Registered: Sep 2008
Location: West Alexandria, Ohio
Posts: 226

Maybe this question has been addressed before and I missed it, the semen advertised from long dead studs: How is the DNA checked? With the prices being charged for this semen I would want iron clad proof it came from the dog advertised and I know one dog in particular died prior to DNA being widely available. Just curious, seems like some of them must have spent most of their life ejactulating for so much to be available.

Tom Humphrey

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There have been over 180 hits on this post but no answers from anyone at UKC. I'm not trying to be antagonistic or wanting to stir up something, just wondering if anyone is checking the DNA on semen, we're talking about spending several thousand dollars for breeding to some of the deceased studs, shouldn't the DNA be checked on the semen prior to someone being able to sell it?

Tom

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quote:

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Originally posted by barrelmaker
There have been over 180 hits on this post but no answers from anyone at UKC. I'm not trying to be antagonistic or wanting to stir up something, just wondering if anyone is checking the DNA on semen, we're talking about spending several thousand dollars for breeding to some of the deceased studs, shouldn't the DNA be checked on the semen prior to someone being able to sell it?

Tom

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Registered: Jan 2011
Location: MICHIGAN
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has anyone ever seen anything really nice come out of frozen semen...any breed?if so name them.

heard of nice hounds from chilled,just not frozen/stored.
"old"breeder{75 yrs old} told me same thing.he's never seen or had any luck with frozen/stored semen either.

something to think about before dropping the $$$

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Never heard of many but my buddy has a pretty dang nice one off Harry. Least I like him. He's a coon treer!!

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Michael Ghorley

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Unfortunately unless a DNA profile is established on a dog prior to it's passing there is no real guarantee that the semen is from the dog that it's claimed to be from.

UKC did establish a policy in the late 90's that requires all semen collected after January 1, 1997 for freezing be DNA profiled prior to registering any offspring.

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DNA AND CYROGENICS/FREEZING WASN'T EVEN AVAIL. WHEN SOME OF THESE "STUDS" WERE TO HAVE BEEN COLLECTED!! THAT IS ANOTHER PROBLEM I HAVE.

I THINK BARRELMAKER HAS SOME HARD FACTS ON THAT.

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United Kennel Club was the first registry to offer DNA as a service and we didn't start until the mid 90's but there were laboratories out there offering these services independently.

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It would be interesting to be able to know what was really in some of those old dogs. If it worked it worked but there would be a lot in there that wouldn't be of any hound breed.

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Registered: Sep 2008
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quote:

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Originally posted by Angela
Unfortunately unless a DNA profile is established on a dog prior to it's passing there is no real guarantee that the semen is from the dog that it's claimed to be from.

UKC did establish a policy in the late 90's that requires all semen collected after January 1, 1997 for freezing be DNA profiled prior to registering any offspring.

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btt

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btt

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If the semen is still being housed were it was drawn I would think a person would be pretty safe in takeing the vet's word that it hadn't been switched.

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Is there someone out there selling semen that hasn't been DNA profiled? None that I know of but I sure don't know about everything out there. I will say this though, I bet if someone pays big bucks for some rare old semen that hasn't been profiled, they prolly don't want it profiled and don't want to know. And those who buy into those breedings should do so while humming that old saying LET THE BUYER BEWARE.

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Last edited by JiM on 04-29-2012 at 01:39 AM

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quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
Is there someone out there selling semen that hasn't been DNA profiled?

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Yeah, I just looked it up. Zoogen claims it was the first and it started in 1989.

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AKC/UKC NtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jeff 5/2/2000 to 1/22/2012 R.I.P.
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quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
Is there someone out there selling semen that hasn't been DNA profiled? None that I know of but I sure don't know about everything out there. I will say this though, I bet if someone pays big bucks for some rare old semen that hasn't been profiled, they prolly don't want it profiled and don't want to know. And those who buy into those breedings should do so while humming that old saying LET THE BUYER BEWARE.

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Well here's tha thing Tom. Anyone your age is likely well aware of how things were done back in the pre-DNA age. There are alot of our senior breeders still around today that know very well that many of the great crosses made back then weren't off the sires they were claimed to be off of. I think many times when this old pre-DNA semen is used and pups sold, the buyers are more interested in having that old blood on new papers. The pup and how they turn out is an afterthought, it's the pedigree that counts. As for how those pups turn out? Well we learned a long time ago that pups off two dogs nobody ever heard of will win as often as the big name crosses. It is the same crapshoot either way. The paper is the only thing that is different.
I have no idea how honest that old semen out there is, it may all be exactly as claimed. I don't really care and I doubt the buyers do either.

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AKC/UKC NtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jeff 5/2/2000 to 1/22/2012 R.I.P.
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quote:

---

Originally posted by JiM
Well here's tha thing Tom. Anyone your age is likely well aware of how things were done back in the pre-DNA age. There are alot of our senior breeders still around today that know very well that many of the great crosses made back then weren't off the sires they were claimed to be off of. I think many times when this old pre-DNA semen is used and pups sold, the buyers are more interested in having that old blood on new papers. The pup and how they turn out is an afterthought, it's the pedigree that counts. As for how those pups turn out? Well we learned a long time ago that pups off two dogs nobody ever heard of will win as often as the big name crosses. It is the same crapshoot either way. The paper is the only thing that is different.
I have no idea how honest that old semen out there is, it may all be exactly as claimed. I don't really care and I doubt the buyers do either.

---

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btt

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The sad thing is the dogs before DNA were better in a lot of ways becouse the breeders could put into the mix what they thought they needed to make a better hound.
Another sad thing is the papers didn't show what they added to get the better hound. So there is no record of what they did. LOL

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I know of a dog that semen was collected and frozen in mid 1980's. They did gets pups from it but none were of any account. Who knows why. Dog was a field trial dog named Chrome Wheels, Greyhound cross probably the best hall Of fame stud of that period.

For What it is worth, Jeff A.

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btt

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I agree there are alot of registered dogs that have a mix in there to correct a fault or improve a certain area. Can't do that with DNA.

Jeff A.

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