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CONRAD FRYAR
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1621

You mean to tell me that with all the opinions on here the best we can do is blame it on the hunts? Where are all the breeding experts? I thought you guys might blame it on linebreeding
Or even the dreaded inbreeding, but we all know that's not the case. So lets hear it what is causing the hyper, motor mouthed, slick treeing, chain eating idiots?
It's quiet at my house and there's 6 hounds here. (no bark collars either

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yadkintar
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Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
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They are already building dogs to compete with the new rules we just got.


But I think it will be better you blow to deep to quick and sombody is going to clean up coons behind you.


They crack babies Conrad thyroid pills is like crack to a dog amongst the other stuff top winning dog of all time didn’t live two months after they took him off the dope. Withdraws killed him.


Tar

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CONRAD FRYAR
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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1621

I think it will help if we can pinpoint when we think it started to go down hill, And right now all I am dealing with is Accuracy? Anybody got sometime periods 😊

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wart
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Registered: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 416

Dogs

I saw a bigger difference in the early to mid nineties especially
o when the pup hunts started everyone wanted a 1 yr old treedog and we got em in bunches also this didn't just start in the last generation it started over 25 years ago .Also some are trying to sell pups not really breeding for the highest quality

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wart
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Dogs

I saw a bigger difference in the way to mid nineties especially when the pup hunts started everyone wanted a 1 yr old treedog and we got em in bunches

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yadkintar
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quote:
Originally posted by CONRAD FRYAR
I think it will help if we can pinpoint when we think it started to go down hill, And right now all I am dealing with is Accuracy? Anybody got sometime periods 😊



Conrad I guess you need to call me I keep telling you I don’t know if it’s because you got some of it in your dog or what your not listening. It wasent that good right off the nozzle I was right in the middle of it never even knew what all the fuss was about. 2 dogs caused it one started the bad kennel manners and accuracy issues. And the other was double bred him and they were double bad. To many fake titles. To much Hanky panky. And to much money won when the leaves was on made them look better on paper than what they were. And they sold a lot of pups when one out of a thousand finally won somthing big. Like Bruce said awhile back be carefull when you by a dog all it’s wins are at the same club and his wife was always the hunt director.

Tar


580-341-8060

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Bruce m. Conkey
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.

I think the 90’s is about right. Maybe 1995 to 2005.

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Bruce m. Conkey
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.

I think the 90’s is about right. Maybe 1995 to 2005.

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Bruce m. Conkey
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Location: Palatka, FL
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.

I think the 90’s is about right. Maybe 1995 to 2005. Let me throw a curve ball. I was thinking about the time period and my grown dogs and pups raised. My conclusion scared me. I have has some of my best grown dogs in the past 15 to 20 years. But at the same time. The nuttiest pups. Lol.

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CONRAD FRYAR
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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1621

Tar I am listening 😊 I can’t blame just one stud or two I blame breeders, each stud is like a tool in a tool box ,he throws certain traits, either you need the tool or you don’t.
I understand what you are saying about hype, it was ridiculous for a time period, and men bought into it.
The breeders that stood out linebred there line of dogs and certain traits stood out, then everyone decided to breed best to best, “winners” and things started going down hill, breed freaks that are extreme in there traits and balance goes out the door.

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Old Post 02-09-2020 01:22 AM
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yadkintar
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Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Conrad it might been a little earlier than Bruce but I trained for the public at that time and I hunted hard. This trait I am going to tell you about still shows up in that line today. When they are 15 months old nothing can beat them. Then shortly after they start missing coons it’s like they can’t go no further and they get wooded you can try and correct them and send them on but their done. If a dog goes to outrunning them on track they get wooded or jealous tree. And when young I would put them in the worst Briar patches and cattail patches I could find and after 7 nights a week and their eyes were swollen shut I might get 2 days of no bad kennel manners. Those guys that sell those seman pups out of them now got them sold at 8 weeks old if you notice the older they get the cheaper they get lol.


Tar

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Old Post 02-09-2020 01:36 AM
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thomasg
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Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
Posts: 1110

quote:
Originally posted by CONRAD FRYAR
I think it will help if we can pinpoint when we think it started to go down hill, And right now all I am dealing with is Accuracy? Anybody got sometime periods 😊
when the fur prices dropped to nothing .hide hunters didn’t keep a dog around that wasn’t productive.

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CONRAD FRYAR
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1621

My advice to young breeders is this base your breeding program on Accuracy on finding the coon and not on who is winning what, the results could be skewed 😊

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Old Post 02-09-2020 02:18 AM
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yadkintar
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Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
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quote:
Originally posted by CONRAD FRYAR
My advice to young breeders is this base your breeding program on Accuracy on finding the coon and not on who is winning what, the results could be skewed 😊




That I agree on. Boy I would like to be able to have collected some of the old hide dogs.


Tar

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Dave Richards
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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5612

Accuracy

While coon hides may be worthless these days, seeing coon eyes in every tree your dog trees SHOULD be the objective. Pleasure hunting or competition hunting should be about treeing coons. I can see all the empty trees I want to see just by looking out my front door. I have NEVER understood why anyone would be content with a slick treeing dog. Maybe if every one hunted in these steep mountains and had to walk to the top of a ridge or two only to see a slick tree, they would change their minds. Sure, the best may miss, but it should be rare and NOT a common thing. Certainly something that I will not tolerate, accept less and you have no one to blame but yourself. Dave

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2ol2hunt
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Registered: Nov 2011
Location: north ala.
Posts: 902

Re: Accuracy

quote:
Originally posted by Dave Richards
While coon hides may be worthless these days, seeing coon eyes in every tree your dog trees SHOULD be the objective. Pleasure hunting or competition hunting should be about treeing coons. I can see all the empty trees I want to see just by looking out my front door. I have NEVER understood why anyone would be content with a slick treeing dog. Maybe if every one hunted in these steep mountains and had to walk to the top of a ridge or two only to see a slick tree, they would change their minds. Sure, the best may miss, but it should be rare and NOT a common thing. Certainly something that I will not tolerate, accept less and you have no one to blame but yourself. Dave
Exactly the way I see it! And I can't figure it any other way.

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novicane65
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Registered: Dec 2013
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quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
They are already building dogs to compete with the new rules we just got.


But I think it will be better you blow to deep to quick and sombody is going to clean up coons behind you.


They crack babies Conrad thyroid pills is like crack to a dog amongst the other stuff top winning dog of all time didn’t live two months after they took him off the dope. Withdraws killed him.


Tar



So are you saying Meltdown died from withdraws from the thyroid meds? Only thing I can tell you is what I got told. I got told it was Blasto.


But I can't say 1 way or another on when the crazy pup stuff started. But I think there's been a bunch of changes in the past 10 years alone. Or I'm just more aware of it now. I think if you get away from the "big winners" you get more balance.

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yadkintar
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by novicane65
[B]So are you saying Meltdown died from withdraws from the thyroid meds ?



I never said what meds ?


Tar

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pamjohnson
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Registered: Feb 2012
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Maybe doing away with awarding 1st bark a hundred strike points could go a long way towards fixing some of the issues with the hunts as well as manners .

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shadinc
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Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3363

quote:
Originally posted by CONRAD FRYAR
You mean to tell me that with all the opinions on here the best we can do is blame it on the hunts? Where are all the breeding experts? I thought you guys might blame it on linebreeding
Or even the dreaded inbreeding, but we all know that's not the case. So lets hear it what is causing the hyper, motor mouthed, slick treeing, chain eating idiots?
It's quiet at my house and there's 6 hounds here. (no bark collars either

If you don't think the hunts have a huge impact on accuracy, start sending them home for slick trees and don't give first tree points to dogs that split tree second and see if it doesn't change. Dogs compete for strike points but not tree points.

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Olrebel
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Re: .

quote:
Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
I think the 90’s is about right. Maybe 1995 to 2005.
Thats exactly when I quit 1995 and started back late 2005 you folks messed it all Up while I was gone

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shadinc
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Re: Re: .

quote:
Originally posted by Olrebel
Thats exactly when I quit 1995 and started back late 2005 you folks messed it all Up while I was gone
LOL

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2ol2hunt
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Registered: Nov 2011
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Posts: 902

I been following this thread so it should be obvious by now that the problem is a combination of breeding, drugs,greed, and lack of discipline.... sounds like most other troubles in the world!....And as for when it started ...in a garden called Eden...

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CONRAD FRYAR
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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1621

2ol2hunt I agree, something else to think about in that time period everyone became breeders, many with no knowledge of breeding.
Everyone said breed the best to the best and you will be successful, what is your criteria for best ? Titles, Grand Night Champions, Most Hype 😊
Traits and Accuracy are most important in breeding!
I am thankful that I am happy with the dogs we are breeding, I have a couple partners all younger than I am and my philosophy to them is this.....
"If you can't feed your family with the dog your hunting then we don't need it"
That's the criteria I want them to I use evaluating a dog.

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Striving to breed balanced Treeing Walkers.

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Dave Richards
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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5612

Conrad

I like your thinking, even though coon hides are worthless these days, the thought process should be about how successful your dog or dogs are in treeing coons if they were bringing top dollar. How many coons can they tree accurately? Could I feed my family on hide prices if they were high, by the number if coons my dogs can tree accurately night in night out. Are my dogs good enough that folks would buy a pup from me. Am I happy hunting my dogs every night or do I want better, these are questions that if answered Yes , then you know you have the right stock. I have followed you and yourf dogs enough to think you have the right stock. Keep up the good work. Dave

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