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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9041

quote:
Originally posted by ole hoss
How would one go about making one bark, Iíve shut a few up in my time but never been able to make one bark




Ameture lol.



Tar

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Old Post 07-03-2019 07:15 PM
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Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 689

Re: I had the honor--

quote:
Originally posted by OLD TIMER
of meeting Lou Holtz when he was coaching the MN Gophers and he said

"You can Coach someone with natural talent, but you can't teach it."




I agree...

As a coach or handler we have to learn to read the player or the dog...and we coach according to what we believe is best at that moment and also for the overall playing time for the player and hunting time for the dog...want to and desire goes a long ways for all involved including the coach...there is no doubt Joe Gibbs is a great coach...

Some have said practice makes perfect...other say perfect practice makes perfect...

I remember years ago when the Chicago Bears were having a bad season and before the had their winning streak...I was flipping through the channels and they were playing another team and they were losing by quite a bit and there was about 2 minutes left in the game...no way the Bears could win...but I saw something I will never forget...That was the first time I saw him...Walter Payton was running back and he was carrying the ball...he was giving all he had on each play...he was playing like he was in the Super Bowl and behind 2 points and he as fighting to get in good field goal range or better yet score a touchdown...IMO he was one of the greatest football players of all time...and I also believe he was one of the greatest human beings that lived...I say this because he had a liver disease and needed a liver...if he didnít get one soon he surely would die soon...he was on the waiting list to get one...the interviewer on the TV said...Walter, you are famous...have plenty of money...you can get a liver transplant now...you can go to the font of the line...with tears in his eye he replied...everyone else on the waiting list is just as important as I am... I will wait my turn...a few months later he passed away...

Natural born ability is the was to go...natural born enthusiasm and desire goes hand in hand...a great coach sees it and takes it to a higher level...the coach has the same natural abilities for coaching...

__________________
Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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Old Post 07-03-2019 08:03 PM
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Reuben
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Freeport,TX
Posts: 689

Re: I had the honor--

quote:
Originally posted by OLD TIMER
of meeting Lou Holtz when he was coaching the MN Gophers and he said

"You can Coach someone with natural talent, but you can't teach it."




I agree...

As a coach or handler we have to learn to read the player or the dog...and we coach according to what we believe is best at that moment and also for the overall playing time for the player and hunting time for the dog...want to and desire goes a long ways for all involved including the coach...there is no doubt Joe Gibbs is a great coach...

Some have said practice makes perfect...other say perfect practice makes perfect...

I remember years ago when the Chicago Bears were having a bad season and before the had their winning streak...I was flipping through the channels and they were playing another team and they were losing by quite a bit and there was about 2 minutes left in the game...no way the Bears could win...but I saw something I will never forget...That was the first time I saw him...Walter Payton was running back and he was carrying the ball...he was giving all he had on each play...he was playing like he was in the Super Bowl and behind 2 points and he as fighting to get in good field goal range or better yet score a touchdown...IMO he was one of the greatest football players of all time...and I also believe he was one of the greatest human beings that lived...I say this because he had a liver disease and needed a liver...if he didnít get one soon he surely would die soon...he was on the waiting list to get one...the interviewer on the TV said...Walter, you are famous...have plenty of money...you can get a liver transplant now...you can go to the font of the line...with tears in his eye he replied...everyone else on the waiting list is just as important as I am... I will wait my turn...a few months later he passed away...

Natural born ability is the was to go...natural born enthusiasm and desire goes hand in hand...a great coach sees it and takes it to a higher level...the coach has the same natural abilities for coaching...

__________________
Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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Old Post 07-03-2019 08:03 PM
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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9041

Anybody that donít know the difference in a good honest natural coon treeing dog and a man made dog ainít been out much.


Tar

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Old Post 07-04-2019 01:05 AM
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CHEWBACH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2007
Location: monroeville OH
Posts: 2440

with you Tar! or those folks just hasn't walked behind a natural yet ! they just thank they have. walk behind one you will realize how its suppose to be done.

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Old Post 07-04-2019 01:46 AM
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SEMO
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2005
Location:
Posts: 277

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
Let me refrase that they teach them to do things that are not natural traits. Like bumping them past coons with the E collar so they only get the deep ones. Teaching to rattle non stop never shutting up to go get that deep coon. Cmon Cory you know what I am talken bout lol.


Tar



How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks

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Old Post 07-06-2019 03:55 AM
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SEMO
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2005
Location:
Posts: 277

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
Let me refrase that they teach them to do things that are not natural traits. Like bumping them past coons with the E collar so they only get the deep ones. Teaching to rattle non stop never shutting up to go get that deep coon. Cmon Cory you know what I am talken bout lol.


Tar



How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks

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Old Post 07-06-2019 03:55 AM
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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 3919

quote:
Originally posted by SEMO
How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks


There are enough of them that do it no one else needs to try and teach.

__________________
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Seneca , MO
(417)317-4815
GRNITECH PKC SCH REDNECK MAFIA
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2014 OK STATE CH, 2015 MO PKC LEADER, 2016 PKC NATIONALS SEMI-FINALIST. 2016 UKC TOP 20. 2O17 UKC WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 3RD PLACE. 2018 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4. 2018 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION
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Old Post 07-06-2019 04:09 AM
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DL NH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
Posts: 162

There's something else that the great ones have besides talent and that is guts and grit! Seen a few very talented hounds that lacked in the guts and grit dept. get showed up by hounds that had the extra fire it took to finish the job.

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Old Post 07-06-2019 05:30 AM
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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9041

quote:
Originally posted by SEMO
How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks




Ole hoss said he made um shut up ! Well then just do the opposite! Hold um back pat their sides out with the genetics we got today plus give them the go go juice and vvvvvvvwalah you got a babbler.

Tar

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Old Post 07-06-2019 07:46 AM
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Team Mafia 2
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2018
Location:
Posts: 80

quote:
Originally posted by SEMO
How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks


I can make em babble I can make em silent I can also make a dog thatís getting ran off of trees mean as a snake. You just have to get creative. The only thing I donít like to do is make a covering type dog a loaner all youíll end up with is a jealous tree leaving POS.

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Old Post 07-07-2019 03:27 AM
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thomasg
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
Posts: 1023

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
A man made dog has to be smart to be trainable. They also have to be eager to please their master. A lot of those naturals are crazy and won't pay a bit of attention to their handler. A lot of those man made dogs are not counterfeits. An intelligent, eager to please, trainable dog in the right hands can be molded into a dog that is hard to beat.
back in the 80s i had a man made coon treeing machine ,fur was at a all time high ,hounds even pups were selling for more than a 15 year old kid could afford . so i used the only dog that i had to work with at the time , a full blooded border collie , put 54 hides in the freezer with him his first season in 2 weeks , ralph hated coon and was eager to please his master , it was a job skinning and carrying the fur he put up ,

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Old Post 07-08-2019 01:34 AM
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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9041

Dogs today are one dimensional ( man made ) excel at their kind of coon. Back in the day dogs took them as they came to them not culling tracks if the coons were not down they treed them layup those traits have been bred out.


Tar

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Old Post 07-08-2019 02:50 PM
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Sgraves
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2017
Location:
Posts: 129

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
Dogs today are one dimensional ( man made ) excel at their kind of coon. Back in the day dogs took them as they came to them not culling tracks if the coons were not down they treed them layup those traits have been bred out.


Tar

Tar , I know itís a personal preference. You used to hear the phrase meat dog an competition dog. The old folks would use that phrase quite often. They didnít like the competition kind. We used to walk hunt our dogs . Cast them an they would hunt out 5 to 6 hundred yards an make a circle an come back. Go the other direction an do the same thing. They didnít strick nothing we would walk on. Dogs hunted with you . Kinda got away from that. Now we want to cast them , sit on tailgate an let them go as far as need be. Again, itís all in what a man wants. Kinda believe now a dog learns to just run until it finds a easy coon to tree. We have took away the things that make a dog.

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Old Post 07-08-2019 03:49 PM
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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9041

I still send mine from the tailgate but they donít cull their tracks they get treed I ainít in no hurry to get to them. I think people that hurry to trees cause a dog to commit on trees they normally wouldnít.


But a dog does have to hustle here to strike a coon sometimes.



Tar

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Old Post 07-08-2019 05:08 PM
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Larry Atherton
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Central Michigan
Posts: 6479

quote:
Originally posted by SEMO
How do you teach one to rattle non stop, I can stop or slow it down if he naturally does it but if hes a last strike dog I've never figured how to
make him bark non stop.

The closest I ever saw was Ole Elvis Attack doing his tricks I believe he would speak, shake hands and play dead.

Please tell me how you teach one to Babble?

Thanks



It is easy. I have seen it in both beagles and coon hounds. Hunt them as young puppies with their mother. Make sure they can't keep up with her. Not only will they bark, they will learn to run dogs. By that I mean literally track the other dogs.

I have known people who actually did the above to achieve a first strike dog. They actually did it over many generations.

PS I in no way condone that behavior.

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Old Post 07-08-2019 07:46 PM
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DL NH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
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Is it any wonder the gene pools get watered down with junk? No true hound man or woman would knowingly breed junk like that. No matter what type of hunting dog you can think of, other than possibly bear or hog dogs, before it receives any degree period ought to have to prove it can satisfactorily produce game in the WILD SOLO!

Actually it might not be a bad idea if they had to prove that before they could be entered into competition hunts where points towards a degree are awarded.

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Old Post 07-09-2019 02:41 AM
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Mike Van Dusen
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Registered: Mar 2004
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Posts: 1456

I like a pup to know a lot when they start,you can tell rite from the start if they have" it ".... or not.

Ray Charles can see the "it factor",them are the ones I am lookin for...and I have never seen a dumb one have the "it ".

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Old Post 07-10-2019 12:34 AM
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DL NH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
Posts: 162

"It" factor......

Please share more about the "It" factor. I've been hunting hounds for a long time and still haven't learned it all, so please give some specifics. Sure others would benefit as well.

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Old Post 07-10-2019 02:44 AM
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2ol2hunt
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Posts: 547

The short answer is the "it factor" is intelligence or coon sense.

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Old Post 07-10-2019 03:22 AM
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DL NH
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Guess my short answer would be it's all in the inheritance.........of which intelligence plays an important roll.

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Old Post 07-10-2019 03:32 AM
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Redneck Mafia
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Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 3919

Re: "It" factor......

quote:
Originally posted by DL NH
Please share more about the "It" factor. I've been hunting hounds for a long time and still haven't learned it all, so please give some specifics. Sure others would benefit as well.

Most wouldn't recognize it if it snuck up and bit them they give up on pups full of fire or ruin them with a shocker at a young age.

__________________
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Seneca , MO
(417)317-4815
GRNITECH PKC SCH REDNECK MAFIA
GRCH GRNITECH PKC GCH REDNECK BACKWOODS SHACK
2014 OK STATE CH, 2015 MO PKC LEADER, 2016 PKC NATIONALS SEMI-FINALIST. 2016 UKC TOP 20. 2O17 UKC WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP 3RD PLACE. 2018 PKC SENIOR SHOWDOWN TRUCK HUNT FINAL 4. 2018 MO PKC STATE CHAMPION
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Old Post 07-10-2019 04:19 AM
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DL NH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
Posts: 162

Re: Re: "It" factor......

quote:
Originally posted by Redneck Mafia
Most wouldn't recognize it if it snuck up and bit them they give up on pups full of fire or ruin them with a shocker at a young age.


Thank you. In a day and age where instant gratification is demanded more and more it can be easily forgotten that our hounds are not programmable machines............and thankfully so! Else the hope and mystique of what the next one will be would be removed completely!

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Old Post 07-10-2019 07:25 AM
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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 17074

I had a dog with "coon sense" once. When you turned him loose he went looking for a coon. He seemed to just know where they were. Up North in thick coon and patch woods, he would just go from one tree to the next and tree every coon in the woods. My buddies called him the Census Taker. I just called him Mongo Red.

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Old Post 07-10-2019 01:25 PM
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2ol2hunt
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: north ala.
Posts: 547

They seem to know where the food source is , where the closest water is and how the Coons are moving and ECT.ect.even in unfamiliar territory....... THEY JUST KNOW!!! And these kind of dogs are always extremely accurate!!

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