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Richard Lambert
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22462

Re: Re: Re: Rules

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
....These rules we got are just outdated they are not sufficient for the style of dogs we are hunting against...Tar

So, you think that we should change our rules to suit their style of dogs? Why don't we keep our rules to suit our style of dogs and they can change their style of dog to suit our rules.

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06-29-2019 01:19 PM

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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Re: Re: Re: Re: Rules

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
So, you think that we should change our rules to suit their style of dogs? Why don't we keep our rules to suit our style of dogs and they can change their style of dog to suit our rules.

If you like loosing leave our rules the same. Those boys that are coming to win that big $$$ make their living coonhunting they don’t mind a bit hurting your feelers so you quit and go to the truck. And they don’t mind sending you there on a technicality either.

Tarbaby

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06-29-2019 01:29 PM

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micooner
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: milan,mi
Posts: 1378

Re: Re: Rules

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Because most of the time when you eliminate one loophole you create another. A dishonest handler is going to find a way to use any rule to his advantage. Get rid of the dishonest handlers and you don't have to worry about the rules.

Jen, Cheyenne has been comp hunting for a long long long time. Ask him how many times his dog has been scratched for fighting when the judge/cast did not see the fight.
Ask him how many times his dog has been minused for off game when the judge/cast did not see the deer/fox/coyote.

when one registry gets rid of the dishonest handlers and owners they just move on to the next registry that welcomes them with open arms. It will never happen in my lifetime but if your barred in one registry you can't compete in another one. Case closed.

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06-29-2019 04:22 PM

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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Re: Re: Re: Rules

quote:
Originally posted by micooner
when one registry gets rid of the dishonest handlers and owners they just move on to the next registry that welcomes them with open arms. It will never happen in my lifetime but if your barred in one registry you can't compete in another one. Case closed.

If your teacher told you you could take an open book test would you refuse ? The bench show judge and moh is an open book test and people still flunk and when they do pass we put them behind the desk to try and keep pro handlers strait hmmmm . Those handlers use the rules and loopholes in a manner to where the moh has no choice but to give them the decition!! Right now we are trying to close those loopholes and adjust the rules to eliminate that before the big purses hit. Us old doggies are not going to be paying the bills much longer the younger ones want to hunt for money. Ukc has to adapt to appeal to their customers. We should support them in their decisions we had our time.

Tar

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06-30-2019 12:29 AM

Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5637

Tar

Lol. Open book tests and still some fail, this just might be the problem as to why so many MOH rule different on the same question. I question how anyone can really know the rules under such a system, if you really learn something, you DO NOT need an open book to pass the tests. In all my years of college, I do not recall ever getting an open book test, we were required to learn the subject matter. Big difference in really knowing something and just being familiar with a subject matter. Maybe they think coonhunter are not very smart, and they may just be right! Lol. Dave

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07-01-2019 04:19 AM

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Pat Bizich
Banned

Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1278

Exactly. It is crazy. I know a guy that was a regular as a hunt director. He took the MOH test. He had copied it before mailing in for processing. He asked me to look it over to see how many he may have missed. Not positive how many questions are currently on there but I lost count at some where around 20 missed questions and had not finished reading his test. And this is an open book test.

All of us sometimes will get brain freeze . But when a question comes in and you aren't sure of the answer . I will guarantee just about every question you need an answer to is in the Advisor some where.
Just fess up, admit you need to take 5 and verify your decision. Every one will go home at least satisfied the ruling was correct.

As to rule changes.
I liken them to advocates for stronger guns laws.
It is not that we need better stronger (laws) rules.
Rather the ones we have need to be better followed and enforced correctly.

__________________
IT SEEMS THAT EVERYTIME A BREED OR LINE OF DOGS GET POPULAR IT EVENTUALLY LEADS TO ITS RUINATION BY UNINFORMED PEOPLE BREEDING WITHOUT DOING THEIR RESEARCH FIRST.

Gone but never forgotten:
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One of kind and would make a believer out of you when you thought there were no coon left
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Last edited by Pat Bizich on 07-01-2019 at 11:58 PM

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07-01-2019 11:28 PM

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Moderator

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 5823

quote:
Originally posted by Pat Bizich

As to rule changes.
I liken them to advocates for stronger guns laws.
It is not that we need better stronger (laws) rules.
Rather the ones we have need to be better followed and enforced correctly.

Several rule changes are to get rid of some rules; squalling, point value clarification, a minus rule that can't be used under current timeout rules. One to quite circling dogs on off game if they came in late. Specific language on 3 scratchable offenses.
What many don't realize is that if rules don't change they will be packing a knife to a gun fight. Many of our youth and new comers are already in this predicament.
If loopholes are closed some offenses are gotten rid of their will be no need for newbies to have to read years of advisors that they can't even find on the internet along with unclear rules. Clear concrete rules are what many of the changes are about and removing the ability of the unscrupulous judge/handlers ability of scratching opponents at will or for petty mistakes.

__________________
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Seneca , MO
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07-02-2019 03:11 AM

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100%hunter
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2014
Location:
Posts: 162

ukc hunt, four dogs are cast three dogs leave out one dose not it mills around for close to a min. handler gets dog by the collar and cast dog again what's the rule?

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07-02-2019 03:51 AM

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Sgraves
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2017
Location:
Posts: 340

I want a dog to stay put while treeing. Has anyone ever been minused for their dog coming off tree , putting nose to ground an going right back to treeing? I haven’t, but have seen others get minused. Judge said dog quit treeing an showed signs of trailing. We voted on it. I said no minus . I can see if dog putting nose to ground an opening his mouth would be considered trailing. Seems like another way to get over on somebody.

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07-02-2019 11:48 AM

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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Re: ?

quote:
Originally posted by 100%hunter
ukc hunt, four dogs are cast three dogs leave out one dose not it mills around for close to a min. handler gets dog by the collar and cast dog again what's the rule?

6T scratching offenses.

Tar

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07-02-2019 12:18 PM

Pat Bizich
Banned

Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1278

quote:
Originally posted by Sgraves
I want a dog to stay put while treeing. Has anyone ever been minused for their dog coming off tree , putting nose to ground an going right back to treeing? I haven’t, but have seen others get minused. Judge said dog quit treeing an showed signs of trailing. We voted on it. I said no minus . I can see if dog putting nose to ground an opening his mouth would be considered trailing. Seems like another way to get over on somebody.

I have seen this a lot
I use to do a lot of non hunting judge casts before rule changes. And a lot of guys would try to influence me to minus those dogs. I try to be fair in determining those situations.
Many think that dog has to have their feet up on the tree and want to minus a dog for even getting down and split second nose on the ground.
I listen going into trees. Say a 4 dog cast and whole time going into tree you only hear 3. I will stop occasionally and remind only 3 are on that tree , I tell the owner If we get to the tree and that 4th is milling I will be minus it.
But if I hear all 4 treeing whole time and I get there and 1 got off and stuck its nose down and goes right back I will not even consider minus for it.
Then you got the ones that refuse to minus their own dog for "anything." On a cast another hunting judges dog was over 50 yards off the tree with its nose down smelling around in a field. Now that is a bit much. He refused to minus it.

Just like dogs striking at your casting. Or you accidently walk into a track dogs are working. Common sense , and fairness. I "WILL NOT'' minus a dog for coming back through as long as it appears to be attempting to run a trail. It has to stop and stand around for more then just a few seconds . They are dogs use some sense.
Guys start hollering minus that dog. Too wrapped up trying to beat you instead of what is really right or wrong.

Or the guys that pretend to be looking for the coon knowing full well they will get beat if the tree is plus.
I was on a cast once with a guy that was absolutely unreal how fast he could find a coon. It was down right unbelievable crazy.
He was standing there shining and had not moved for a good while. I figured he would say if he saw it.What ever made me go over there. He says who had first tree. I told him. He repeated the question. Again I told him. He shined to a spot and said right there is the coon. Mind you the tree only had a few minutes left.
Disagree or agree that is my way when I am carrying the card .
As the title says "H-O-N-O-R" rules.
I have seen a lot. Won't say all . Because there is always something different some one tries to pull.

Last edited by Pat Bizich on 07-02-2019 at 03:55 PM

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