Registered: Feb 2008
Location: In my heart Eureka Springs
Posts: 1161

Is it time to start talking about a Lipper Strain?? A serious question and for good reason. I know the first impulse might be to say, what are you talking about he is House Bred.

But what is Yadkin River? What is Lone Pine? What is Clover? What is Spring Creek? What is Sailor Boy?

Well lets take Sailor Boy. The Sailor Strain is HERSHBERGER bred. But a couple of dogs with a different name came from that strain that had an impact and people started talking about the Sailor strain of hounds.

Well House's Lipper has had an impact too. Bigger then maybe most realize. Even though he does have some House Bred hounds in him, he also has a lot more of some of the other hounds that made an impact on the breed. The combination of these strains is what made Lipper. In a later post I will try to go into how much of the House Strain he has in him compared to some of the other dogs in his pedigree.

This is not an attempt to take away from the House Strain but give credit to the other strains that combined together made Lipper which is The Lipper Strain.

With the arrival in a few days of some brand new puppies out of House's Lipper maybe it is time to actually talk about the Lipper Strain and the impact it has had on the breed. Doesn't he deserve this much?

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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: In my heart Eureka Springs
Posts: 1161

quote:

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Originally posted by C.Gibson
Hey history nut.. What can you tell us about House's tom tom? Back in the day that was the blood I loved. Tom Tom, & Clint. Both led to lipper.

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Okay before I start let me do a disclaimer.

"Okay your House freaks said with a smile, the information I am going to post here and in later posts is in NO WAY meant to take anything away from Joe House and the important part he had on the breed. It is not meant to diminish his importance or to bash him in anyway. It is also not meant to give more credit then what is due.

To talk about a strain we will need a fountain head for that strain. I would think that HOUSE'S QUEEN would be considered the Fountain Head of the House's Strain.

Let's start with HOUSE'S TOM TOM. Would most consider him a House Bred Hound? Tom Tom was out of Kaw River Chief and Tinsley's Kansas Tess.

Kaw River Chief was out of House's Chief and Johnson's Kansas Rose.

House's Chief was out of Johnson's Banjo and House's Queen.

Kansas Rose was out of Staley's Paducah Chief and Hershberger's Kansas Sally.

Tom Tom's mother Tinsley's Kansas Tess was out of Bun's Jack and Tinsley's Kansas Jane. What many may not realize is that there was another Tinsley's Kansas Tess that had as much if not more impact then Tom Tom's mother Tess. The original Tinsley's Kansas Tess is in Tom's mother background numerous times. She was out of Mack Twain and a female out of Indiana Boone Boy and Forrester's Sue. Her mother was a litter mate to Forrester's Bell, Motley's Mo. Major's mother.

So House's Tom Tom's mother goes back to Mack Twain at least 3 times, Indiana Boone Boy at least 4 times, Forrester's Sue at least 4 time, Motley's Mo. Major, Merchant's Bawlie, Hershberger's Little Butch.

Tom Tom's Daddy Kaw River Chief as stated goes back to Johnson's Banjo and House's Queen. But in all fairness if you was going to call Tom Tom as House Bred because of his Grandfather's mother, couldn't you also make the argument he is Banjo bred?

Tom Tom's grand pa is House's Chief. That is the only place you get House and since Chief was out of Banjo why not Banjo bred?

Kaw River Chief's mother Kansas Rose goes back to Nance's Joe Williams, Mack Twain, Hershberger's Okla. Spot, Hershberger's Texas Babe, Indians Boone Boy, Forrester's Sue, White River Boone at least 2 times, and Hershberger's Spot Jr.

So there you have it for the most part. What strain is Tom Tom?

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Weyers Cave Va
Posts: 13408

Why now? This isn't the first litter of pups off of Lipper since he's been dead. Why is there so much hype with this litter over the others?

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: ga
Posts: 249

HISTORY NUT YOUR AWESOME I'VE LEARNED ALOT ABOUT WALKER HISTORY THAT I COULDN'T HAVE LEARNED ANY WHERE ELSE. JUST WANTED TO THANK YOU.

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: ga
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SO WHAT WAS HOUSE'S QUEEN OUT OF ?I KNOW MR. HOPKINS SAID HE DIDN'T HUNT FEMALES SO I'M GUESSING SOMEONE ELSE DID BREEDING FOR THEM? I'M MEAN OTHER THAN THAT YOU MAINLY ONLY HEAR OF A HOUSE'S MALE DOGS WHAT WAS SOME MORE FEMALES THAT WE'RE OWNED BY HOUSE AND MR. HOPKINS.

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2003

quote:

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Originally posted by HOBO
Why now? This isn't the first litter of pups off of Lipper since he's been dead. Why is there so much hype with this litter over the others?

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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: In my heart Eureka Springs
Posts: 1161

quote:

---

Originally posted by DANNY RAMEY
HISTORY NUT YOUR AWESOME I'VE LEARNED ALOT ABOUT WALKER HISTORY THAT I COULDN'T HAVE LEARNED ANY WHERE ELSE. JUST WANTED TO THANK YOU.

---

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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: In my heart Eureka Springs
Posts: 1161

quote:

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Originally posted by Knox
Its because of WHO is pushing this litter...= Mr. Hopkins

He has been away from it so long and being the former owner of the GREAT Lipper has some (including me ) fired up...........I am looking forward to see what this litter does....................Tim

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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: In my heart Eureka Springs
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quote:

---

Originally posted by DANNY RAMEY
SO WHAT WAS HOUSE'S QUEEN OUT OF ?I KNOW MR. HOPKINS SAID HE DIDN'T HUNT FEMALES SO I'M GUESSING SOMEONE ELSE DID BREEDING FOR THEM? I'M MEAN OTHER THAN THAT YOU MAINLY ONLY HEAR OF A HOUSE'S MALE DOGS WHAT WAS SOME MORE FEMALES THAT WE'RE OWNED BY HOUSE AND MR. HOPKINS.

---

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Weyers Cave Va
Posts: 13408

So instead of Lipper Strain why not call them Hopkins bred?

I don't want to be taken as someone being negative I'm just asking questions.

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: s.c.
Posts: 6984

This is more of a question than a statement. My first was a grandpup off Houses Bawlie. That was a long time before tracking systems became common. Go Yonder, staight liners wouldn't have lasted long and wouldn't have been wanted. But I understand that Lipper was an Independant dog in a different way. The "complaint" if you will, from people that hunted against Lipper and his first generation offspring was that other dogs would be working a good ways off and Lipper would fall treed 50 to 100 yards away from the cast people and have a coon. Evidently he was independent as far as other dogs and a lay up artist. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Nothing wrong with an independant dog that can tree one at your feet but there is plenty wrong with an independent dog that thinks he has to get out of hearing to start hunting. So how is the dam of this litter geared up to hunt? Just the semen can't fix all the problems in the Walkers. It sure would be nice to have some old frozen eggs as well.

I hope this turns out to be a great litter!

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Don,
Keep it going. Finally something somewhat interesting to read on here. I'm not a "Lipper" man, but you almost can't get away from it. Lipper shows up in several of today's Walker hounds. I've never sought out to get any Lipper blood, but his blood is in every hound we got in the kennel.

Hobo,
Now I was just a kid in Lipper's hey day but from my perspective, there are several folks that love House blood but don't or didn't seek out to stack up Lipper. I know Tom Hopkin's owned Lipper at a time, but I believe a few other guys owned and promoted Lipper for a time too. I don't think anyone was after "Hopkin's" blood dogs, as they were simply after Lipper. Joe House on the other hand promoted a line or family of dogs for years. There are several that did seek out to get dogs from him, Lipper bred or not. No offense to any of the above mentioned, just kind of how I see it. What do I know, I wasn't even shaving yet when Lipper was in his prime.

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Registered: Jan 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Posts: 589

I wish them luck!

you get a Lipper dog that will tree and you'll have a good one

Hope they used that semen on a Sackett Jr bred bitch.. Odds will go way up..

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Los Angeles, MN
Posts: 4236

Has any one dog put more pups on the ground than Lipper?

Im not sure, but the number 7,000 sticks in my mind.

I would think with that kind of sampling, he has done evrything he is gonna do.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 2154

quote:

---

Originally posted by Larry Hall
I wish them luck!

you get a Lipper dog that will tree and you'll have a good one

Hope they used that semen on a Sackett Jr bred bitch.. Odds will go way up..

---

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: ga
Posts: 249

TO BAD THEY DON'T HAVE QUEENS EGGS FROZEN THAT WOULD REALLY BE AWESOME TO REPRODUCE THE SAME EXACT LITTER 26 YEARS LATER AND TO THINK OTHER BREEDS BREEDERS HAVE A PROBLEM WITH A SINGLE REGISTERED HOUND. I THINK THIS WILL BE INTERESTING IN ANYWAY THEY'LL BE TWO SIDES ONES THAT WANT ONE AND ONES THAT ARE JEALOUS BECAUSE THEIR NOT A PART OF IT. PERSONALLY I DON'T SEE GIVING THAT KIND OF MONEY FOR A PUP.

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: OKLA
Posts: 1132

quote:

---

Originally posted by HistoryNutt
Okay before I start let me do a disclaimer.

"Okay your House freaks said with a smile, the information I am going to post here and in later posts is in NO WAY meant to take anything away from Joe House and the important part he had on the breed. It is not meant to diminish his importance or to bash him in anyway. It is also not meant to give more credit then what is due.

To talk about a strain we will need a fountain head for that strain. I would think that HOUSE'S QUEEN would be considered the Fountain Head of the House's Strain.

Let's start with HOUSE'S TOM TOM. Would most consider him a House Bred Hound? Tom Tom was out of Kaw River Chief and Tinsley's Kansas Tess.

Kaw River Chief was out of House's Chief and Johnson's Kansas Rose.

House's Chief was out of Johnson's Banjo and House's Queen.

Kansas Rose was out of Staley's Paducah Chief and Hershberger's Kansas Sally.

Tom Tom's mother Tinsley's Kansas Tess was out of Bun's Jack and Tinsley's Kansas Jane. What many may not realize is that there was another Tinsley's Kansas Tess that had as much if not more impact then Tom Tom's mother Tess. The original Tinsley's Kansas Tess is in Tom's mother background numerous times. She was out of Mack Twain and a female out of Indiana Boone Boy and Forrester's Sue. Her mother was a litter mate to Forrester's Bell, Motley's Mo. Major's mother.

So House's Tom Tom's mother goes back to Mack Twain at least 3 times, Indiana Boone Boy at least 4 times, Forrester's Sue at least 4 time, Motley's Mo. Major, Merchant's Bawlie, Hershberger's Little Butch.

Tom Tom's Daddy Kaw River Chief as stated goes back to Johnson's Banjo and House's Queen. But in all fairness if you was going to call Tom Tom as House Bred because of his Grandfather's mother, couldn't you also make the argument he is Banjo bred?

Tom Tom's grand pa is House's Chief. That is the only place you get House and since Chief was out of Banjo why not Banjo bred?

Kaw River Chief's mother Kansas Rose goes back to Nance's Joe Williams, Mack Twain, Hershberger's Okla. Spot, Hershberger's Texas Babe, Indians Boone Boy, Forrester's Sue, White River Boone at least 2 times, and Hershberger's Spot Jr.

So there you have it for the most part. What strain is Tom Tom?

---

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: ga
Posts: 249

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT BIG HUNTS LIPPER WON BACK IN THE DAY A.O,OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT?

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Registered: Dec 2008
Location: S.W. Wisc.
Posts: 734

I hope they turn out , but if they do, Wouldn't it mean that 30 years of selective breeding since has failed? If properly bred, wouldn't offspring be as good as or better than the foundation stock. Just wondering out loud.

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Registered: Jan 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Posts: 589

I think we are on the same page Honalieh

Lipper was a very nice hound i believe and had owners and handlers that promoted and marketed him very well..

You can't hardly find a walker dog alive today that hasn't got him somewhere in the pedigree.


I believe these folks will promote and market a new stud off the old dog and do a great job of it..

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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Superstition Mtns., AZ
Posts: 1166

Somewhere around here I have a letter givem to me by a buddy and it was writen by the guy who raised Lipper from a pup and he tells how he raised him and what kind of dog he was as a pup. It's a neat thing to have if I could just find it. I know I'm not the only person who has a copy of this. Does any one else have this letter. Maybe someone could post it for others to read.

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: s.c.
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quote:

---

Originally posted by Diggerman
I hope they turn out , but if they do, Wouldn't it mean that 30 years of selective breeding since has failed? If properly bred, wouldn't offspring be as good as or better than the foundation stock. Just wondering out loud.

---

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Registered: Apr 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 435

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dan McDonough
Somewhere around here I have a letter givem to me by a buddy and it was writen by the guy who raised Lipper from a pup and he tells how he raised him and what kind of dog he was as a pup. It's a neat thing to have if I could just find it. I know I'm not the only person who has a copy of this. Does any one else have this letter. Maybe someone could post it for others to read.

---

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: OKLA
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quote:

---

Originally posted by Diggerman
I hope they turn out , but if they do, Wouldn't it mean that 30 years of selective breeding since has failed? If properly bred, wouldn't offspring be as good as or better than the foundation stock. Just wondering out loud.

---

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Registered: Sep 2009
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quote:

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Originally posted by pigsit
I guesss that would depend on whose breeding program you were looking at. Tom

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