UKC Forums - Waiting the Five Minutes.

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-- Waiting the Five Minutes. (http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthread.php?threadid=292867)

Posted by jculler8 on 08-11-2009 05:10 PM:

Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by huntingwalkers9
you can blow a squaller why cant you stand at the tree and wait

when in the world were you allowed to blow a squaller outside of shine time??? FIND IT!

this is ridiculous, I hope I draw some of you idiots out because you will be getting a first hand lesson in the rules, what they mean and how to enforce them!

I'm done with this one, there's too much retardation goin on here! LOL

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Posted by ohiothunder on 08-11-2009 05:31 PM:

Re: Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
when in the world were you allowed to blow a squaller outside of shine time??? FIND IT!

this is ridiculous, I hope I draw some of you idiots out because you will be getting a first hand lesson in the rules, what they mean and how to enforce them!

I'm done with this one, there's too much retardation goin on here! LOL

And theres youre difference from UKC and PKC

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Posted by chuck barham on 08-12-2009 04:09 AM:

Re: Re: Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by ohiothunder
And theres youre difference from UKC and PKC

It is why there will alway's be more arguements in UKC. Even a novice UKC hunter should know that if the other 3 dog's are on lease when dog D was called treed, there is no 5 min rule and if you don't know this, you are not a good student of this game.
There are not better handler's in PKC it's just the lesson cost more and you remeber them longer.
Can you see someone putting up their $ to bring a ? like this in at A PKC hunt? I have seen some pretty dumb one's brought in, but not this basic.

Posted by Adam Reynolds on 08-12-2009 04:49 AM:

LOL!!And we wonder why the cheating threads are always going on.

Posted by Cody Carroll on 08-12-2009 07:51 AM:

Re: Found this a little deeper in Rule 17

quote:
Originally posted by ST_CRK_KENNELS
17. GENERAL INFORMATION:

When a dog is declared treed, Judge is not to let anyone go to the tree and start shining in less than five minutes, unless all dogs have been declared treed. This is a courtesy to other handlers and also to see that a dog will hold his tree. If at all possible, be at the tree within five (5) minutes. If handlers are so far from tree that it will take more than five minutes to get to tree, they are to start walking toward tree, but stopping all along to let other handlers see if their dog is treeing. Judge is not to let any handler keep holding him away from tree just to let dog get to tree after five minutes are up. DOG MUST HOLD THE TREE FOR FIVE MINUTES, UNLESS ALL DOGS IN CAST ARE DECLARED TREED. IF ONE DOG IN CAST, OR ONE DOG REMAINING IN CAST, DOG MUST HOLD TREE FOR FIVE MINUTES.

I guess some of you expert handlers only use the parts of the rules that will help you.

if your leading 3 dogs off a tree and i tree my dog we go straight to my dog. no waiting the 5 on that. all dogs are still considered treed. allen said that in the last advisor column

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Posted by Kyle McMellon on 08-12-2009 08:33 AM:

If you cant hang with the big dogs sit on the pourch and read your rule book lol

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Posted by ESTEP on 08-12-2009 08:33 AM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: re

Some people just need to read their rulebooks a little more.

Posted by blackdawg on 08-12-2009 08:39 AM:

Re: Found this a little deeper in Rule 17

quote:
Originally posted by ST_CRK_KENNELS
17. GENERAL INFORMATION:

When a dog is declared treed, Judge is not to let anyone go to the tree and start shining in less than five minutes, unless all dogs have been declared treed. This is a courtesy to other handlers and also to see that a dog will hold his tree. If at all possible, be at the tree within five (5) minutes. If handlers are so far from tree that it will take more than five minutes to get to tree, they are to start walking toward tree, but stopping all along to let other handlers see if their dog is treeing. Judge is not to let any handler keep holding him away from tree just to let dog get to tree after five minutes are up. DOG MUST HOLD THE TREE FOR FIVE MINUTES, UNLESS ALL DOGS IN CAST ARE DECLARED TREED. IF ONE DOG IN CAST, OR ONE DOG REMAINING IN CAST, DOG MUST HOLD TREE FOR FIVE MINUTES.

I guess some of you expert handlers only use the parts of the rules that will help you.

This means if it is just a one dog cast, or if all of the other dogs are scratched or withdrawn. Dog D can and should have been handled before the 5 was up in this situation. Dogs are considered treed until after you score the tree and re-cast them... even when they are on the lead. In this case, they were on the lead... so they were still considered treed. Dog D was declared treed, so therfore, all dogs were considered treed and there the waiting 5 minutes does not apply when all dogs are treed.

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Posted by ESTEP on 08-12-2009 08:46 AM:

Re: Re: Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by ohiothunder
And theres youre difference from UKC and PKC

Your difference in PKC is nobody ever gets minused for slick trees. And no one ever seems to notice a dog fight. Also, the MOH or the guy running the hunt, gets to hunt and then makes up some bull crap rules to win. Last one you don't even have to tree a coon to win.

Posted by chuck barham on 08-12-2009 12:26 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by ESTEP
Your difference in PKC is nobody ever gets minused for slick trees. And no one ever seems to notice a dog fight. Also, the MOH or the guy running the hunt, gets to hunt and then makes up some bull crap rules to win. Last one you don't even have to tree a coon to win.

Spoken like someone that has lost both of the pkc cast he has been in.

Posted by woodedwalker on 08-12-2009 12:37 PM:

That's exactly what i told him!!!!! Good post Chuck

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Posted by ESTEP on 08-12-2009 12:53 PM:

I never hunted in a PKC hunt. I always hear how much better it is than the other KC'S and went along with a few guy's. Wasn't anything to brag about from what I seen.

Posted by woodedwalker on 08-12-2009 12:58 PM:

So how come you commented on them being slick treein dogs id you know nothing about them?

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Posted by ESTEP on 08-12-2009 01:18 PM:

Well when a dog trees and nothing is seen and it's obvious nothing is there. In the real world that tree is slick right and those points are minused, not circled. Didn't say all pkc dogs we're slick treeing idiots. The casts I've been on it was circle them all even a 10 ft. bush. No hard feelings here just my opinion from what I've seen. Woodedwalker you pm me saying I must not have enough dog power to win in PKC well you are more than welcome to come and see what I'm hunting. And where did I say everyone was a cheat. This is a UKC message Board not PKC. People can bash UKC, but when it comes down to bashing PKC everyone gets all bent out of shape.

Posted by Adam Reynolds on 08-12-2009 02:03 PM:

It amazes me at the perception people have of the other KC. Heck if you don't like them then you don't and everyone has an opinion. But our local club here if you show up at the other KC hunt you had better have a coondog period. Great dogs and you are going to draw a pro handler maybe two. But those fella's don't sweat the small stuff. Sure its not Sunday School out there everytime but they don't argue the small stuff cause everybody knows the rules for the most part, at least the basic eveyday stuff. But with that said UKC is the one that matters. Everybody wants to see those UKC degree's on their papers. UKC just has more people(like me) who hunt these things for fun and enjoyment. UKC also has more beginning nt hunters as well so there is why the rules are misinterpeted a bit more. There is nothing more fun than drawing a good cast in any KC hunt. The ones that there are arguing and stuff going on they seem to last forever. But have fun and you can help people without giving your cast away. I have seen alot of arguments that can be fixed in the woods if the hunters would just help explaine the rules a little to the more inexperianced hunters.JMO

Posted by claytonwalkers on 08-12-2009 02:23 PM:

ESTEP let me tell you a little secret there are ALOT more slick trees getting circled in the kennel club where it takes plus points to win.

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Posted by woodedwalker on 08-12-2009 02:33 PM:

Tom you are very right!!! But what would ESTEP know he has never been in a pkc cast. Where at in Ohio are you from Tom?

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Posted by on 08-12-2009 02:36 PM:

Slick trees have nothing to do with the KC. Slick trees get circled by HANDLERS, not KC's. Anyone who will vote to circle a slick will do without the slightest reguard for what KC they are hunting.

Posted by huntingwalkers9 on 08-12-2009 02:59 PM:

if three dogs are treed and my dog is 400yrds out and we're shining tree and i declare my dog split and tree him. all dogs are treed so blow the squaller here comes my dog into the first tree...therfore we didnt wait the total five on my dog, but beings that all dogs were declared treed it doesnt matter

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Posted by jculler8 on 08-12-2009 03:41 PM:

Re: Re: Found this a little deeper in Rule 17

quote:
Originally posted by blackdawg
This means if it is just a one dog cast, or if all of the other dogs are scratched or withdrawn. Dog D can and should have been handled before the 5 was up in this situation. Dogs are considered treed until after you score the tree and re-cast them... even when they are on the lead. In this case, they were on the lead... so they were still considered treed. Dog D was declared treed, so therfore, all dogs were considered treed and there the waiting 5 minutes does not apply when all dogs are treed.

WRONG AGAIN! 1 DOG CAST YOU MUST WAIT THE 5

Posted by Steve Gilland on 08-12-2009 04:39 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
If other dogs are on track, I don't consider it much courtesy to be within 10 ft. of a tree.

I second that!!

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Posted by blackdawg on 08-12-2009 08:26 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Found this a little deeper in Rule 17

quote:
Originally posted by jculler8
WRONG AGAIN! 1 DOG CAST YOU MUST WAIT THE 5

jculler8, if you will read what i was quoting and read my post, you will see that I was saying in a 1 dog cast, you must wait the 5 minutes.... I know that..... Look Closely at the my post, and the rules that the other guy had posted stating that. I was just trying to tell him that if all dogs are considered treed, you can handle dog D right away.

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Posted by jculler8 on 08-12-2009 09:20 PM:

Re: Re: Re: Re: Found this a little deeper in Rule 17

quote:
Originally posted by blackdawg
jculler8, if you will read what i was quoting and read my post, you will see that I was saying in a 1 dog cast, you must wait the 5 minutes.... I know that..... Look Closely at the my post, and the rules that the other guy had posted stating that. I was just trying to tell him that if all dogs are considered treed, you can handle dog D right away.

sorry i misread it. i understand what you are saying now

Posted by Tim Trone on 08-12-2009 10:10 PM:

why is everybody in such a hurry to get to the tree. what your dog cant hold it for more than 5 . ya i know it is all about recutting the dogs to get more points.

Posted by Cody Carroll on 08-12-2009 11:15 PM:

Re: re

quote:
Originally posted by huntingwalkers9
if three dogs are treed and my dog is 400yrds out and we're shining tree and i declare my dog split and tree him. all dogs are treed so blow the squaller here comes my dog into the first tree...therfore we didnt wait the total five on my dog, but beings that all dogs were declared treed it doesnt matter

still cant squall till after 7 minutes unless you go handle your dog. only way you can squall before 7 is if all dogs are handled or the other dogs arent struck.

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