Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 6168

I am interested in opinions from folks on here...

I have a buddy that has a young dog that seems to potter around when you turn it loose, seems that every drop this pup will toddle off a couple hundred yards at most, and get treed...have a coon every time it looks up...good tree dog, good tree manners...but just lacks that "burning desire" to get gone and get that same coon treed.

Anybody ever have one similar that turned into a fired up, bust a hole in the dark, get hooked type of dog?

I'm not talking about going a mile or more to get "alone"....I've had those dogs that run past five coon to tree one "deep and lonely"....

What advice can I offer my buddy...I have never had one that didn't twist and spin on the lead strap wanting to go hunting.

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Muskogee, Oklahoma
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Hey Joe how's it going? He could try this: shoot several out but don't let him have any. Let him get within inches but hold him back. Obviously you won't be able to recast in that section and if you're carrying them back to the truck that won't work either.
But if you pull him off several coon that he can't get to and drive him to the next spot right away he still should be fired up, and eventually should start to bust in there.
If you kill and let him have the ones that he drives in hard after and tie him back on the "lazy" one he should figure it out pretty quickly. It has worked for me in the past.
It might lead to a few other minor issues but they can be worked thru as well.

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Registered: Jun 2008
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Joe,

Does the dog act the same with company? Or has he only hunted it by itself?

As you know, sometimes competition makes all the difference.

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i like to cut them across open fields make them go hunting

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Registered: Dec 2003
Location: Willard Oh.
Posts: 1239

turning across fields is the best, and to really fire one up you can run some long drag tracks with 3-4 other dogs, that usually will put the competitive edge on them. I got one now when he was 7-8 months old by himself would do about the same and now at 14 months he will hustle through the country until he finds one, what I like of him is he is calm at the box and has brains as to know when I say "dead coon" whether I shoot one or not he knows that tree is done and its time to find another!

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a few turn on and get fired up more with hunting and age......but most that don't have it at the start never will imo.

ive found it a lot easier to turn down the wild ones than it is to turn up the lazy ones..........just speaking from personal experience

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Registered: Mar 2008
Location: LaPorte IN
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quote:

---

Originally posted by Oak Ridge
I am interested in opinions from folks on here...

I have a buddy that has a young dog that seems to potter around when you turn it loose, seems that every drop this pup will toddle off a couple hundred yards at most, and get treed...have a coon every time it looks up...good tree dog, good tree manners...but just lacks that "burning desire" to get gone and get that same coon treed.

Anybody ever have one similar that turned into a fired up, bust a hole in the dark, get hooked type of dog?

I'm not talking about going a mile or more to get "alone"....I've had those dogs that run past five coon to tree one "deep and lonely"....

What advice can I offer my buddy...I have never had one that didn't twist and spin on the lead strap wanting to go hunting.

---

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Registered: Mar 2008
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I got one like that and i wouldnt change her, if i hunt her with company she leaves like she was shot outta a cannon but when its just her and me she looks to me for direction cause i like to walk hunt. Those kind tree alot of coon close.

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Registered: Jun 2003
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I have the best idea on here.





SELL HIM TO ME!!!!!!!

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Registered: Dec 2005
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90% of coon hunters walk under more coon than they will ever tree without realizing it . With that being said there's no reason to have one go a mile to get treed . Fred bear goes too deep for my likening sometimes , but trees them around me as well . I don't want a dog to shoot past coon that another dog may come along and tree and beat him in a hunt .

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[QUOTE]Originally posted by buck brush
why would you want to change it if it is getting treed with a coon, i call that hunting as soon as you turn it lose, not running past coon just to throw mud in your face. i bet when it is toddaling off its nose is hunting a track. [/QUOTE

Have to agree with this. Let all the big running dogs blow past and tree behind them. If he doesn't like him, let me know, I bet I would like him!

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 6168

Thanks to everyone that has offered ideas....

To those that responded "don't change it".... Maybe I'm not painting the picture correctly. I've been following dogs for well over 40 years, and I know the difference between a dog that starts hunting as soon as you turn it loose, and one that is simply goofing off, standing around, and wasting time.


This dog will race across a field, get to the woods, then turn around and RACE BACK.... wait for you to start walking to the woods, then race back to the woods, and meet you again as you get half way...plays see saw two or three times. Once you get to the woods, you either have to walk it, or set down on a stump and "wait it out". Eventually it gets bored with you and goes hunting, but isn't hunting hard....it has as much raw coon treeing talent that I've seen in a young dog in a long time, but just doesn't give the impression that it is eaten up with desire to get a coon treed.

If we could develop the desire, this dog would have it all...but it's the ten minutes this dogs wastes goofing off, not hunting that is driving us nuts....

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from my experience these kind rarely or never change and waste a lot of time.

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Registered: May 2008
Location: Gillett, Pa
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to me this is the fix but takes time and effort every time this dog comes in catch it and put it up layup 2-3 nights repeat within a month you will see a huge change but watch what you wish for or you could try the boot to the butt get gone routine as no 2 dogs are the same !temperament of dog as to which method I would try first is the real question ?

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Registered: May 2012
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How old is this dog? You said he was a young dog.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Talala, Oklahoma
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There are two things you can't do much to improve in a dog, in my experience.

Desire and brains.

It sounds like a hound somebody would love to own, just not somebody that wants a hustling type hound.

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Registered: Mar 2008
Location: LaPorte IN
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well i have followed dogs for going on 60 years and i have seen this kind before, that is why i have a rubber hose on my side i would let him know i did not want him around me.
on your first post you did not state all that he was doing, now this is a different, he seems like he is lazy or he wants to be your friend, let him know you do not want him standing around.

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How old is this dog? Might try taking it and leaving it in the box for a few dumps knocking coon out to the other dogs.

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How old is it?

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GUYS I KNOW THAT JOE HAS ASKED FOR YOUR OPINIONS ABOUT THIS DOG BUT DO YOU REALLY KNOW WHO YOU ARE TALKING TO?

JOE NEWLIN IS ONE OF THE TOP10 BREEDERS AND TRAINERS IN THE WORLD TODAY.

I AM SURE HE HAS TRIED 80% OR MORE OF THE SUGGESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN GIVEN IN GOOD FAITH AND ALL WILL WORK ON SOME DOGS.

I HAVE BEEN COON HUNTING 50 YEARS AND WOULD NOT TRY TO GIVE ADVICE ON THIS SUBJECT FOR SHOULD THIS BE A CLOVER DOG IT MIGHT BE IMPOSSIBLE TO CORRECT FOR I HAD A SIMLIAR PROBLEM WITH TWO CLOVER DOGS.

JUST A SHORT PARAGRAPH TO EXPLAIN IN THE MOUNTAINS YOU USUALLY HAVE TO DRIVE UP HOLLOWS OR UP GRAVEL ROADS TO GET TO YOUR HUNTING SPOTS AND IF YOU PASSED A COON ON THE WAY BOTH DOGS WOULD BARK A FEW BARKS EVEN WITH SHOCK COLLARS ON AND WHEN YOU TURNED OUT WOULD GO BACK TO WHERE THEY SMELLED THAT COON AND TREE IT INSTEAD OF HUNTING IN FRONT OF YOU AND LIKE D.WILSON SAID MORE COONS WITHIN 150-200 YARDS AROUND YOU THAN 800 YARDS AWAY.
IMO TOO MANY BEE LINE HUNTERS THAT GET TREED WITH A COON BUT PASS UP MANY COON IN DOING SO BUT YOUNGER GUYS PAY NO ATTENTION TO THAT BUT AS YOU GET OLDER YOU DON'T WANT YOUR DOG PASSING UP ANY COONS SHORTER DISTANCE TO TREE THE BETTER YOU LIKE IT.LOL.

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so why did he ask is he trying to trick us ,

quote:

---

Originally posted by Carl Fox
GUYS I KNOW THAT JOE HAS ASKED FOR YOUR OPINIONS ABOUT THIS DOG BUT DO YOU REALLY KNOW WHO YOU ARE TALKING TO?

JOE NEWLIN IS ONE OF THE TOP10 BREEDERS AND TRAINERS IN THE WORLD TODAY.

I AM SURE HE HAS TRIED 80% OR MORE OF THE SUGGESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN GIVEN IN GOOD FAITH AND ALL WILL WORK ON SOME DOGS.

I HAVE BEEN COON HUNTING 50 YEARS AND WOULD NOT TRY TO GIVE ADVICE ON THIS SUBJECT FOR SHOULD THIS BE A CLOVER DOG IT MIGHT BE IMPOSSIBLE TO CORRECT FOR I HAD A SIMLIAR PROBLEM WITH TWO CLOVER DOGS.

JUST A SHORT PARAGRAPH TO EXPLAIN IN THE MOUNTAINS YOU USUALLY HAVE TO DRIVE UP HOLLOWS OR UP GRAVEL ROADS TO GET TO YOUR HUNTING SPOTS AND IF YOU PASSED A COON ON THE WAY BOTH DOGS WOULD BARK A FEW BARKS EVEN WITH SHOCK COLLARS ON AND WHEN YOU TURNED OUT WOULD GO BACK TO WHERE THEY SMELLED THAT COON AND TREE IT INSTEAD OF HUNTING IN FRONT OF YOU AND LIKE D.WILSON SAID MORE COONS WITHIN 150-200 YARDS AROUND YOU THAN 800 YARDS AWAY.
IMO TOO MANY BEE LINE HUNTERS THAT GET TREED WITH A COON BUT PASS UP MANY COON IN DOING SO BUT YOUNGER GUYS PAY NO ATTENTION TO THAT BUT AS YOU GET OLDER YOU DON'T WANT YOUR DOG PASSING UP ANY COONS SHORTER DISTANCE TO TREE THE BETTER YOU LIKE IT.LOL.

---

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Registered: Aug 2008
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Well Joe I will offer my two cents as well. Since this is a young dog, the good thing is that you have time on your side.

I say just keep hunting him by himself as much as possible. Set him up so that he can get struck within the initial distance that he usually runs out in front of you before he returns. Give him one coon out of every tree that he makes that has one in it. This will strengthen his desire to catch/kill a coon. As his desire to catch/kill strengthens so will his desire to immediately go to a coon track. Make it a fun game for him because the more fun he has the stronger his desire to please you will be.

Now this is not going to happen over night. This may very well take all of this season plus some of next spring. But once this pup starts to settle down and see that you actually want him to go find a coon, he will start hustling to the track and getting treed.

It sounds to me like this dog is loaded with natural talent but has no idea yet what you are wanting from him, he is simply still doing what feels good to him and does not yet realize he has a job to do.

One other thing that I have done with young dogs like this is, I carry a long switch and (every time) the dog comes running up to me when I don't want him too, I lightly switch his face and tell him to get gone. Then when he gets treed I praise him for about one minute on each tree. That will also help him to realize you are wanting him to go get treed. However when doing this switching, you must not strike him hard enough to hurt him but simply strike him hard enough to make it uncomfortable. He will eventually get the idea you don't want him returning to you.

I have read a lot of posts that say a dog doesn't need every coon, and there are some out there that do not. But there are also some out there that giving them every coon till they get it right sure helps with the frustration of training a young dog. Oh by the way Joe, I have been hunting coonhounds for over 45 years and I have never bought one, as I always raised and trained my own.

I say if you have the patients to stick with this dog, he will end up being a pretty nice hound. But only you know how much you can tolerate.

Good Luck with him.

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Registered: Jun 2003
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Joe forgot more before breakfast this morning than most of us will learn this year about hounds.

Of that I have no doubt.

He didn't really ask for training tips.

He asked if we had ever seen one like that change.

The older I get the less interested and motivated I am in trying to figure out ways to train dogs.

I am interested in getting my hands on the ones who are naturals.

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Registered: Jun 2006
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here is what I would try if it was my dog. Take the dog and tie him to the tail gate, then take a caged coon not ever letting it on the ground. Show the dog the coon and carry the coon across an open field and into a timber, then hang the coon in a tree low enuff he can wind it. Let a buddy turn the dog loose then after a few times leave him in the box and set the coon up a couple hrs ahead of time and just release the dog without him seeing you carry the coon to the woods.

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Joe - does it "goof off" when in company? To get to your original question, about experience with other dogs and whether they changed, I would need to know if they did the same when around others that didn't goof off.

I've had one that goofed off by themselves and matured out of it. But I've never had one, goof off, when others were throwing mud in our face.

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