UKC Forums - babbling

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-- babbling (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=928402783)

Posted by rthompson on 01-01-2015 03:13 PM:

No just a club hunt but the situation is the topic it happens often ive made the same callin ukc casts.

Posted by CHEWBACH on 01-01-2015 03:25 PM:

rite call!

just do the rite thing! you will get along with others well! WELL your starting new year out rite. LOL

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Posted by jackbob42 on 01-01-2015 03:25 PM:

This was already covered in the online advisor.........

The dog is to be called for babbling when it barks , at the time of the call , not 5 minutes later.

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Posted by john Duemmer on 01-01-2015 03:45 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by rthompson
I would minus that in a heart beat. it would be questioned. what if dog opens right in front of you after the minute another opens deep first dog shuts up and covers other dogs track..... minus that sucker too! If the dog opens were no track is evident it is a babble how do you tell if one is evident all of these situations describe a babbli.g me too dog. imo. I want an honest dog thats just me.

I get the impression that you feel the judges job is to see to it that the dog he feels did the best job wins... while that is an honorable intent it just isnt the way its done.
The problem with that approach is that everyone has a different idea about how a dog should operate. As soon as we start useing the rules to controll the outcome rather than applying them evenly and consistantly as they are intended to be used we are asking for trouble.
With the rulebook we use the best dog doesnt always win but it is a much fairer system in the long run than the alternative.

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Posted by rthompson on 01-01-2015 04:00 PM:

Well it didnt effect the out come the best dog won hands down

Posted by JmillerFL on 01-01-2015 05:12 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by rthompson
I would minus that in a heart beat. it would be questioned. what if dog opens right in front of you after the minute another opens deep first dog shuts up and covers other dogs track..... minus that sucker too! If the dog opens were no track is evident it is a babble how do you tell if one is evident all of these situations describe a babbli.g me too dog. imo. I want an honest dog thats just me.

this is called " me too" type of dog. It suck but can only be minused if the clock gets them

Posted by JmillerFL on 01-01-2015 05:14 PM:

So did you win?

Posted by Travis Brown on 01-01-2015 05:30 PM:

Until that dog opens again the only way you can know he is not still where he last opened and has left out is by looking at the garmin. Rules say you cannot score a dog by using the garmins.

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Posted by J I Allen on 01-01-2015 05:38 PM:

How far from cast was dog 3 when he was struck? How long after the one minute had pasted before he was struck? I think because he mentioned your dog babbled you were looking for a reason to minus his dog. If his dog was several hundred yards away when he struck how do you know he wasn't on an old track he couldn't handle. I wouldn't consider that babbling since you or the judge had allowed him 5 minutes before you decided to minus. Also if the road had not come into question I would be willing to bet you would have allowed the 8 minutes to catch him. If the cast decided to call time out before you decided to minus his dog you would have to delete his strike points. If you call time out because of the road were you really 3/4 mile from the road. If you were that far from the road time out shouldn't have been called. If you knocked him down 100 points to start with, makes it easier for you to win.

Posted by GA DAWG on 01-01-2015 07:28 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JmillerFL
So did you win?

Id bet a dime on it he did. Wanting to get other minuses any means necessary. Thats a huge problem in today's hunts to.

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Posted by JmillerFL on 01-01-2015 07:36 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by GA DAWG
Id bet a dime on it he did. Wanting to get other minuses any means necessary. Thats a huge problem in today's hunts to.

I bet he got lost. That's why he's on here all butthurt. Your right about this being a huge problem. I was win a Pkc hunt against 2 dogs in the top 10 of the state race. One guy withdrew and the other tried to minus my dog saying she came off the tree. The only thing that came off the tree was her 2 front feet cause his dog came in and started face barking.

Posted by russ hayes on 01-01-2015 07:56 PM:

It is called reading interpretation,the 8 minute rule is meant for this situation not the babbling rule.Why have a strike time if you can just minus a dog for babbling every time it opens and then doesn't open again fast enough for some people.

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Posted by J I Allen on 01-01-2015 08:18 PM:

After thinking about this some more, I feel the non-hunting judge let the situation get out of hand. If I were the non-hunting judge I would have told the handlers to call there dogs and not tell me what they think everyone else's dog is doing. It's not a handlers job to tell the non-hunting judge what to place on the score sheet for another handlers dog. The judge should make calls like that, and after he has made a call, if you have a question place it on the score card.

Posted by rthompson on 01-01-2015 10:36 PM:

As a matter of fact i did win the cast but even if the dog hadnt taken minus on this it got minus on a slick mine was the only one under a coon and im not but hurt at all my dog doesnt open quick so i have to tree an extra coon its not about me at all if my dog doesnt win oh well im not the one gettn a title in front of my name he is. but a dog barkin cause they cant keep up is b.s. imo he was under a coon for three minutes before the others new it went in that direction. i like what i got proud hes not a babbler.

Posted by JmillerFL on 01-01-2015 11:12 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by rthompson
As a matter of fact i did win the cast but even if the dog hadnt taken minus on this it got minus on a slick mine was the only one under a coon and im not but hurt at all my dog doesnt open quick so i have to tree an extra coon its not about me at all if my dog doesnt win oh well im not the one gettn a title in front of my name he is. but a dog barkin cause they cant keep up is b.s. imo he was under a coon for three minutes before the others new it went in that direction. i like what i got proud hes not a babbler.

strike points don't mean jack if they can't put a coon at the end of it.

Posted by rthompson on 01-01-2015 11:33 PM:

They do if they are just tailgatin all night!

Posted by AndyMiller on 01-02-2015 03:30 PM:

Read rules in 4-h -- anybody that has been hunting coon dogs can tell if a dog is babbling or not you have to strike after the min. Is up no matter wwat on or before 3rd bark ---before --the min. Is up you don't have to strike an the handler knows if his dog babbles to start with -- I always ask the judge are you going to use the min. Rule some do an some don't. But if I judge I do just use common sense

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Posted by JmillerFL on 01-02-2015 05:11 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by AndyMiller
Read rules in 4-h -- anybody that has been hunting coon dogs can tell if a dog is babbling or not you have to strike after the min. Is up no matter wwat on or before 3rd bark ---before --the min. Is up you don't have to strike an the handler knows if his dog babbles to start with -- I always ask the judge are you going to use the min. Rule some do an some don't. But if I judge I do just use common sense

I've seen all 4 dogs in a cast struck and treed under the min. They had a coon too. Wasn't babbling dog in the bunch.

Posted by rthompson on 01-02-2015 05:49 PM:

The minute is just a grace period. what if the dog doesnt open till after the minute and is obviously dog barking and the others strike a coon now that dog is carryn 1st strike when it needs to be minused. ive also seen a dog run right to a feeder open 15-20 times then nuthin but a half mile away gets treed that dog babbled.imo

Posted by AndyMiller on 01-02-2015 07:24 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by JmillerFL
I've seen all 4 dogs in a cast struck and treed under the min. They had a coon too. Wasn't babbling dog in the bunch.

yes I've seen that happen myself like I said (you can tell if they smell a coon or if thr babbling) common sense I've seen a lot of split strike points when dogs wind a coon of the leash

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