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UKC Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.3.0 UKC Forums > Departments > UKC Coonhounds > Tweaking a dog to compete (bad tracks)?
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Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 1334

quote:
Originally posted by MorAnd
Dogwhisperer,

That's a different perspective Ö send in a dog that puts pressure on it; hadn't really thought of it like that. Nor, have I heard the "no hinge/hinge" verbiage. That's the beauty of this board, different thoughts/ ideas and terminology. I love learning something new Ö


Davebott,

Sounds like we train alike. Heck, we may both be wrong (Lol), but that's just how we see it.


Reuben,

It's funny, coon hunters seem to think dogs don't get hung up on off game/non-coon tracks. I've heard it said, I wish my dog could run a coon like he does a hog/deer. It sounds like some hog tracks are colder and have to be unraveled too.




We as hog hunters want our dogs to pack up...hogs that have been dogged quite a bit are dog smart and can shake the dogs off long enough to get away...

I am making an assumption on what happens at time...I have not actually seen it but have seen the sign and believe this happens at times...A group of pigs are feeding a river bottoms for 3 or 4 hours and have spread out over ten acres feeding before leaving and have left to their bedding area 2 hours ago...at that time two dogs strike at about the same time...one dog gets hung up in those 10 acres for 5 or more minutes...the other dog just knows to make a wide loop and hits the exit tracks within 2 or 3 minutes and will be bayed in 5 minutes...the two dogs I am talking about were related, nephew and uncle and both were top dogs...when you have 10 or more pigs feeding in a ten acre area it takes a pretty good dog to figure out the tracks in an acceptable time frame...these two dogs were so competitive against each other they would not pack up but they honored each other...

Since most hog hunters want their dogs to pack up it is difficult to figure out what is happening especially for the inexperienced...the lead dog can make the whole pack look good because he is the dog unraveling and keeping the track straight...

I think the big question needs to be...how long are we willing to hunt the dog to try and turn him into a better track dog?

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Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 1334

quote:
Originally posted by yadkinriver
If you tweak a young dog off bad tracks you may be preventing that dog from it's full potential. The best dog I ever had had so much nose he would take a track at midnight that was made early and other dogs wouldn't even open on and trail what seemed like forever. I would sit in the truck with my window cracked until his big squal locate then go to him. By two years old he would drift out on it and tree coons that others didn't know was in the woods and not take all night to do it.
Electronic training equipment is great but it can be over used too.



Sometimes I think my dogs noses are comparable to each otherís...and then as we are cruising along one of the dogs come by and just keeps running along never showing any interest...a little later another dog comes by and takes a track right where the other dog ran through...usually these colder nosed dogs are the better track and find dogs...but they arenít those dogs that will start a cold cold track...

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Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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Old Post 11-26-2020 02:19 AM
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Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 1334

quote:
Originally posted by River Birch Run
So there is a lot of info missing here on the question the should be addressed 1st. How old is the dog and how much time in the woods has it had ALONE? I dedicate a yr to hunting a dog alone through all four seasons. The most important thing is to fine a nice log to sit on by a tree for witch to lean you back on. Sit back a listen, use your garmin mark areas the dog throws interesting barks at. Once the dog moves out of the area check those marked area's. See what was there it don't take long to learn what every bark the dog makes mean. I like to sneak in on a dog where I can watch it work too. There are so many factors as to why a dog is standing on its head. Tree tops, dry leaves, tracking off game, jumping tracks, water, frost, tall vegetation, thick cover, the list goes on and on. The trick is to learn what is holding the dog up and keeping the shocker in the pocket and letting the dog finish. Once you are pretty certain what slows the dog down, try to set the dog up to succeed, to build its confidence. Sprinkle in what it struggles with and the dog should get better at it as it's confidence builds. You can speed this along if you have a good dog you can toss in with it every now and again to show it to how to better work an area it struggles in. I.E. working a track threw thick tree tops with briers. I good dog will take track to that point then circle it and pick it up on the back side rather than work through it. A young dog will pick up on that rather fast if it trust the dog it's in the woods with. It's all about reps and positive renforcement.


I like how you think...good post

I have a friend that has hunted dogs I have given him in years past...his style of hunting the dogs is way different than mine...his dogs donít cast out far...they appear to be hotter nosed because of how they are hunted...they donít wind much unless it is smoking hot and if they wind off the buggy he just keeps going to where he has decided where to hunt...he doesnít use the wind to his advantage...

I donít train the dogs much but I am very careful how I hunt my dogs...I try to start from downwind and work into the wind if possible...When I cast my dogs I wonít move until the pups are in the woods hunting...
If I am roading them I move slowly so they can be thorough when working a scent...if they get interested in something I stop and wait on them...if they come back we move on...if it looks like a good track I will walk into the woods at least 100 yards just to help them out...

if the dogs get a little interested in the wind currents and they go in but circle back and try again and come out...I will see the likely spot where the game is likely located based on wind currents...sometimes the scent is channeling...I will head into the wind until the dogs pick up on the scent...
If the dogs are in the buggy and they blow up I will turn them out...
There is a reason on why I do all these different things for the different hunting situations for my dogs...
I want my dogs to be thorough and at the same time focus the on task at hand and not on keeping up with me...itís all about the dogs and not me...

My buddies dogs appear to not have a colder nose and donít range far and it is due to how the dogs are hunted...

River Birch Run...your idea of training is similar to mine...

__________________
Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

Last edited by Reuben on 11-26-2020 at 03:33 AM

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Old Post 11-26-2020 02:30 AM
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River Birch Run
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2007
Location:
Posts: 1078

Don't get me started on the wind and humidity LOL. I don't have much timber where I live it's all patch woods unless i'm on a river bottom. The last great dog I had was an ambush dog that hunted the wind. You had to cut him into the wind. If you didn't when you cut him he would sprint about a hundred yrds stop dead throw his head up and turn to hunt into the wind. He would open as soon as he winded the scent but then would go mute until he was almost treed. He was fast, would cover a mile in under 2 min and get treed. He had a good nose and could work bad tracks quick and get treed if he had too. He always ran to water on still nights, or bad nights. His dam was more balanced she would wind when she could but worked tracks on the ground as well. She would grab scent out of the air and walk on two feet on a lead. She wasen't good at treeing the layups she was always down wind of the coon one tree. His sire was the best coondog I have every owned. He had a great nose. He drift tracked and was always moving fast. He was natural he trained me, thought me more than I ever thought him. You could hunt him down one side of a woods and right back up the other to the truck treeing coon after coon. As he got older he was kinda a jerk he would set up other dogs by throwing a locate on a tree to get them to blow up the tree. Then he would sink in 20 to 50 yrds deeper with the coon.

My last litter I really paid attention to the pups when I started bacon drags in the yard at 4 wks old. Some of them straddle tracked, some tried to drift track and some winded. For the most part thats how they work tracks as adults. I didn't have an old dog to work with this litter to see if it would change how they hunt. What I have noticed over the yrs is that the dogs that wind are always the hyper dogs with a tone of drive and some what gamey ( but I think the run up on game). Seem to be the best tree dogs. The drift dogs tend to be the most complete dogs and more fun to hunt. Tend to be solid, dependable dogs the fastest. The straddle track dogs take the most work, and time. Most accurate but tree a lot of dens. Much harder to tell when there working off game.

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