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imacorgimom
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2006
Location: East of Huntsville, Alabama
Posts: 657

quote:
Originally posted by BVK
They have both Welsh Corgi Cardigan & Welsh Corgi Pembroke.


FYI, the Pembroke Welsh Corgi and Cardigan Welsh Corgi are distinct and separate breeds coming from completely different backgrounds.

The Corgi from Pembrokeshire is a breed of considerable antiquity. The direct ancestors of the Pembroke were brought across the Channel in 1107 by Flemish weavers. The early progenitor is said to have had a resemblance to the old Schipperkes, and sprang from the same family that includes the Keeshond, Pomeranian, Samoyed, Chow Chow, Norwegian Elkhound and Finnish Spitz.

The Cardigan first arrived in Cardiganshire (its place of origin) with the Celts in 1200 BC. The breed became useful because the Crown owned practically all land, and the tenant farmers were permitted to fence off only a few acres surrounding their dooryards. The rest was common land, on which the crofter was permitted to graze his cattle. Instead of herding the cattle, the Corgi would nip at their heels and drive them as far afield as desired.The dog was a member of the same family - teckels- that has produced the Dachshund.

PLEASE don't confuse the two breed as varieties or offshoots of the other!!!

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Old Post 06-25-2009 01:42 PM
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mnp13
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2003
Location:
Posts: 4

Sorry to drag an old thread out of the closet, but I came across it while searching for something else.

The American Bully has been a hot topic on a lot of Pit Bull boards, mine included.

According to an article written by Dave Wilson - one of the "founders" of the American Bully, the American Bully is a mix. (emphasis added)

http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/...10062006/226864

quote:
Come see our gentle 'bullies,' unfairly savaged by a currish editorial

Free Lance-Star has 'bullies' all wrong

Date published: 10/6/2006

AS PRESIDENT of Razors Edge and one of the founders of the American Bully, I am appalled by your Oct. 3 editorial "Bully for the bulls?" Your statements are not only offensive but inaccurate.

The "Back 2 the Bullies" convention to be held tomorrow at the Fredericksburg Expo Center is not for the "celebration of the pit bull" as you allege; it is for public awareness of the American Bully. This is a new breed created more than 15 years ago, and it is a separate breed from the "pit bull."

We blended different breeds together to obtain certain desired traits. The American pit bull terrier was one of the breeds whose lineage is in the background of this breed, but it is by no means the only breed behind it.

Even the part of the lineage that is American pit bull terrier stems from United Kennel Club-registered conformation show dogs! There is also an American Kennel Club-registered show breed in the lineage of this breed called the American Staffordshire terrier. Some breeders even included some bulldog lineage into their breeding. This breed has been established for over 10 years now.

The American Bully Kennel Club was created for the registry and promotion of this breed. These dogs have extremely mellow demeanors and were bred for the purpose of companionship. If you had researched the breed or the event, you might have learned more about what you were falsely commenting on.

We have been hosting these shows for more than four years now and have a great track record with major cities all over the United States. These events have all been a success, and people continue to request them in their areas. We have people flying in from all over the United States, and even confirmed guests from Japan, Italy, and the Philippines.

These events have been amazing for bringing all types of people together from all over the world--all races and all genders. The amount of public support has been overwhelming. For this area, the event is also helping the local economy. Three major hotels in this area are sold out, not to mention all the restaurants and pet stores that stand to gain business. Major pet stores, pet-feed companies, rescues, animal shelters, attorneys, and other organizations and individuals are backing and sponsoring this event.

To talk about this event in the context of young girls murdered by a serial killer is sick. How do you think the families of those children feel seeing that incident brought back up and being used in association with a dog show?

Then to talk about a sanctioned dog show in connection with a mauling by a pack of dogs running at large? The dogs that mauled Dorothy Sullivan weren't even pure pit bulls. But whatever breed they were, the tragedy has no correlation with this show. The poor woman who was mauled deserves more respect than to be brought into a commentary about a dog show. This entire editorial was plain sick.

At our event, the local animal control office maintains a booth with a donations box set up for its shelter. Also with booths are dog-rescue organizations that inform the public about all the dogs being put to sleep in shelters. Also at show we have a task force that seeks to bring to justice illegal dog fighters. We have a lady who runs programs in the low-income areas of major cities, and who helps underprivileged children through working with dogs.

We have five nonprofit organizations manning booths. As people from all over the world come to our event, we even have the local police department working there to ensure the safety of all patrons and participants.

At our event, nothing illegal is being promoted, permitted, or advertised. We have done no wrong at all. Our event simply seeks to certain promote a breed in a positive way.

Your editorial misinformed the public about the nature of "Back 2 the Bullies" and the breed it highlights.



DAVE WILSON of Spotsylvania County is president of Razor's Edge, the main company sponsoring tomorrow's Back 2 the Bullies convention.


Date published: 10/6/2006




American Bully's are not just "over bred" American Pit Bull Terriers, they are mixes bred to be as exaggerated as possible, not bred to be a functional breed.

In my personal opinion, dogs that are miles outside of the standard shouldn't be registerable, regardless of what their papers say. Pit Bulls are supposed to be the consummate athlete, not muscle bound dogs that get winded just standing around.

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Old Post 07-30-2009 11:40 PM
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Joebatdoublee
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2009
Location: Lumberport Wv
Posts: 67

Since everyone wants to register these obese unhealthy apbts. I would like to register a new breed to they are half beagle half apbt we will call them WV WOOD TICKS.

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Old Post 08-01-2009 07:45 AM
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Medea
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 85

I do not feel that the American Bullie should be reconized as a individual breed athey have been crossed so many times with so many breeds there is no way to say what they are & over Most not ALL are unfuctional

The American Bullie is overdone Yes I said it they are overdone you can find some really nice ones do not get me wrong I have personally seen a couple American Bullie that could pass as an APBT and work wise are able to do what is asked of them . But they are not an APBT and they should not be reconized as a APBT either, people that own the Old Time APBT's work hard to keep thier dogs lines the way they were and some are and this day and age that is very hard to find a "true ABPT" so to step on them toes would be not only wrong and IMHO would be a dishonour to the "True" APBT.

They are good work dogs to be Proud of and have been around for a long time, the fact that people want to pull away form the Name Pit Bull only goes to show the lack of education that is out there and the amount of play the Media has on even those that own a "Pit Bull"

If you chose the "Pit Bull" as Breed you loved, respected and wanted then why not stand up Proud

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Old Post 08-01-2009 06:50 PM
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BULLY-UP
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2009
Location:
Posts: 2

CANT BELIEVE THE UKC IS NOT SUPPORTING THIS BREED BUT DONT THINK TWICE REGISTERING THEM. I THINK UKC NEEDS TO WISE UP BECAUSE ONCE THE ABKC GETS GOING YALL ARE GOING TO LOSE A LOT OF GREEN. LOTS OF FOLKS WILL NOT STAND TO DISH OUT MONEY TO AN ORGANIZATION THAT WONT SUPPORT OR STAND BY THEM LIKE AGAINST BSL. I RIGHT NOW HAVE A FULL BLOWN KENNEL WHICH IS DUAL UKC/ABKC REGISTERED BUT MY PUPS FROM THEM WILL ONLY BE ABKC. ITS YOUR CALL UKC.

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Old Post 12-28-2009 06:49 AM
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BULLY-UP
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2009
Location:
Posts: 2

quote:
Originally posted by mnp13
Sorry to drag an old thread out of the closet, but I came across it while searching for something else.

The American Bully has been a hot topic on a lot of Pit Bull boards, mine included.

According to an article written by Dave Wilson - one of the "founders" of the American Bully, the American Bully is a mix. (emphasis added)

http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/...10062006/226864


American Bully's are not just "over bred" American Pit Bull Terriers, they are mixes bred to be as exaggerated as possible, not bred to be a functional breed.

In my personal opinion, dogs that are miles outside of the standard shouldn't be registerable, regardless of what their papers say. Pit Bulls are supposed to be the consummate athlete, not muscle bound dogs that get winded just standing around.



EVERYTHING EVOLVES FOR THE BETTER. I LOVE THE PITBULL BUT I DONT NEED A GAME DOG OR ITS SKILLS. IM NOT A HUNTER NOR DO I LIKE ITS AGGRESIVENESS. SO THATS WHY I LOVE THE AMERICAN BULLY TO ME IT HAS THE BEST TRAITS OF A PITBULL AND MORE.

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Old Post 12-28-2009 06:54 AM
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Russell Smith
Moderator

Registered: Apr 2007
Location:
Posts: 15789

Thank you for your comments.

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Old Post 12-29-2009 01:21 PM
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BlueAPBTMom
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2008
Location: Va
Posts: 15

I really dislike that "American Bully" enthusiast try to say that their dogs do not have the aggression that an APBT has to try and make up excuses for why they are ruining what is already a great breed.

My dogs do not have human or animal aggression and they are the standard APBTs. My intact males play very well within their 'pack' as well as with outsiders on supervised play dates with other intact or altered dogs. My APBTs think they are lapdogs and demand affection from people.

I do understand this is not the case for every APBT and that dog aggression runs true and deep in the breed. I think any dog showing signs of human aggression should fix their dog and consult a professional dog trainer and not breed the dog.

I have seen many a dog aggressive and a few times people aggressive "Bully style pit bulls" as I work in the veterinary field and unfortunately my city is one of many who is turning to what some call the "bully movement".

I dislike the "American Bully" because most, not all, breeders are breeding untitled, unhealth tested dogs (commonly with faults) for color, height (shortness) and girth. Many, many "American Bully" dogs have been mixed bred with "English" bulldogs, French bulldogs, American Bulldogs, Staffordshire Bull Terriers, Cane Corso's, Presa Canario's, etc to achieve a specific fad 'pit bull' look. I find it difficult to take serious a breed and registry where breeding mutts who have "better temperaments" (because they can't move for very long due to their size and weight) who haven't carefully decided on how to shape the breed or variation of the breed.

I know that the ABKC has a loose standard on what an "American Bully" should look like but I will respect the breed when they have a stricter standard and HEALTH isn't sacrificed when the look is so overdone (wide chests, splayed feet, bad pasterns, sway backs, over feeding to achieve a 'bullier' look). I will respect when the breeders HEALTH TEST their dogs prior to breeding. I will respect the ABKC more when they don't have woman paraded around a "family event" showing off cleavage and bare mid drifts and when they do not title dogs with faults (kinked tails, bowed legs, severe sway backs, etc).

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Old Post 01-03-2010 01:47 AM
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turtleman9100
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 10

I have personally seen some of the bullies. There are many over done but, there are many that looks very nice. I chose to research one on the internet that I thought looked very nice from its picture. True, it was short, large head and blue but, I went thru its 7 generation pedigree and every one of the dogs were purple ribbon UKC registered. Pure breed APBT. How can you register its offsprings as something else when they are all pitbulls(according to the registry). I don't think its fair to call a ukc apbt bred to another ukc apbt (akc amstaff) a mixed breed.

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Old Post 01-03-2010 02:00 AM
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justhillbilly
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2010
Location: NOR-CAL
Posts: 6

A mut is still a mut.... To start a newer breed There would have to be years and years of ruthless culling and i dont see that going on, every ones out to make a buck or awww look at how cute they are............ I have a love of AST not mixed muts.....

This is just my way of thinking witch my not be the same as yours

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Old Post 01-05-2010 04:10 PM
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trayp1
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2009
Location: fort campbell, ky
Posts: 2

wow

Own what people now consider an american bullie, And then develop a general hatred or dislike for the new found breed, I dont think it really talke 50 plus years to work out allof the kinks om these wonderful animals. its been done ladys and gentleman. You dont have to pay homage to every kennel and every single bully, no i would never suggst such a thing. but there are bullies that have out produced there ancestors such as rocky of mo betta blue pits. no bodys whining we are just stating facts not all bullys are sloppy and overdone, with bad attitude. so i would have to agree with turtleman, do your research do hate, but untill then why doesnt everyone out side and cant and really dont wanna relate and see our bully vision stay in your lane and do whatever it is you do. stay true to that traditional apbt standard, We will create our own, not meant to disrespect anyone. its annoying to red 70 percent of these posts and they all down the bullies,they are here get over it. now really what are we talking about

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Old Post 02-09-2010 12:20 AM
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topdogk9
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2011
Location:
Posts: 1

Re: wow

quote:
i would have to agree with turtleman, do your research do hate, but untill then why doesnt everyone out side and cant and really dont wanna relate and see our bully vision stay in your lane and do whatever it is you do. stay true to that traditional apbt standard, We will create our own, not meant to disrespect anyone. its annoying to red 70 percent of these posts and they all down the bullies,they are here get over it. now really what are we talking about [/B]


I find it annoying to read comments by someone about developing a new breed yet they insist on calling their new breed purebred American Pit Bull Terriers.

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Old Post 03-07-2011 10:12 PM
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Ohana
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2010
Location: Virginia
Posts: 54

quote:
Originally posted by turtleman9100
I chose to research one on the internet that I thought looked very nice from its picture. True, it was short, large head and blue but, I went thru its 7 generation pedigree and every one of the dogs were purple ribbon UKC registered. Pure breed APBT. How can you register its offsprings as something else when they are all pitbulls(according to the registry). I don't think its fair to call a ukc apbt bred to another ukc apbt (akc amstaff) a mixed breed.


Its called paper hanging... when you take papers from a dog ie. Purple ribbon papers, and get some english bulldog/staffordshire bull terrier/apbt mix and use those papers for that dog. Wah-la! Suddenly that mutt is now a purple ribbon registered pure bred apbt. Dave Wilson has ADMITTED to doing this when creating Razors Edge. Ijs....

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Old Post 03-07-2011 10:49 PM
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heflinskennel
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: va usa
Posts: 30

ukc abkc

well lets see I dont know where to start. for I breed ukc,adba american pit bull terriers as well as the abkc american bully's I will have to agree and disagree on almost all points of this topic. first off not all bullies are mixed unless you count akc amstaff and ukc american pit bull terriers mutts. not all bullies are over done to any standard of the ukc american pit bull terrier. i breed true ukc standard bullies with out mixing any other breed into my line. but with that said anyone who breeds this breed knows there is so much variations in height, weight, head size, head shape, that not every dog on your yard, not every pup out the same litter is going to look alike. I like the fact that ukc is not recognizing the bully as a breed or a style. and dont understand why most bully breeders feel that they have to be reconized with ukc. I agree that it takes decades to create a new breed of dog and only a few gen's to create a style of dog to conform to a certain look. but that does not make it a new breed. I feel that ukc is doing right by not jumping on the band wagon as of yet, for most Bully breeders cant even produce to the bully standard as of yet. heck I havent been able to even with every dog in my yard with constant line breeding. give it time i feel once ukc sees that the abkc bullies are conforming to there own standard as a bully then maybe ukc will rethink their options. but for now register bullier style with abkc and ukc style to ukc. if you have duel registered dogs as I do then it is very easy to do what is needed to seperate the two styles. I still have adba and my leaner adba standard dogs are shown in adba shows.

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Old Post 03-08-2011 11:22 AM
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Russell Smith
Moderator

Registered: Apr 2007
Location:
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Thanks for your input.

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Old Post 03-08-2011 12:47 PM
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kingpitbull
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2010
Location: New York City
Posts: 5

American Bully

Ok i been seeing and hearing people talk about this topic first off Dave Wilson is from Va American bully are Mixed dogs ps. Friend's with people who was help start ABKC and the American bully with Dave.

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Old Post 05-17-2012 05:06 AM
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Carla
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2003
Location:
Posts: 13

quote:
Originally posted by BVK

There are always going to be bad breeders & BYB's in every breed, but to allow all these dogs that are not to standard & knowing that the breeders are trying to change the breed & create a new one, yet continue to allow them reg. as APBT is crazy.



The "American Bully" is nothing but an exploitation OF a breed and it does not DESERVE UKC recognition as a separate breed. The breeders need to be condemned, as far as I'm concerned, for doing what they area doing to dogs in general and to the APBT breed specifically.

I agree that in most instances, these dogs are simply purposefully grossly exaggerated individuals of the APBT or AST (and dwarfism, anyone?), with legitimate papers with those registries. Surely not something deserving to be called a "breed".

I often hear stories about the overdone, legitimately UKC-registered dogs being denied entry into the rings at UKC shows. I hope this is not true. These dogs should be allowed into the ring and then the JUDGE should show us all exactly what these dogs as APBTs are deserving of -- dismissal for lack of merit or at LEAST withholding of ribbons for ANY placement. Wasn't the Standard recently changed to "allow" for the exaggerations -- allow as in them being severe faults? Then, judges, show us what happens with dogs that have severe faults. Let us and the public learn what UKC thinks of this exploitation.

"American Bullies" - go register with ABKC and have fun there.


Carla

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Old Post 05-17-2012 06:43 AM
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Carla
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2003
Location:
Posts: 13

quote:
Originally posted by mnp13

American Bully's are not just "over bred" American Pit Bull Terriers, they are mixes bred to be as exaggerated as possible, not bred to be a functional breed.


That right there is a good reason for UKC not to recognize them as a breed, no matter WHAT they are! A breed based on purposeful exaggeration and deformities -- yeah, that's the ticket!

quote:
Originally posted by mnp13
In my personal opinion, dogs that are miles outside of the standard shouldn't be registerable, regardless of what their papers say. Pit Bulls are supposed to be the consummate athlete, not muscle bound dogs that get winded just standing around. [/B]


So, UKC should inspect every dog at maturity and judge which ones are "miles outside of the standard"?

Carla

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Old Post 05-17-2012 06:53 AM
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heflinskennel
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: va usa
Posts: 30

Re: American Bully

I do know of many bully breeders that have been mixing other breeds with there pitbulls and then calling these dogs american bully thinking it is okay to do so. (yes there are many poeple who accept this.) i for one do not. Yes i breed a bullier style on occasion as well as many other breeders do. and if they say they dont they are full of crap. yes i do know Dave for he lives 20 minutes from my house. do i personaly know if he has crossed any other breeds no. have i purchased any dogs off of him no, have i done any breedings with him directly no. do i agree there are many just down right disgusting bullies being advertised and promoted to be grate dogs yes. now with that being said i do applaude dave wilson and the abkc for given a better outlet with public knowledge, of the apbt showing the true aspects of our breed showing that this breed is nothing like what the news media portray's them to be. Trying not to offend the ukc, but i dont see the ukc doing any thing to promote this breed in a better light , for the entire world. In my oppinion.

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Old Post 05-19-2012 02:27 AM
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heflinskennel
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: va usa
Posts: 30

quote:
Originally posted by Carla
That right there is a good reason for UKC not to recognize them as a breed, no matter WHAT they are! A breed based on purposeful exaggeration and deformities -- yeah, that's the ticket!



So, UKC should inspect every dog at maturity and judge which ones are "miles outside of the standard"?

Carla



Carla I have to ask you sence you stated that the apbt is supose to be functional. please tell me other then being able to walk, breath properly. please tell me what other function (legal purpose) is there for the apbt these days other then being a pet. how is the apbt as a breed going to survive, when in most places the are banned, most land owners that rent out their proporties either will not or can not rent to owners of the apbt because of insurance issues, because of the media. ukc dog shows are open to the public. how does this help the breed. (it does not) what about the people who do not go or has never been to a dog show. I say this because the everyday people have absolutely no idea what the apbt realy looks like. what is the ukc doing about this? what is the abkc doing to help with public knowledge? if the akc ukc adba and the abkc would work together for the breeds and not money I wonder what could get accomplished. but yet we sit here on our computers debateing this rediculous subject.

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