Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Oxford, N.C.
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If a tree has a dead limb broke off pretty high in a tree and the base of the limb that is broke is pointing where you cant see in it and is of course big enough for a coon to get in. How many consider this a place of refuge?

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Trent Brummitt
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YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO SEE HOLE YOU CAN JUST ASSUME ITS THERE

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This is pretty much a " NO BRAINER " ! I would have to say if the limb that broke off was hollow and it was obviously enough of a hole for a coon to crawl into then anyone that plays fair would agree to circle. More than likely the only guy who would say no is the guy who's dog isn't treed. But my theory gets all blown to hell when a slick treer is treed and the good dogs are still trailing. But, if the coon could get in the hole look at rule 5 a.

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france

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Its a judgement call. The judge makes the call and if the cast dissagrees , you vote and thats that.

If I can see a hole big enough for a coon , I vote circle , if I can't see a hole , I vote minus and move on.

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Mark Reavis
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the rule doesnt say you have to see a hole, says if the coon could be there. A dead broke off limb that big coon definatly hold a coon seen it before. Guess it depends on what the rest of the cast gets out of the call.

Circle points:

(a) When dog strikes and trees up a tree or a hole in the ground where there could be a coon, yet Judge does not see coon and no off game is seen.

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Trent Brummitt
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Yes , I've seen guys argue that a coon ''could'' be there , but personally if I can't see where he ''could'' be , I still have to vote minus.

I've seen guys stand around and argue over whether or not a tree might be hollow , but for me , I need to see something up there for a hideout. A person could argue that every tree ''' might''' be hollow and then circle everything , but that wouldn't make it right IMO.

In the end its just another judgement call that has to be made by the judge and possibly voted on. I don't stand around argueing , we vote and move on and thats the end of it... Good luck.

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Mark Reavis
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quote:

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Originally posted by longshot
Yes , I've seen guys argue that a coon ''could'' be there , but personally if I can't see where he ''could'' be , I still have to vote minus.

I've seen guys stand around and argue over whether or not a tree might be hollow , but for me , I need to see something up there for a hideout. A person could argue that every tree ''' might''' be hollow and then circle everything , but that wouldn't make it right IMO.

In the end its just another judgement call that has to be made by the judge and possibly voted on. I don't stand around argueing , we vote and move on and thats the end of it... Good luck.

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quote:

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Originally posted by hjames888
ah a honest person for once on this board, very great points

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Mark Reavis
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quote:

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Originally posted by longshot
Thank you and the most important thing is to score it the same way reguardless of who has first tree. That may be the hardest thing for some folks to do.

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quote:

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Originally posted by hjames888
im the first one to minus my dog for doing anything,i even had a lighted collar on my dog one night in a hunt,and some guys told me , thats the stupidest thing i ever saw,and when i asked him why he said,cause the whole cast can see if your dog is off the tree, and i told him if my dog cant stay treed for a whole 5 mins he is going to get minus points by me anyway,i never want a dog in my yard with any title that didnt 100% earn it ,thats the bottom line for me ,but maybe theres something wrong with me lol

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Mark Reavis
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quote:

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Originally posted by longshot
Amen ! I wish everyone was like that.

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Registered: Apr 2007
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so now the guy that thinks the coon could be in that snag is not honest. If you never seen a coon in a hollow snag you havnt hunted long. You have your opinon on how you would score it but the rules dont support it. It says if the coon COULD be there. Not you have to see a hole. The rules are there for you to follow not make your own. I know some broke off limbs you can see in and some are not big enough for a coon, but every situation is different. I am the first to take a minus and wont take a win if I didnt earn it the honest way. I would not cheat my dog like that. But if a coon could be there he could be there. I have seen some score it circle some minus but usally it depends on what side of the call the judge is on which is sad. was just looking to see how the majority interpret this situation.

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Trent Brummitt
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Trent , I'm not trying to be a smart azz or something , but how can you circle any points where you can't see the place of refuge? I'm certainly not calling anyone dishonest. I think its just differing opinions.

I'm happy to circle if I can see a hole , but for me just to assume there is hole , I can't do. A broken limb might or might not have a hole in it , but I think you still have to at least see the place of refuge...


I wasn't there on your cast , so maybe it looked enough like a hole to be scored that way?? You said it was hollow , but even that is a judgement call if you can't see the hole. The bottom line is , it has to satisfy the judge and/or cast members and be scored accordingly. It sounds like it might have been a bad break and we all have them.


What if dogs are running a track and just shut up and come in? Do I assume it went in a hole and circle them? Under your assumption , the hole ''could'' be there..

Can you see my point?

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Last edited by longshot on 01-24-2010 at 02:36 AM

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I know your point b/c you are not the only one to see it that way... But to me a snag as big as the one I am talking about and one that is dead is no different from a nest or leaves cause you cant see in it. Like I said every situation is different I try to go by the rules and in a situation like this I felt for sure the coon could be there.

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Trent Brummitt
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no hard feelings here everyone has a opinon

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Trent Brummitt
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quote:

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Originally posted by Trent B
no hard feelings here everyone has a opinon

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