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Corey Gruver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Conneaut Lake, PA
Posts: 1607

Tar

What happens to the fella with a legitimate argument that can't afford it? I make pretty good money myself and I certainly couldn't afford that fee increase. Especially at a double header where I just spent two $25 entry fees. My wife would skin me alive if I dropped $100 on an appeal at a coon hunt, on top of those two entry fees.

You can't spend your time making proposals that handicap the average hunter or his pocket book, just to deter or catch a crook. No wonder we have such a hard time getting people involved with this sport. It's quickly becoming a "rich man's" game.

Guess I'll have to forfeit my cup of coffee from the kitchen if I have issues on my cast...

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Toad Hill
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: missouri
Posts: 919

quote:
Originally posted by Redneck Mafia
Change rule 12. (c) to read
MOH/HD must be present at all times at any open event with (16) or more entries. All major events including any Purina Points events must have a MOH present on grounds.

Change 3rd sentence in 16(a) to read the following... It may be scored with a question mark (?) to be reviewed by the MOH/panel. A fee of $25 for each question must be paid previous to the question(s) being heard.

16. (b) 3. Change last sentence to read the following...
Any handler not satisfied with the out come retains the right to place a (?) to be reviewed by the MOH/panel. A fee of $25 for each question must be paid previous to the question(s) being heard.

Panels
1. In order to form a panel a $25 Panel Fee must be paid for each question previous to question(s) being heard.
Appeals
3. Appeals must be submitted to the MOH/HD with a fee of $100.

*In the event that a MOH/panel or appeal is ruled in favor of the person placing the question or appeal all fees will be returned. If the MOH/ panel or appeal is ruled against fees will be retained by UKC to be submitted to the youth fund.

There I fixed it...



THATS what i'm talkin about !!!!!!!! NICE !

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4236

Re: Tar

quote:
Originally posted by Corey Gruver
What happens to the fella with a legitimate argument that can't afford it? I make pretty good money myself and I certainly couldn't afford that fee increase. Especially at a double header where I just spent two $25 entry fees. My wife would skin me alive if I dropped $100 on an appeal at a coon hunt, on top of those two entry fees.

You can't spend your time making proposals that handicap the average hunter or his pocket book, just to deter or catch a crook. No wonder we have such a hard time getting people involved with this sport. It's quickly becoming a "rich man's" game.

Guess I'll have to forfeit my cup of coffee from the kitchen if I have issues on my cast...


When you are right you get your money back if your wrong you just learned a lesson to not put stupid frivolous questions on the card. Since most have very few questions come in at the local level this would actually affect those attending large events. After setting near the head table at AO and the grasping at straws questions at the world hunt this year it is pretty clear something needs done sooner than later.
It even would apply to the guy that brought in a question at an RQE in a cast Cheyenne was judging. Chey showed him the exact rule on the back of the card and read it aloud, it was still questioned because in the mans words he still wanted to hear it from the MOH. These are a waist of time if they want to place these on the card great they just helped to buy a trophy or prize for a youth!

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nitehunter2004
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
Posts: 12074

Ever notice how a few say We Never Have A Problem At Our Club but they argue Every Day on this site with Anyone that disagrees with them, could it be a My-Way or the High-Way! Just Saying.

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4236

quote:
Originally posted by Toad Hill
THATS what i'm talkin about !!!!!!!! NICE !

Thank you.
It gives parameters to when hunt directors must be present, allows the same as always rules for MOH at Purina events then increases fees for questions to be heard adds fees for MOH to hear questions retaining those fees for the youth when ruled against the questioner but returning them if a judge/cast made the wrong call.

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Old Post 11-11-2019 06:37 PM
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G.W. Harring
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2016
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 52

.

And there you are, it really is THAT SIMPLE and it is UKC's decision.

This is a concept that has already been proven out and Jen has written out all of the changes in verbiage that would be needed to make it happen.

I'll lead a thirsty horse to water and I'll even scoop a little in my hand and wet his lips a little if I really like him, but if he needs someone to set on his head and suck on his @$$ to get him to drink......he'll die of thirst around me.

3 pages is 3 too many on this subject. I'm out!!

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4236

quote:
Originally posted by nitehunter2004
Ever notice how a few say We Never Have A Problem At Our Club but they argue Every Day on this site with Anyone that disagrees with them, could it be a My-Way or the High-Way! Just Saying.

We have rarely ever had a question come in ever. I believe Shawn (our in house MOH) has heard 1 question this last year. In setting as a hunt director for our club I have never had to assemble a panel. In around 10 years of having $kc hunts we have had to assemble 2 panels.
BUT being at AO and the WC it is clear that these questioners need some tougher detourant to stop the frivolous grasping at straws questions that were brought in. If UKC is completely against raising fees at the local open events they should at least be raised at all major events.

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Corey Gruver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Conneaut Lake, PA
Posts: 1607

quote:
Originally posted by Redneck Mafia
We have rarely ever had a question come in ever. I believe Shawn (our in house MOH) has heard 1 question this last year. In setting as a hunt director for our club I have never had to assemble a panel. In around 10 years of having $kc hunts we have had to assemble 2 panels.
BUT being at AO and the WC it is clear that these questioners need some tougher detourant to stop the frivolous grasping at straws questions that were brought in. If UKC is completely against raising fees at the local open events they should at least be raised at all major events.



Do you think that maybe the reason you see more people ask questions at AO and WC and NOT at the local club, is due to the fact that UKC is so easily accessible at these national level events?

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4236

quote:
Originally posted by Corey Gruver
Do you think that maybe the reason you see more people ask questions at AO and WC and NOT at the local club, is due to the fact that UKC is so easily accessible at these national level events?

Could be and some get desperate to win. Questions many times are over compensation for lack of self and dog performance. It also has to do with at the local level you know your hunters and they know the officals it keeps problems to a minimum. I watched a guy bring a question in at Oaks this year. Moh/field rep ruled against him then he wanted a panel who also ruled against him he then wanted to appeal to UKC who in the morning also ruled against him. All this trouble and it would cost him $30 total. Out of hundreds of entries 20 @$$/@)!'s show up and they all have to bring in a stupid question. The few that have a legit question will get there $ back under what I just typed up the others have to put their money where their mouth is.
I'm betting if you ask other field reps and MOH if they feel that fees are needed to help detour some of this most would agree.

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Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 3542

Hunts

I agree with Jen Cummings proposal, it makes perfect sense, this would be a win win for the small clubs and large clubs. I still think that UKC should have an OFFICIAL on call during these hunts. Just knowing that any issue could be resolved by getting UKC'S OFFICIAL ruling that night if needed, would give every hunter more confidence in the system. We ALL know that you may get different decisions by different MOH and/or Hunt Directors/PANEL on the same question/s at different Clubs. Having access to UKC'S OFFICIAL RULING would guarantee the same ruling for everyone no matter the Club they hunt. Why is this concept such a problem? There are hundreds of Clubs holding hundreds of hunts every year that generate a large income for UKC, there is no excuse for not having UKC to provide an OFFICIAL during these hunt times. Any income from the fees charged could offset any additional expenses UKC might incur. Dave

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Sgraves
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2017
Location:
Posts: 249

Dave I some what agree with you . The official ruling is on back of card an there is still people that want to be a horses a$$. I really canít say I blame ukc for not wanting to step an have a hot line to call for every cry baby that thinks they got cheated. We got the rules coming we wanted. This is the thing though. Am gonna say this an itís true. The whining is coming next year. I would have to say that over half of the die hard ukc hunters that has only hunted ukc events will not have the style dog that will be needed to compete. The ones that are serious an know what they are doing will adjust. For the most part most will say they were cheated. An the whining an burning the phone up will begin.

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Dave Richards
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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 3542

UKC

With all due respect, these night hunts are UKC HUNTS and are run under UKC RULES, does it not make sense that UKC should be available to clarify or rule on any question that arise during these hunts, especially the ones that do not a clear answer. While most questions or issues can be resolved at the local hunts, there are some that can not be resolved at the local level and UKC could resolve those issues. We ALL deserve the best resolution to any problems or questions that happen in a Hunt and since UKC is the final word on these issues, they should be available during hunt times to resolve these issues. Dave

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Sgraves
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2017
Location:
Posts: 249

Re: UKC

quote:
Originally posted by Dave Richards
With all due respect, these night hunts are UKC HUNTS and are run under UKC RULES, does it not make sense that UKC should be available to clarify or rule on any question that arise during these hunts, especially the ones that do not a clear answer. While most questions or issues can be resolved at the local hunts, there are some that can not be resolved at the local level and UKC could resolve those issues. We ALL deserve the best resolution to any problems or questions that happen in a Hunt and since UKC is the final word on these issues, they should be available during hunt times to resolve these issues. Dave
Will not argue with you on that . Getting the final say so from the main source is always nice.

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Jack Bingham
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I have yet to see anyone post a legitimate reason why the hunt director shouldn't be allowed to hunt. And i see some on here voicing there opinion that rarely even go to a hunt.

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Dave Richards
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Jack Bingham

Why does it matter if someone hunts in 1 hunt a year or 50 hunts a year? Every customer is important to any business, most businesses survive on the little man. Bruce Conkey is a prime example of how a business should operate, he treats every customer the same regardless of the purchase amount, he makes every customer feel special, like you are his best customer. Customer service second to no one , he may not always have the best price, but you know that he will take care of you as a customer and that means more than anything. Customer service is the most important aspect of any company, it can make a company and it can break a company. How many of you have shopped KMART and experienced poor customer service? I quit KMART years ago due to their sorry customer service, and so did many others. Look where KMART is today, while WALMART gives excellent customer service and is very successful. Any company that wants to be successful better be customer oriented, listen to what the customer wants and provide their needs, failure to do these things will result in lost customers. Once a company loses customers it's hard to get them back, better to keep the customers they have. Dave

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berger
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Lockridge Iowa
Posts: 2742

quote:
Originally posted by Jack Bingham
I have yet to see anyone post a legitimate reason why the hunt director shouldn't be allowed to hunt.


Because it is UKC's policy that they can't, there is your reason. Anytime UKC decides to let them hunt they can change it as this would be a policy change and not a rule change.

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Corey Gruver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Conneaut Lake, PA
Posts: 1607

I'm guessing a lot of you are the "let me speak to your manager" type at Walmart

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Corey Gruver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Conneaut Lake, PA
Posts: 1607

Tar

All in good fun. Discussion is the best way to facilitate change. Proposals only get you so far if there isn't healthy discussion to go with it. So this should be great to help your cause.

I'm still against HD hunting.

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 17718

Re: Re: Tar

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
I am thick hided itís all good. Tar


It is a good thing that you are. You are the Rodney Dangerfield of coon hunters.

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 17718

And you hunt walker dogs. Just imagine what it would be like if you hunted Redbones.

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doug shuler
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2019
Location:
Posts: 2

I had a lengthy discussion with UKC about this last week. Our club member numbers and dogs showing up are way down. Was told breed associations say that they are gonna let hunt directors hunt. If clubs donít have enough members to cover a hunt. Then they should not be allowed to have hunts

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4236

quote:
Originally posted by doug shuler
I had a lengthy discussion with UKC about this last week. Our club member numbers and dogs showing up are way down. Was told breed associations say that they are gonna let hunt directors hunt. If clubs donít have enough members to cover a hunt. Then they should not be allowed to have hunts


Are breeds benefitting from the hunt packet fees of $25 or $35 and the $ sent in from the handful of dogs that show up at these clubs? No its UKC that benefits from it and someone's pay check every week. There are certain decisions that benefit a business and the more that keep their doors open the more they benefit.

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doug shuler
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2019
Location:
Posts: 2

Didnít get into breed associations how they benefit. Thatís a Ukc question. I asked for state representatives being on rules committee, along with breed associations. I am gonna talk to breed associations at the Grand American

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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9609

There !!

I deleted all my post now I can be team player tar :


They say 4 minutes of kissing up will out due 40 yrs of service we will try that.


Tar

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Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 3542

Hunts

When we decide that these small clubs should not hold hunts, WE will be cutting our own throat. I commend every small club that's doing everything they can to hold competition hunts. Kudos to those who are fighting to keep these clubs up and going, no business is ever to big to ignore any customer/s and every Club big or small is a valued customer. There are lots of small clubs across the country and together their numbers add up. I would hope that UKC values ALL of these clubs and the efforts they are making to be successful and takes a hard look at the way/s they can assist these clubs. Today's small clubs may be large clubs in the future, let's help them all we can. Dave

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