in its stool so I did a Fecal Float test and under the Microscope it showed Hook eggs !!

https://www.google.com/search?q=Pho...536&bih=697

Posted by Fisher13 on 03-10-2013 07:55 PM:

Majestic have you done any float test with ivomec?

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-12-2013 06:18 PM:

Great Price on Praziquantel !!! I jost got it yesterday 50 Grams of the Pure Thing !!! $45.25 delivered !!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/33068174578...984.m1439.l2649

Thats 50,000 Mg. or Tape Worm Treatment for 16,600 Pounds of Dog ... at 3 mg per pound ..

Posted by ov_blues on 03-12-2013 07:09 PM:

Got this from a friend of mine.

Worm Medicine for Dogs (Ivomec)

Dilute Ivomec (you want the 1% injectable Ivomec for cattle) one part Ivomec to 9 parts propylene glycol...then give the dog 1/10 of a cc per 10 lbs. of dog of this solution (a 40 lb. dog gets 4/10 of a cc.). You can mix up a bottle of this and just keep it handy (doesn't have to be freshly mixed each time.) This is just about the same dosage the dog would be getting in Heartgard, except that it is more accuarately calibrated to the dog's weigh (cause it's dosed for every 10 lbs, instead of the Heartgard 51 - 100 lbs. where everbody gets the same dose.) You should measure dose with a 1 cc syring, also called a tuberculin syring, because this is measured in tenths so is much easier to measure accurately than in a larger syringe.

Some people give a much stronger dose two or three times a year, of 1/10 of a cc. of the Ivomec per lbs. of a dog (not diluted first with the propylene glycol) because this strength also kills whipworms and hookworms. But if there is ANY question about ivermectin sensitivity, keep in mind that this higher concentration is about 10 times the dose of Heartgard.

I just squirt it over the food in the bowl, or in the corner of their mouth.

__________________
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Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-21-2013 01:21 PM:

Dog weight ml of Pyrantel pamoate - 50 mg/ml suspension per dose per month
10 pounds 0.5 ml
20 pounds 0.9 ml
30 pounds 1.4 ml
40 pounds 1.8 ml
50 pounds 2.3 ml
60 pounds 2.7 ml
70 pounds 3.2 ml
80 pounds 3.6 ml
90 pounds 4.1 ml
100 pounds 4.5 ml
110 pounds 5.0 ml
120 pounds 5.5 ml
130 pounds 5.9 ml

Using a one ml syringe is the most accurate way to deliver smaller doses. If you must you can approximate the dose with the teaspoons listed below.
1/8 teaspoon contains about .6 ml
1/4 teaspoon contains 1.25 ml.
1/2 teaspoon contains 2.5 ml
1 teaspoon contains 5 ml.

Make Your own Total Wormer for less than 2 pennies per Pound of Dog weight !!

Purchase Items :

#1.) Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension 16 oz (1 pint) .. Best price I have found Including FREE Shipping $26.75
26.75 divided by 470 ml per bottle = $0.06 per ml and equals $.0011 per mg .
Avb At : http://www.amazon.com/Pyrantel-Pamo..._pr_product_top

#2.) Praziquantel Pure Powder 25 grams .. Best price I have found Including Shipping $32.85
32.85 divided by 25,000 mg per bottle = equals $.0013 per mg .
Avb At : http://www.ebay.com/itm/Praziquante...=item4cffda4ffe

#2.) 1% Ivermectin 50 ml .. Best price I have found Including Shipping $31.97
31.97 divided by 500 mg per bottle = equals $.064 per mg or $.0064 per 1/10 of a mg .
Avb At : http://www.amazon.com/Ivermectin-No...e/dp/B001ANKL5K

Total Cost per Treatment per Pound of Dog Weight =
Pyrantel: 4 mg X $0.0011 = $0.0044
Praziquantel: 4 mg X $0.0013 = $0.0052
Ivermectin: 0.1 mg = $0.0064

Total Cost per Pound = $0.016 LESS THAN 2 cents per pound ..

Directions :
Dosages for the First 2 worming treatments 2 weeks apart ( This will Kill the Current Worms in the Dog plus the Juvenile/Next Egg Hatching ).. Per Pound of Dog Weight ..
Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension : 4 mg Per Pound .. Each ml/cc = 50 mg
Praziquantel Pure Powder : 4 mg Per Pound .. 1/4 of a Teaspoon = 380 mg . Or 1 Teaspoon = 1,520 mg
1% Ivermectin : ( Heartworm Clear Dog ) .1 mg per pound .. 1/10 of a ml/cc contains 1 mg (1/10 of a ml/cc will treat 10 pounds of Dog weight)
** This Dosage is only used for the First 2 Worming Treatments and every 3 month of the year their after .. The Pyrantel and Praziquantel will kill Every Canine Worm except Whipworm and the Southern Hookworm ..
at the .1 mg dosage of Ivermectin this will kill the Whipworm and the Southern Hookworm ..

Monthly Dosages After the First 2 worming treatments .
Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension : 3 mg Per Pound .. Each ml/cc = 50 mg
Praziquantel Pure Powder : 3 mg Per Pound .. 1/4 of a Teaspoon = 380 mg . Or 1 Teaspoon = 1,520 mg
1% Ivermectin : 4.19 ( mcg )Micro Milligrams per pound .. 1/10 of a ml/cc contains 1 mg or 1000 micro milligrams .. 1/10 of a ml/cc will treat 238 pounds of Dog weight For Heartworm Prevention Monthly ..

The Praziquantel Kills All Types of Tapeworms And may not be needed on a monthly Bases .. Depending One the Type of Housing you dogs are in .. ie: if their on bare ground Grass/Dirt this may require Monthly Tapeworm treatment or at least bi-monthly treatments .. On Concrete housing Bi-Monthly to once every three month treatments ..

Reason for the Increased Ivermectin Dosage at First ..

" The symptoms of a whipworm infection generally depend on the level of the infection.

If there are low numbers of worms in a healthy dog there will usually be not symptoms.

Larger number of worms will cause irritation of the intestinal wall. This irritation can cause the intestine to produce large amounts of mucus. Often there will be diarrhea, which can happen occasionally, be frequent or be occurring all the time. The diarrhea will be gooey due to the mucus and is often bloody.

Weight loss and anemia can also occur with large number of worms.

Rarely whipworms can cause death.

Since whipworms are in the large intestine it is harder to get a high enough concentration of the de-wormer. This makes it hard to get rid of every single whipworm. Most vets recommend that after the initial treatment, de-worming it is repeated at 3 weeks and also at 2½ to 3 month to kill as many whipworms as possible.

High doses of ivermectin (much higher than is in Heartworm medication) will kill whipworms. However, some breeds (including most types of Collies, Australian Shepherds, Old English Sheepdogs and crosses to these breeds) cannot tolerate these higher doses of ivermectin and will get very sick and may die. Since there are other effective de-worming agents for whipworm that do not carry this risk, ivermectin is rarely used for de-worming

VERY EASY REFINED DIRECTIONS !!!!!!!

Total Wormer Plus Heart Worm Protection ..

Total cost to Purchase everything to Treat 6,714 Pounds of Dog Weight = $ 91.54
That’s equal to $0.014 per pound of dog weight .. A 60 pound dog would have a total cost of $0.84 to worm monthly
You could monthly treat (9) 60 pound dogs for a year ..

1- 16 oz. Bottle of Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension = $ 26.75
1- 25 gram Bottle of Praziquantel Powder = $ 32.85
1- 50 Ml Bottle of 1% Injectable Ivermectin = $ 32.85

Directions for the Mixture :

In a Fresh Clean/Sterile Bottle that can Hold around 24 oz. of liquid add the Entire 16 oz. bottle of Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension.
Next open the Praziquantel and Remove 1 level Teaspoon of the Powder from the canister, the Remaining quantity is 23,500 mg. Add
all the powder to the 24 oz bottle of Pyrantel Pamoate Suspension.
Next Draw off around 2.36 cc/ml of Ivermectin and add that to the Bottle of Mixture .. Shake the Bottle for 3-4 min. Plus shake continence before each dog dosage.

Finished Product:

Each Ml of this Mixture contains :
1- 50 mg of Pyrantel Pamoate
2- 50 mg of Praziquantel
3- 0.050 mg of Ivermectin

Dosage:

Each ml/cc will treat 14 pounds of dog weight . So a 60 pound would receive 4.25 ml/cc of the Mixture ..

Formula for Dosage is ( Total Dog weight / "Divided" by 14 )

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-23-2013 04:39 PM:

This Here Would be a Great Worming Combination BUT it is VERY Expensive TO MAKE !!!!!

Panacur Plus was Approved by the FDA But it was never Sold in the US

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Animal...s/ucm062342.pdf

Even using the Very best Prices I can Find !! I can't make it for less than $0.075 per Pound which Equals out to $ 4.50 to Worm a 60 pound Dog ..

What Kills the Pricing is the Fenbendazole ( Safe-Guard / Panacur ) ..
Even buying it by the Gal. which is 3,785 ml and 378,500 mg $390 per Gal .. But it takes at least 22.7 mg per pound of Dog weight ..

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-23-2013 08:29 PM:

Ivermectin "Overdose" levels in Canines As a Rule Per MerckVet.
is 10x the Max. dosage used for Mange which is around .28 mg per Pound or .6 mg per Kg.

So 10 X .28 mg = 2.8 mg per pound would Be Max and Overdose Level ..

"At least 10 times the normal dose of ivermectin is needed for toxic reactions."

But Remember only .1 mg per Pound is all that is required for Ivermectin to Control Some GI Parisites "Worms"

Ivermectin is an avermectin and a fermentation product of Streptomyces avermitilis (also see Anthelmintics: Macrocyclic Lactones). It acts as a GABA agonist, causing paralysis in susceptible arthropods and nematodes. It is used in small animals for treatment of Sarcoptes scabeii, Otodectes cynotis, Cheyletiella blakei, C yasguri, and Demodex canis; in cattle for psoroptic mange, lice, and Hypoderma larvae; in horses for equine filarial dermatitis from Onchocerca cervicalis; and in swine for Sarcoptes scabeii.

In small animals, all use for skin conditions is extra-label in the USA. For Demodex, the dosage is 0.3–0.6 mg/kg, PO, sid until 2 negative skin scrapings 1 mo apart. For Sarcoptes, Otodectes, and Cheyletiella, the dosage is 0.3 mg/kg, PO, repeated in 2 wk. In cattle, 0.2 mg/kg is given as a single SC injection for Psoroptes and lice. In horses, 0.2 mg/kg, PO, kills microfilariae but not adult Onchocerca cervicalis, so relapse may be noted within 2 mo of treatment. In swine, the dosage is 0.3 mg/kg, SC, repeated in 2 wk, or 0.1–0.2 mg/kg in feed for 7 days.

In mammals, GABA is found only in the CNS and does not readily cross the blood-brain barrier. At least 10 times the normal dose of ivermectin is needed for toxic reactions. Ataxia, depression, and visual impairment develop in horses given 2 mg/kg, PO. In cattle, 4 mg/kg by drench or 8 mg/kg, SC, leads to listlessness and ataxia; 30 mg/kg induces ataxia in swine.

Some dog breeds (Collies, Shetland Sheepdogs, Old English Sheepdogs, Australian Collies, and their crosses) have an abnormality in the blood-brain barrier associated with a mutation of multiple drug resistance gene MDR1, permitting increased ivermectin into the CNS and therefore toxicity. Dogs that are homozygous for the mutation produce a severely truncated P-glycoprotein (<10% of the normal amino acid sequence) and will develop ivermectin toxicity at any of the dosages used to treat demodicosis. The critical point seems to be 120–150 ìg/kg, at which transient, nonfatal clinical signs (mydriasis, ataxia, tremors) are seen. At higher doses, collapse, coma, and respiratory collapse may develop. Similar idiosyncratic reactions may develop in any breed, so a gradually increasing dose (daily progression of 50, 100, 150, 200, then 300 ìg/kg) should be given to identify susceptible individuals. Administration should be stopped if any side effects are seen. One cat treated with 4 mg of the oral paste (~70 ìg/kg) showed ataxia, blindness, tremors, and mydriasis, with retinal atrophy in one eye 10 hr later.

Equimax Horse Wormer .. 1-tube = 6.42 Grams Treats 1,320 of Horse Weight or .0049 Grams per pound or 4.90 mg per Pound Markings.
Each 1 pound Horse Treatment Contains .091 mg of Ivermectin and .682 mg of Praziquantel .

The Min. Required Dosage for Canine Tapeworms is 2.27 mg Per pound of Praziquantel .

The Entire Tube has 900.70 mg so 900.7 divided by 2.27 = 397 pounds of Canine Treatment for Tapeworms.

Ingredients :

1) Ivermectin - 1.87% per Volume .. Formula 6.42 X 1.87% = .12005 Grams of Ivermectin or 120.05 Mg

2) Praziquantel - 14.03% per Volume .. Formula 6.42 X 14.03% = .9007 Grams of Praziquantel or 900.70 Mg

3) Some kind of " Paste with Flavor " .. Formula 100% - 1.87% - 14.03% = 84.10% or 6.42 X 84.10% = 5.40 Grams of "Paste and Flavor" or 5400 mg of Nothing ..

Now I have no Idea how much People are Giving their Dogs !!! I have heard Quantizes of a "Pea" size to about " 1" long Squirt "

Lets just say if you divided it by 1 gram sizes which I guessing would be around a Pea Size ..
You Would be Giving your dog 18.17 mg of Ivermectin !!!

Now the Dosage of Ivermectin Required to Work on Internal GI parasites " Worms" is .1 mg per pound of Dog weight ..

So a 50 pound dog would ONLY require .5 mg of Ivermectin TOTAL But with that "Pea" Size Dosage you gave your dog 18.17 mg - 36.7 Times more than required ...

Ok Praziquantel, That same Dog 50 pounds Requires a Minimum dosage of 2.5 mg per pound to Do ANYTHING against Tapeworms . So 50 pounds X 2.5 mg = 125 mg of Praziquantel .
The "Pea" Size Dosage DID Delivered 140 mg of Praziquantel which would cover the Tapeworm Treatment Required .

Cost For Worm Treatment for a 50 pound dog .. $ 12.00 per Tube divided by 6.42 = $ 1.87

Zimecterin Gold Horse Wormer .. 1-tube = 7.35 Grams Treats 1,250 of Horse Weight or .0058 Grams per pound or 5.88 mg per Pound Markings.
Each 1 pound Horse Treatment Contains .0912 of Ivermectin and .456 mg of Praziquantel .

The Min. Required Dosage for Canine Tapeworms is 2.27 mg Per pound of Praziquantel .

The Entire Tube only has 570 mg so 570 divided by 2.27 = 252 pounds of Canine Treatment for Tapeworms

Ingredients :

1) Ivermectin - 1.55% per Volume .. Formula 7.35 X 1.55% = .1140 Grams of Ivermectin or 114.00 Mg

2) Praziquantel - 7.75% per Volume .. Formula 7.35 X 7.75% = .570 Grams of Praziquantel or 570 Mg

3) Some kind of " Paste with Flavor " .. Formula 100% - 1.55% - 7.75% = 90.70% or 7.35 X 90.70% = 6.67 Grams of "Paste and Flavor" or 6670 mg of Nothing ..

Now I have no Idea how much People are Giving their Dogs !!! I have heard Quantizes of a "Pea" size to about " 1" long Squirt "

Lets just say if you divided it by 1 gram sizes which I guessing would be around a Pea Size ..

You Would be Giving your dog 15.51 mg of Ivermectin !!!

Now the Dosage of Ivermectin Required to Work on Internal GI parasites " Worms" is .1 mg per pound of Dog weight ..

So a 50 pound dog would ONLY require .5 mg of Ivermectin TOTAL But with that "Pea" Size Dosage you gave your dog 15.51 mg - 32.2 Times more than required ...

Ok Praziquantel, That same Dog 50 pounds Requires a Minimum dosage of 2.5 mg per pound to Do ANYTHING against Tapeworms . So 50 pounds X 2.5 mg = 125 mg of Praziquantel .
The "Pea" Size Dosage Only Delivered 77.55 mg of Praziquantel which would DO NOTHING for the Tapeworm Treatment Required .

Cost For Worm Treatment for a 50 pound dog .. $ 12.00 per Tube divided by 7.35 = $ 1.63

Posted by Kevin Pruemer on 03-29-2013 04:39 PM:

what is the shelf life of the 3 part mixture?

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We accept cash,check,or money order

Thanks for your business

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-29-2013 08:24 PM:

Min. of 1 year .. Sunlight is a Killer to it .. Use a Dark Bottle and keep it in the Dark ..

Just remember to shake it well before each time you use it ..

Posted by Bartley Hainz on 03-30-2013 12:55 PM:

Is the "End All to Be All" safe to use in pregnant females and nursing moms?

Again that you so much for all the time and energy you spend helping the rest of us out.

All your help reminds me so much of the saying "you give a man a fish you feed him a day, you teach a man to fish you feed him a lifetime".

But it is now changed to "you worm a mans dog it is wormed for a day, you teach a man to worm a dog the dog is wormed for a lifetime"

__________________
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Yorktown, IN 47396
(765) 717-4867
bthainz@comcast.net

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 03-30-2013 10:07 PM:

I only Use Safeguard on the Preg. Females thur Nursing and pups starting at 1-1/2 weeks old .. Liquid Goat or Cattle Safeguard .. 1/2 normal Dosage ..

Posted by Bartley Hainz on 04-04-2013 03:00 AM:

Question

With the 3 part mix here is what you say the monthly dosage is

Dosage:

Each ml/cc will treat 14 pounds of dog weight . So a 60 pound would receive 4.25 ml/cc of the Mixture ..

Formula for Dosage is ( Total Dog weight / "Divided" by 14 )

But you also talk about a initial dose two weeks apart, what should that initial dosage be?

Also how easy do dogs take this mixture? Do you use something to help them take it?

__________________
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Yorktown, IN 47396
(765) 717-4867
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Posted by Majestic Tree H on 04-04-2013 05:45 PM:

Bart what I was saying is If you may have a Hook Worm problem .. You have to Increase the Ivermectin Content for the First 2 week period to .1 mg per pound to Clean them out .. But not to Increase the Dosage of the other Wormers ..

As far a Taste " Its Great " Vanilla Banana flavor .. Its good I tried it !!!

I only have 2 out of 50 hounds that act like they don't like it, But they usually hate anything put in their mouth ..

Posted by Emily on 04-07-2013 10:42 PM:

Since so many use higher doses of Ivermectin (I don't), I thought you'd be interested in this links to symptoms of overdose:

http://healthypets.mercola.com/site...mpaign=20130306

the most important part is here:
Symptoms of Ivermectin Toxicity

Symptoms of ivermectin toxicosis include loss of coordination, prolonged abnormal pupil dilation, reduced alertness that can progress to stupor or coma, excessive saliva production, vomiting, blindness, tremors and seizures.

Diagnosing ivermectin toxicity involves taking the patient’s history, performing a thorough physical exam, and blood tests to determine the serum ivermectin concentration. Depending on your dog’s breed or breed mix, your vet might also test for the ABCB1 gene mutation, which is present in multi-drug sensitive dogs as described above.

Since serum ivermectin test results aren’t always immediately available, in the interim, your vet might also try to rule out other causes for your dog’s symptoms, including exposure to other potentially toxic substances, diseases affecting the brain, and metabolic disorders.

Sounds like is pretty hard to do much damage to a coonhound with a high dose of Ivermectin, but there are always some individual dogs with drug sensitivities. Thought you guys might want to know what to look for if things go wrong. This is not from my personal experience, however, and I am not a vet.

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Posted by pigman816 on 04-08-2013 04:01 PM:

regimen????

So, can you post a typical monthly/yearly regimen for one hound? I.E.....I give heart worm preventative each month. About every 6 months, I use panacure, or similar. Am I doing less than I need, or what suggestions do you have? You seem to be able to back up your opinion with facts, so I am interested in your opinion. Any help is appreciated.>>>Jim Harper

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Posted by Majestic Tree H on 04-08-2013 04:30 PM:

It really depends on Where and How you Keep your Dogs .. If your Dogs are kept on the Ground you may have continious Reinfection.

Posted by Bartley Hainz on 10-01-2013 10:04 AM:

The link you have for the 25 Grams Praziquantel Powder is not going to 25 Grams Praziquantel Powder.

Here is what I found that is a pretty good deal on 25 Grams Praziquantel Powder

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/search.cgi

__________________
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Yorktown, IN 47396
(765) 717-4867
bthainz@comcast.net

Posted by mleck on 10-01-2013 01:11 PM:

here is a wormer that will get it all. I do not know what the dosage rates are until I get home to the kennel where I keep it filed away. My vet along with product rep figured out the dosage and I have been using this in my kennel to kill all intestine worms.

Quest Plus Gel combines 2% moxidectin and 12.5% praziquantel for the treatment and control of large and small strongyles, encysted cyathostomes, ascarids, pinworms, hairworms, large mouth stomach worms, stomach bots and tapeworms

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Posted by Darrell Eads on 10-09-2013 05:15 AM:

Guess I was board and read most of this post , All I got is you guys with all these worm problems must not keep a clean kennel , I clean my kennels daily bleach them weekly and their water, feed good food and clean water daily , I never have a worm problem , Unless I have a litter of puppies , once ever 2 or 3 years then I only have to deworm them for a couple weeks , I don't use none of the heartworm prevention or any kind of wormer , NEVER HAD A WORM PROBLEM

GUESS IM LUCKY

And I kill plenty of coon . and use to use 10% 7 dust now I use bayer tree and shrub for flee prevention

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Posted by deadeye ruck on 10-09-2013 04:19 PM:

Steve,

I looked through your post about making your own "all wormer." I checked the ebay link for the praziquantel powder but it's no longer active. Is this comparative?

Aqua-Prazi (25g powder)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aqua-Prazi-...=item1e7d1bbd87

Thanks!
Simon

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Posted by Majestic Tree H on 10-09-2013 04:43 PM:

Yes sir it is and Still a very good price !!!!

Posted by Majestic Tree H on 10-09-2013 04:47 PM:

Heres the 100 gram bottle

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Praziquante...130947988871%26

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