Registered: May 2008
Location: West Central, Ohio
Posts: 443

Whats the opinion or success rate on breeding a brood bitch? I have a female that's bred right, I like alot of things she does in the woods but not enough to put her in the hunts. she hunts hard, hates a coon, opens up enough, nice mouth & great looking. I don't like how she trees, if it's a hot track she's all over it, if not she half a$$es it & even wants to dbl check herself, If she trees hard theres a coon. she's independant most of the time but when she's not finding anything she will come into another dog treeing (not always). Another reason i ask this is she didn't really have a fair chance as a pup. My opinion is...she was shown to many coon as a pup and trees off sight v/s treeing off sent. Would you breed her to a stud that will complement her or not waste your time? Thanks

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Chad Newland
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Registered: Mar 2010
Location: maine
Posts: 213

if you dont really like her why would you want pups out of her?get pups out of something you do like even if it aint yours we all would have higher percentage of dogs makin coon hounds if people would follow this unritten rule in my opinion. if its a dog you have to make excuses for your better off lookin elsewhere or waiting till the dog proves itself . this is still not a guarantee but your odds increase. good luck

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Central Michigan
Posts: 6544

What are her littermates doing? How did her parents and their littermates hunt?

My answer to your question depends on the answers to the above questions.

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Larry Atherton

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First of all, just know that this is MY opinion, and I'm sure lots of folks have a different opinion than I do.

That said, here is what I think.

I, personally, wouldn't want to purchase a pup out of a brood female unless I knew exactly how she was. Which means I would have to know her owner well enough that I trusted him/her to be honest with me about her.

You seem to be going for honest since you are asking this question in the first place

Firstly, it is common for a dog to come in to others if it is not on track. IMO, this is fine. I personally would not want a dog who did NOT come in to others treed when not on a track of thier own. They are naturally pack animals and this is okay, so no worries there.

Secondly, as far as being "bred right" goes, I wouldn't carry that in my basket. Certain lines of dogs are a little more predictable as far as certain traits they may inherit, but that really tells you nothing of the individual dog. Lots of hounds out of famous coonhounds make good dogs, but FAR MORE DO NOT. Evaluate the dog as an individual, not as a pedigree.

Thirdly, it is very possible for a dog to reproduce hunting dogs even if they themselves are not finished dogs. Lots of dogs have the good genetics and the instinct to pass on to a pup even though we humans may have done something to that particular dog to ruin or otherwise discourage correct hunting. Human error always comes into play. Someone showed her too many coons as a pup and now she trees by sight instead of scent. She may very well have had the right ingredients, she just wasn't "cooked" properly

Really, you have no way of knowing for sure, though. Which means, she COULD have never had the desire to scent trail game in the first place, or that desire may not have been very strong. Which are definitely traits you do not want to breed into your pups. You could breed her to a "perfect" stud and still have half (or more) of your pups come out wanting to trail only hot tracks.

It's really just a roll of the dice. You need to ask yourself whether you are breeding because YOU want pups off this female, or to make a little money? If you want pups off of her, why? If you were on the outside, and it was smeone else's female, and you were considering buying a pup out of her, how would you look at it?

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Last edited by Maverick061106 on 04-08-2010 at 05:28 PM

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Registered: May 2008
Location: West Central, Ohio
Posts: 443

quote:

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Originally posted by kordog
if you dont really like her why would you want pups out of her?get pups out of something you do like even if it aint yours we all would have higher percentage of dogs makin coon hounds if people would follow this unritten rule in my opinion. if its a dog you have to make excuses for your better off lookin elsewhere or waiting till the dog proves itself . this is still not a guarantee but your odds increase. good luck

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Chad Newland
West Central, Ohio
937-407-0128


Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life; define yourself. ~Harvey Fierstein~

Life consists not in holding good cards but in playing those you hold well. ~Josh Billings~

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Registered: May 2008
Location: West Central, Ohio
Posts: 443

quote:

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Originally posted by Larry Atherton
What are her littermates doing? How did her parents and their littermates hunt?

My answer to your question depends on the answers to the above questions.

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Chad Newland
West Central, Ohio
937-407-0128


Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life; define yourself. ~Harvey Fierstein~

Life consists not in holding good cards but in playing those you hold well. ~Josh Billings~

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Registered: Sep 2007
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quote:

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Originally posted by thebigcat454545
I would actually keep most of this litter for myself to see what happens. I'm not in this to sell pups.

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Last edited by Maverick061106 on 04-08-2010 at 06:38 PM

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Registered: May 2006
Location: Southern Oregon
Posts: 1344

I always ask myself... Am I willing to hunt/own another dog just like her (in this case) or am I willing to own another dog just like the sire? If I'm not.. then I won't be breeding it..

Because really, you have no idea what you are going to get.. You can try and find a male that you like and one that is reproducing what you want despite the females being bred to him.. But, can you find that?

I've seen pups turn out to be spitting images (hunt wise) of their dam.. I've seen the same of the sire.. And I've seen pups get exactly what I wanted from each parent and be exceptional dogs.. And then I've seen pups that you wonder who left out some of the ingredients when they were being cooked LOL..

So... roll the dice

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Registered: Dec 2009
Location: coon heaven ohio
Posts: 166

the dog will run and tree coon she is bred to the hilt the mother would tree you a ton of coons i hunted with her. i think chad was just green in starting a coondog she was his first attempt i believe you should go ahead and give it a shot if it works great if not your out a couple hundred bucks but aleast you'll know i'd breed her to the son dog or boomer and see what you get jmo jay

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Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:

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Originally posted by Maverick061106
If you plan on keeping most of the pups and getting the others to folks who will really give them a chance, I'd say go for it. Just do the responsible thing with ones that don't turn out and CULL or NEUTER them.

Story time...
I have an English dog out of Fallen Timber Max, who is out of Fallen Timber Dusty, who is out of Michigan Swamp Rooster.

GREAT pedigree.
GORGEOUS dog.

As soon as I make him a show GRCH, this dog will be neutered and will be our pet for the rest of his life. And this has nothing to do with his hunting instincts. He will give a coon hell and look good doing it. HOWEVER... he has issues with strangers.

To put it plainly, he can't really function as a normal dog without ME physically with him. He loves kids, loves people, loves being messed with and tended to, and I think he would let me skin him alive if I wanted to. He is EXTREMELY devoted to ME, but it seems that if he ends up alone with an unknown man, or is alone and sees a person in our yard, he shows aggressive barking and tendencies.

I actually sold half interest in this dog to a young man a while back. He'd planned on taking him and hunting him up good, putting him in some nite hunts and possibly breeding him to his female out of Swamp Rooster.

The dog had other ideas, as soon as he left my house.

The man could not even get the dog out of the box, without the dog snarling and trying to bite him. The man called me, and as soon as I showed up, the dog was completely changed. The man could pet him, hold his lead, etc, with no problem.

I had this dog since he was 4 months old and I know every experience he has ever been through. The person who bred him was a woman I feel I know quite well and she is very calm and laid back, as I am. He has never had a bad experience with a man or woman that I am aware of.

So he came back to me. I will never rehome him again unless absolutely necessary, and then would have to be very particular about who would be able to take him. I will never know if the man did something to provoke him, or if he was frightened, or what made him act the way he did, but I will not tolerate ANY kind of aggression. Many people think it is harsh, but I feel like a dog should let me do ANYTHING to it, regardless of what it is, and not show aggression towards me.

I'm going to make him GRCH just because I enjoy handling my dogs, for my personal enjoyment. He will then be neutered and I am considering trying him in the weight pull competitions. I would have loved to have a pup out of this dog one day, but I can tell you right now that it will never happen because I will not have any kind of aggressiveness bred into my line.

There are always alternatives to culling a dog, but they must be in the right hands for a person to do the responsible thing with them.

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quote:

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Originally posted by wildbill
i wouldnt get the dog fixed cause he dont like strangers,its the protect instink in the dog,i have some walkers like this,you have to place them in homes where they will not be traded like livestock ,after they grow out of puppyhood ,they are like dobies ,will like people but perfer their master for life,,if more hounds had this trait ,their would be less stealing going on..
3 out of 5 of my walkers have this trait and if someone trys to steal one of them ,,lol,,too bad if they pick the wrong one,,

i would breed him and see what his pups do and only put them where they would be returned if they didnt want to keep them or cull if needed..that trait is a plus in my book if the dog will hunt like it should...dont have to worry about people stealing them..

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I actually feel a very close bond to Wyatt because of the way he is towards me. I feel like he would do anything for me if he only knew what I wanted of him.

There would be no chance of someone trying to steal this dog As soon as he spies anyone in our yard who he thinks is "not supposed to be," he goes into full alert mode. Especially if it is a man, he will bark like the most vicious dog in the world. And while I know he would never hurt anyone if he got loose (he has before, and he won't let anyone come close enough to him to touch him except me or Andrew or someone he knows), it is very unsettling to the poeple he is barking at.

My concern lies here: What if a man in a hunting cast makes the wrong move or tries to touch him when I haven't yet reached the tree? Is there a possibility he might act aggressive towards him?

This may be fine for someone who wants to pleasure hunt a dog alone (which we do a majority of the time), but what about the folks who want to comp hunt? I dont think I would put Wyatt in a comp hunt for that sole reason. I don't want to cause anyone else discomfort because of my dog. I don't want to have that reputation, or my dogs or kennel be associated with that sort of temperment...

If I ever decide to breed a "project" litter and keep all the pups, or let someone else breed him for free and them keep most or all of the pups, I might consider breeding him, but I don't know if I would have time for a whole litter anytime soon! We are not dead set on neutering him yet, so we'll see...

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Registered: May 2008
Location: West Central, Ohio
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Thanks for the opinions guys, But has anyone on here ever done this that can tell me how it went? or know a story of someone trying this? I know it's been done and everyones got there own opinion on it but who's actually done it? Thanks

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Chad Newland
West Central, Ohio
937-407-0128


Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life; define yourself. ~Harvey Fierstein~

Life consists not in holding good cards but in playing those you hold well. ~Josh Billings~

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2410

Knowing the holes in your dog and getting her with a stud that you can see would fix it ... will work and has worked.

Just find a stud that matches everything you like about her ... and is really strong where she isn't.

The problem most have with breeding ... is they use that danged old blanket method ... they cross-cross the strengths and weaknesses of both and you most often end up with pups that have all the weak points .


I started out with a B&T btich that was really cold nosed , hunted hard and could blister a track ... but was a weak treedog ..

.. I bred her to a dog that had all those same traits , but came from lockdown treedogs ... and got some good pups , and some junk .

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Registered: Mar 2010
Location: maine
Posts: 213

let me put it another way would you breed a lab for duck dogs if it didnt retrieve or only brought the duck halfway in or a pointer that only points once in awhile even if the parents are great dogs i t skips certain dogs get pups out of the siblings if you like that breedingif there complete dogs.you said you wouldnt be out anything but your time and money goes into these hounds.all dogs came from wolves coyotes etc....man has selective bred them to be what they are .breed the best to the best. im not trying to bust your balls i just feel strongly about making better hounds thats all.

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Registered: Nov 2009
Location: NW Iowa
Posts: 280

is she hot nosed or ever been chewed on -on the tree?

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Registered: Dec 2006
Location: kenton, ohio
Posts: 57

Chad, I had a female a few years back and her papers only had 2 or 3 dogs that anyone had probably ever heard of. My old dog out of Droop dug his way into her kennel and 2 months later she had 13 pups. I sold 2 to a guy in Springfield and he came back for another one. Shawn Cramer bought one that was real nice I kept one that didnt turn out and a woman from work bought one for her son for a pet. I know that at least 5 of 13 turned out never heard back from the people with the other ones so you just never know. My old dog isnt a TOP reproducer but I like him so if you try a proven stud you just never know. If the DNA lines up you could strike gold if not you have a bunch of pups to figure out what to do with them. I do not breed dogs because I dont have it in me to put them down if they dont make it. Remember like you said about your female, make sure they are given the opportunity to prove themselves. Good luck in your decision.
Dean Rowe Jr.

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