UKC Forums UKC Front Page :: Field Operations :: Show Operations :: Registration :: UKC Store
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Registration is free! Calendar Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Home  
UKC Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.3.0 UKC Forums > Departments > UKC Coonhounds > Thyroid problems running wild.
Pages (7): « First ... « 5 6 [7]   Last Thread   Next Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 3957

.

This post was intended to have a few on here that I know have researched the Thyroid Problem. Bring good information on the issue back up and we could reread it and try to get an understanding of the issue. Along with some in the industry that can make a change. Perhaps align themselves with a vet or organization that has the ability to research this and take it serious.

Pat, I appreciate the information you shared. There is also a couple others that I know have good info but I guess they have gotten burned out. Trying to explain there is more to it than meets the eye.

Rip I appreciate your medical input.

Now for the negative on the subject. There have been 149 replies with close to 6,000 views. What has been the most discussed issue. Juicing the dogs and cheating. That is all you guys want to talk about. Here is the truth on that subject. Most of you have never seen it done and the ones that know all about it and brag on it. Should be embarrassed they know so much about it. When the crooks in the sport have all the answers. It's a sad day. I have coon hunted for 52 years and I have never seen someone give their dogs anything to increase performance other than perhaps Red Cell if they are on a road trip and dog gets run down. I have had one conversation once about a drug called Winstrol or something like that back in the 90's. But using it I was told also increased their aggression level.

Back to the thyroid thing. If you ever truly seen a clinical example of a thyroid dog and the side affects on the dog. It will sadden your heart. Hair loss on sides and tail. Eye and ear issues. Overweight. It starts with the Thyroid but ruins the body in many dogs. Just like diabetes does in Humans. It ravages the body. That is why we need good information on the subject. And not get hung up on side issues like drugging a dog which is a total man made issue and those that want to ruin their dog. Go ahead. But I want to find out what is in the environment, dog food or breeding style that is destroying our dogs.

My answers, I feel is Line Breeding, Dog Food and Damage form E-Collars. Which one is the biggest contributor. I won't speculate. But if you ever see your prize hound truly ravaged by a Thyroid issue. It will stick with you and you would not think of giving the dog something for performance that could destroy it because it damaged the thyroid.
We have always look towards Purina as the leader in Balanced dog food. They have kennels of dogs they have studied for years. Yet I have not seen and information from them on the subject? Even though I feel the dog food might be the biggest contributor. Why hasn't Purina discovered an issue. I am sure if they had any claims that their dog food had no influence on Thyroid while some other did. It would be the biggest advertising story in a Lifetime.

Again Pat. Thanks for the info. Now you guys can go back to clouding the issue with your nonsense of doping dogs.
Anyone doping their dog deserves the thyroid dog they get but remember. Doping won't affect anyone else dog. Dog food, breeding and environment will. That is the issues that need to be talked about.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 01:01 PM
Bruce m. Conkey is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Bruce m. Conkey Click here to Send Bruce m. Conkey a Private Message Click Here to Email Bruce m. Conkey Visit Bruce m. Conkey's homepage! Find more posts by Bruce m. Conkey Add Bruce m. Conkey to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 8704

Bruce I love you man really ! But did you or did you not breed blaze and is he or is he not a thyroid dog ? I seen pups and grand pups for sale out of him this week look to be from 12 to 15 months old. If people are breeding it stands to reason it sure ainít helping matters any.


Both his brouther and sister are thyroid dogs.



Tar

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 01:17 PM
yadkintar is offline Click Here to See the Profile for yadkintar Click here to Send yadkintar a Private Message Click Here to Email yadkintar Find more posts by yadkintar Add yadkintar to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 3957

.

Tar the facts are this on Blaze. Blaze was a special hound from the performance standpoint. We and I say We. James Wright and myself offered him at stud. Because there are many out there that like and want a tight bred Wipeout Hound. Blaze was that hound. Those that choose to breed to him had a history with the wipeout breed and they knew exactly what the genetics of they breed brought to the table. Both good and risky.
We never pushed blaze and bred only a handful of females to guys that understood this.
If someone that wanted to be in the Stud dog business had Blaze he would have been advertised and pushed. He has over 30,000 dollars to his credit won and has won for several people all over the US. We got him to tree coon with and win a few hunts. I don't think you ever saw blaze advertised by us in any cooner, bloodlines magazine. Redgy did give us a good deal and we had a couple ads in the CHKC magazine. I told more people Blaze perhaps was not the dog they needed to breed to than I did they should breed to him. So I sleep very good at night with no thoughts of doing anyone wrong.
I think there was one guy from your area that bred a female to him and she was a thyroid dog, I came to learn. Think those pups have issues also. You can single out Blaze but if your were forming a line of those that push dogs for breeding and money making purposes. Blaze would be at the end of the line. Blaze was offered to those knowledgable of issues and still wanted his pedigree in their pups.

I personally have had one dog in 52 years here at the house that I have had to give medication to. That is my MONGO dog I have right now. He has a completely different pedigree than Blaze and doesn't have any dog with the prefix WIPEOUT in his pedigree. Yes back many generations you can find common dogs. That can be done in most Walkers. Mongo looks awful and is sick. But I tell you one thing. I can take him hunting and there is no performance issue. He has the heart of a coon dog and he hunts hard, trees every breath and trees real live coon every week for us.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 01:51 PM
Bruce m. Conkey is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Bruce m. Conkey Click here to Send Bruce m. Conkey a Private Message Click Here to Email Bruce m. Conkey Visit Bruce m. Conkey's homepage! Find more posts by Bruce m. Conkey Add Bruce m. Conkey to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
MR.RATMAN
Banned

Registered: Jul 2014
Location: IOWA
Posts: 958

A dog that has a good thyroid can not be given medication for thyroid to help it be more of an athlete.. I had a English dog with eurlichia and his thyroid was at 1.2 so I tried meds to raise thyroid level. His level did not go up instead it went down to .7. I got ahold of a thyroid veterinarian ms Dodds out of California and had a long discussion with her about this and was told a dog with good thyroid who is put on meds will actually lower the level and destroy the thyroid gland. Ms. Dodds also says it is hereditary. The only way we as hounds men can get a grip on the problem is to stop breeding to known blood lines, but we all know that won't happen.

https://drjeandoddspethealthresourc...m/dodds-thyroid

Get the facts from someone who knows instead of listening to those on here that no nothing, but gossip like a couple old hens

__________________
Todd Byers
Camanche, Iowa
309-912-8942 ( best to text )

PKC CH Byers Boogar Hollow D
( Mojo On Tap X Midnight Fly )

Last edited by MR.RATMAN on 04-26-2019 at 02:02 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 01:52 PM
MR.RATMAN is offline Click Here to See the Profile for MR.RATMAN Click here to Send MR.RATMAN a Private Message Click Here to Email MR.RATMAN Find more posts by MR.RATMAN Add MR.RATMAN to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
4play
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2015
Location:
Posts: 678

JMO

I have Thyroid dogs that were NOT from breeding.
Both were from TIC diseases.
1 when I bought had Eurlichia.
other got Rocky Mnt. fever at 3 yrs old.

The 'Thyro' pills saved both their lives.1.0 2x a day keeps them in 'normal' window of 2.5-3.0 +/-

Victor Red bag surely didn't help matters either.
Male is now sterile,female never had full or sometimes any heat cycle.Also had many false pregnancy after years of eating it.

Way to high Sodium,Salt,Iodine will damage Thyroid over time and I 100% think it did here too.Many others on here have had same problem with V red bag.Once off had normal heat cycles,even pups.
again JMO
Bash on or make excuses

__________________
Grnitech Pkc ch Skuna River Midnite Moe
{Skuna River Bark x Trackman's Sassy}

Nitech Stylish Clover Shark Jill
{Great White Shark x Brush Creek Patch}

Last edited by 4play on 04-26-2019 at 04:00 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 02:11 PM
4play is offline Click Here to See the Profile for 4play Click here to Send 4play a Private Message Click Here to Email 4play Find more posts by 4play Add 4play to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Rip
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4735

quote:
Originally posted by MR.RATMAN
A dog that has a good thyroid can not be given medication for thyroid to help it be more of an athlete.. I had a English dog with eurlichia and his thyroid was at 1.2 so I tried meds to raise thyroid level. His level did not go up instead it went down to .7. I got ahold of a thyroid veterinarian ms Dodds out of California and had a long discussion with her about this and was told a dog with good thyroid who is put on meds will actually lower the level and destroy the thyroid gland. Ms. Dodds also says it is hereditary. The only way we as hounds men can get a grip on the problem is to stop breeding to known blood lines, but we all know that won't happen.

https://drjeandoddspethealthresourc...m/dodds-thyroid

Get the facts from someone who knows instead of listening to those on here that no nothing, but gossip like a couple old hens



Mr Ratman, I am sorry but I think you may have misunderstood the vet or only got a brief explanation. It is much deeper than that.

Yes you can raise the levels, and yes it does destroy the native thyroid gland when you give thyroid medication when it isn't needed. It does both.

We do this all the time in humans that have thyroid issues. We give them high doses of thyroid medication to suppress their native thyroid tissue and yes you have to increase the dose but eventually their native tissue is completely suppressed and they are dependent on the medication, and you can keep raising the dosage until their levels get too high as well.

That is the medical fact from someone that does know because I treat thyroid disease every day. What gets people confused is that TSH and Free T4 are inverse. TSH is HIGH when they have a low thyroid and T4 is low, but when you give synthroid T4 goes up and the TSH decreases in response to having more than needed and that causes the thyroid gland to shrink and produce less but as you increase the dose you overcome that feedback of the thyroid and yes you can get the levels to whatever number you want because as you increase the dose you overcome the feedback of the body trying to pull down the thyroid levels to resist thyrotoxicosis which is deadly.

It is similar to giving them speed. It will give them more energy but if they don't need it it will destroy what thyroid they have left (sometimes it will come back sometimes not) and it will enlarge the heart, give heart problems, heat intolerance and hair loss.

But while a person is on too much thyroid medicine if they can take the heart racing they lose weight and have tons of energy.

That's why the antidoping agencies tried to get it outlawed in humans but like people have said on here before it gives absolutely no advantage to a person/hound that needs it as long as they don't put them on doses that put their levels higher than normal.

__________________
Let's go huntin

Last edited by Rip on 04-26-2019 at 08:49 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 08:32 PM
Rip is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Rip Click here to Send Rip a Private Message Click Here to Email Rip Visit Rip's homepage! Find more posts by Rip Add Rip to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
MR.RATMAN
Banned

Registered: Jul 2014
Location: IOWA
Posts: 958

I'm not confused I witnessed it my English hound that died. Had 1.2 level gave him .5 2x a day for 3 weeks retested and started on .1 2 x a day and after 3 more weeks retested and he was down to .7 level. That's when I got ahold of Ms Dodds for answers and was on the phone for 45 minutes and got all sorts of ligature on thyroid for dogs...

My English dog passed under a tree at the age of 3. I will never own or breed a thyroid hound .

I also agree with what you are saying Thanks RIp

__________________
Todd Byers
Camanche, Iowa
309-912-8942 ( best to text )

PKC CH Byers Boogar Hollow D
( Mojo On Tap X Midnight Fly )

Last edited by MR.RATMAN on 04-26-2019 at 09:43 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-26-2019 09:40 PM
MR.RATMAN is offline Click Here to See the Profile for MR.RATMAN Click here to Send MR.RATMAN a Private Message Click Here to Email MR.RATMAN Find more posts by MR.RATMAN Add MR.RATMAN to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Rip
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4735

quote:
Originally posted by MR.RATMAN
I'm not confused I witnessed it my English hound that died. Had 1.2 level gave him .5 2x a day for 3 weeks retested and started on .1 2 x a day and after 3 more weeks retested and he was down to .7 level. That's when I got ahold of Ms Dodds for answers and was on the phone for 45 minutes and got all sorts of ligature on thyroid for dogs...

My English dog passed under a tree at the age of 3. I will never own or breed a thyroid hound .

I also agree with what you are saying Thanks RIp



Sorry then I misunderstood YOU LOL. Happens all the time on message boards but for that I do apologize. I thought you were saying you couldn't get the thyroid level too high because it would kill the thyroid preventing you from getting it too high. I just wanted to be sure everyone understood that yes it does suppress the native thyroid but you can keep going up on the dose until you completely overcome the feedback loop and you can get the levels to 10 if you want if it don't kill the dog first. That's why people and dogs overdose on thyroid medication.

If you couldn't get it too high we wouldn't have a high and low range and we wouldn't have to test until we get it leveled out.

In trying to eliminate confusion it appears I may have added to it LOL.
It's not the same as talking in person.

__________________
Let's go huntin

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-27-2019 03:52 AM
Rip is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Rip Click here to Send Rip a Private Message Click Here to Email Rip Visit Rip's homepage! Find more posts by Rip Add Rip to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
DL NH
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
Posts: 104

Pride and integrity

Back in the late 1980's a very well known breeder of bluetick coon hounds said this to me: "Pride is a most expensive inheritance yet lest it be overcome by good judgement it becomes the cheapest of things known to man."

As I've followed this thread I find myself asking where is the pride in breeding dogs with known inheritable health issues that can be genetically passed on? Where is the pride in selling someone a pup or mature hound and not disclosing known health issues? Where is the pride in putting a title on a dog while knowingly "juicing " it with the intention of giving it unfair advantage over the competition?

"The love of money is a root of all kinds of evils." 1 Timothy 6:10. Words proven to be true over several hundred years of human history.

__________________
Dan

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-27-2019 04:37 AM
DL NH is offline Click Here to See the Profile for DL NH Click here to Send DL NH a Private Message Find more posts by DL NH Add DL NH to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
MR.RATMAN
Banned

Registered: Jul 2014
Location: IOWA
Posts: 958

Treating a dog with no thyroid issues will cause the thyroid to actually shut down due to the medication to try keeping levels normal was my understanding. Maybe that is what I was misinformed or confused RIP

I tried to boost my English hound up to help with the eurlichia but like I explained it dropped and after 2 weeks off the medication it went back to normal range.

__________________
Todd Byers
Camanche, Iowa
309-912-8942 ( best to text )

PKC CH Byers Boogar Hollow D
( Mojo On Tap X Midnight Fly )

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-27-2019 05:52 AM
MR.RATMAN is offline Click Here to See the Profile for MR.RATMAN Click here to Send MR.RATMAN a Private Message Click Here to Email MR.RATMAN Find more posts by MR.RATMAN Add MR.RATMAN to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Rip
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4735

quote:
Originally posted by MR.RATMAN
Treating a dog with no thyroid issues will cause the thyroid to actually shut down due to the medication to try keeping levels normal was my understanding. Maybe that is what I was misinformed or confused RIP



No your correct on that. That is absolutely true if you overdose one that doesn't need it it does completely shut down their native thyroid. Lets give an easy example. Say a dog didn't really need thyroid medicine and his thyroid was making it a 3 just to keep the numbers easy. They start the dog on .8 and the thyroid shuts down. Now that .8 got the levels up to 5 while the thyroid was functioning. The thyroid shuts down and it drops to 2 because the 3 that the thyroid was contributing is gone (5-3=2). They up the dose to 2 pills and now the dog is at 4. If they upped the does to 3 it would go to 6.

Now it's not that simple because of how the medication is absorbed, metabolized and the half life of the drug the numbers don't work that easy or we wouldn't have to retest so much to get the right levels. That is just to show you what I was talking about. It is 100% true that medicine given to a dog that don't need it will shut their thyroid down, but they can keep upping the dose and get them juiced if they want to, can even kill the dog if they get it too high.

Sometimes when you stop the dosing the thyroid can recover, but many times it's gone forever.

__________________
Let's go huntin

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-27-2019 06:57 AM
Rip is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Rip Click here to Send Rip a Private Message Click Here to Email Rip Visit Rip's homepage! Find more posts by Rip Add Rip to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 2846

Rip

Doc, great post and good explanation, this should clarify the confusion on just how juicing a dog can be done. How anyone with a conscious could do this is beyond my thinking. My dogs are my buddies, I just could never do something knowing that I intentionally caused them harm. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-27-2019 08:35 PM
Dave Richards is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Richards Click here to Send Dave Richards a Private Message Click Here to Email Dave Richards Find more posts by Dave Richards Add Dave Richards to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Kler Kry
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2009
Location: Monticello, Wi
Posts: 530

Re: Rip

quote:
Originally posted by Dave Richards
Doc, great post and good explanation, this should clarify the confusion on just how juicing a dog can be done. How anyone with a conscious could do this is beyond my thinking. My dogs are my buddies, I just could never do something knowing that I intentionally caused them harm. Dave


Agree, How can the dogs worth as a breeder be determined? How does the individual with a quality female to breed know if a potential stud is hereditarily defective or manmade?

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-29-2019 07:20 PM
Kler Kry is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Kler Kry Click here to Send Kler Kry a Private Message Click Here to Email Kler Kry Find more posts by Kler Kry Add Kler Kry to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
thomasg
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
Posts: 1010

Re: .

quote:
Originally posted by Bruce m. Conkey
I think many are missing boat here. There are many Thyroid Coon Hounds out there that have never been doped in any fashion. They are not even walkers so their genetics isnt even close to what the experts on here think is a line of dogs with thyroid issues.

How many of you have ever seen the typical clinical example of a thyroid dog. It is not a pretty picture. Yes there is such a thing. I am saying there is a lot more going on with our hounds of all breeds. Someday the truth will come out. Probably a dog food issue. But to get someone to do long term testing and expose it. Will be a long time coming.

BRUCE The truth is it is 80% genetic . good read on the subject type in purina pro club type thyroid in search bar .read the both of the articles on dalmations.it is my thoughts that breed ass. need to promote and insure the future of the heath of the hound breeds . dalmation breeders are years ahead of hound men .lol

Last edited by thomasg on 04-30-2019 at 12:56 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 04-30-2019 12:43 PM
thomasg is offline Click Here to See the Profile for thomasg Click here to Send thomasg a Private Message Click Here to Email thomasg Find more posts by thomasg Add thomasg to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
johnny reb
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2004
Location: tennessee
Posts: 680

KLER KRY a very big number of thyroid dogs are known. I would think about anyone that has been fooling with hounds for any amount of time would kno,the specific bloodlines thatntend to be more prone to the disease.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-01-2019 01:59 AM
johnny reb is offline Click Here to See the Profile for johnny reb Click here to Send johnny reb a Private Message Click Here to Email johnny reb Find more posts by johnny reb Add johnny reb to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
johnny reb
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2004
Location: tennessee
Posts: 680

KLER KRY a very big number of thyroid dogs are known. I would think about anyone that has been fooling with hounds for any amount of time would kno,the specific bloodlines thatntend to be more prone to the disease.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-01-2019 01:59 AM
johnny reb is offline Click Here to See the Profile for johnny reb Click here to Send johnny reb a Private Message Click Here to Email johnny reb Find more posts by johnny reb Add johnny reb to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
micooner
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: milan,mi
Posts: 1213

Thomasg it's not that dalmatian breeders are so far ahead of hounds when it comes to health issues. It all boils down to how the breed associations work in akc. Most states have breed associations clubs which fall under the national breed club. Through these come health studies and breed standards that are adopted by the members under the akc umbrella. One issue that the dalmatian club worked on was the deafness issue. Some of the results actually helped the cochlear implant procedure that humans use. Rush Limbaugh has one. I don't forsee ukc or $kc ever going to this type of process. If i was buying a dog i would want a throid panel and heartworm test plain and simple.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-01-2019 02:34 AM
micooner is offline Click Here to See the Profile for micooner Click here to Send micooner a Private Message Click Here to Email micooner Find more posts by micooner Add micooner to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
thomasg
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
Posts: 1010

quote:
Originally posted by johnny reb
KLER KRY a very big number of thyroid dogs are known. I would think about anyone that has been fooling with hounds for any amount of time would kno,the specific bloodlines thatntend to be more prone to the disease.

easy as pie all ya got to do is take a look at the u.k.c. top 10 hist. rep. list for walkers.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-05-2019 03:57 AM
thomasg is offline Click Here to See the Profile for thomasg Click here to Send thomasg a Private Message Click Here to Email thomasg Find more posts by thomasg Add thomasg to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Kler Kry
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2009
Location: Monticello, Wi
Posts: 530

thyroid dogs

Surely there are some dogs from these bloodlines that are normal and do not reproduce low level dogs. If so which ones are they?

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-05-2019 02:12 PM
Kler Kry is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Kler Kry Click here to Send Kler Kry a Private Message Click Here to Email Kler Kry Find more posts by Kler Kry Add Kler Kry to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
novicane65
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2013
Location: Nichols Ny
Posts: 1102

Re: Re: Re: Re: Tar

Tar,
Your example was the same 1 I brought up a year or 2 ago. People don't want to think about all the dogs that ""Blew up"" over the years. I've talked to several vets and several old timers that thought I had probably the most realistic answer to the "thyroid epidemic" we're seeing in dogs.

On a different note........ Guys are wondering why it seems more prevalent in the walkers than the other breeds. Because on average there's more walkers that get hunted 5-7 days a week than the other breeds. Not saying that there aren't guys pushing in the off color breeds but not as a whole the same way. So when we see something gets way off or abnormal with what we're pushing we take it to the vet.

Bruce,
I understand what you were trying to do from the original post. I commend you for that. On another note, thyroid dogs can't take any type of cold temps, they go into hypothermia. And as stated before your dog could show zero signs of being a thyroid dog from 0-5 but at 6 or older it becomes a thyroid dog for 1 reason or another.

__________________
Eric DePue

PKC CH Wax's Late Night Boom
Slow Talking Spade

Gone but not forgotten

GrNtCh, PKC Ch Hillbilly Bildo
Pr Broken Oaks Wild Blue Gypsy

Last edited by novicane65 on 05-06-2019 at 06:27 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-06-2019 06:22 PM
novicane65 is offline Click Here to See the Profile for novicane65 Click here to Send novicane65 a Private Message Click Here to Email novicane65 Find more posts by novicane65 Add novicane65 to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1845

So after years of discussion on this issue I'd say it comes down to a couple things we need to really focus on.

1. Genetic Hypothyroidism

2. Dietary Induced Hypothyroidism - ie. Iodine deficiency/excess, toxins

3. Euthyroid Sick Syndrome - ie. Tick Born Illness and others


We are seeing many issues with the new BEG diets on the market causing Dilated Cardiomyopathy in dogs. Not sure exactly what it is yet with these diets. It includes fad type diets like Boutique style diets that includes RAW diets, Grain free diets, and Exotic diets with rare ingredients. At first it was thought to be related to Taurine amino acid deficiency, but now that is being debunked by Nutritionists and Cardiologists. Many of the cases they are seeing don't have Taurine deficiencies in their diets.

What this brings up for me is that maybe we do need to look more at the diets as a cause of hormonal disruption in our hounds including hypothyroidism. I wasn't a big fan of jumping on the diet wagon at first, but this definitely has me wondering now. I've never been a fan of Grain Free diets. Especially when we've seen the results of changing the diet, of a female who isn't showing signs of heat, to a different commercial brand of dog food with grain (corn) and she starts to cycle again. Are some diets tainted with hormones or some other toxin that is disrupting their hormonal cycles, or is there a deficiency or excess in a certain ingredient of some foods leading to hormonal imbalances? Why did we see the surge of hypothyroidism in these hounds around the time when Grain Free Diets became the fad? When they pulled the natural sources of iodine out of dog foods by removing grains, they started supplementing with artificial / synthetic iodine sources. Are these sources the cause of our problems here? I'm just thinking folks.

Lots to think about!

Doc

__________________
Dr. Allen Hallada (Doc Halladay)

Current:

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Cat Scratch Fever
(Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Aftershock x Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Breanna)
2016 Finished to PKC Ch. in one week!

Dual Grand Champion CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Glissens JJ Jr. x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Billy Jean)
4 Generations of All Grand Nite Champions!
Timber Jack 3X and Timber Chopper over 30X
2019 Southern National Redbone Days Champion
2016 National Grand Nite Champion Redbone
2016 CHKC Redbone Days Champion
2016 PKC Super Stakes Reserve Champion
2016 CHKC Elite Shootout Winner - Texas
CHKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

Bodacious
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch.PKC. Gold Ch.CHKC CH. Outlaw G-Man x Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. Classy Cali)


Past:
Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch. Dawns Timber Jack
1988 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner
1989 UKC World Champion Redbone
1989 Purina Outstanding Redbone Coonhound
#2 Historic Redbone Sire/ Top 20 All Breeds
American Redbone Coonhound Assoc. Hall of Fame

Gr.Nt.Ch. Bussrow Bottom Brandy II
1991 American Redbone Days Champion
1992 AKC World Champion Redbone
1992 ACHA World Champion Redbone
1992 Wisconsin State Champion
1994 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex
Produced 2 Nt. Ch. , 1 Gr.Nt.Ch. out of 2 litters and two Redbone Days Winners

Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. PKC Gold Ch. Layton's Classy Cali
2012 UKC World Champion Redbone and 7th Place Overall
2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 UKC World Champion Redbone Female
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - Goodsprings, AL
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Series Race - 3rd Place Overall
2016 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - New Albany, MS
2016 PKC Texas State Race Winner
2016 PKC Redbone Breed Race Winner
PKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Coffman's Smokin Red Buck
2016 UKC World Hunt 5th Place and World Champion Redbone
2016 National Redbone Days Overall Winner

Gr.Nt.Ch. Reinhart's Central Page
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Brandy II)

Gr.Nt.Ch. Too the Maxx
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Jenkins Crying Katie)
1992 National Redbone Days Champion

Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Ambraw River Rock
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Hersh's Huntin Red Kate)
1992 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex

Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle
1986 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner

Nt.Ch. Timber Mace
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack X Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle)
Mother of Gr.Nt.Ch. Babb's Hazel

Nt. Ch. Timber Shock
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Jessie)

Gr. Ch. Nt. Ch. Squaw Mountain Goldie
(Direct Daughter of Gr.Nt.Ch.Smokey Mountain Brandy)
1990 Autumn Oaks Best of Show Winner
1988 Indiana State Champion

Last edited by ahallada on 05-07-2019 at 03:00 AM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-07-2019 02:26 AM
ahallada is offline Click Here to See the Profile for ahallada Click here to Send ahallada a Private Message Click Here to Email ahallada Find more posts by ahallada Add ahallada to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Pat Bizich
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1110

So after years of discussion on this issue I'd say it comes down to a couple things we need to really focus on.

1. Genetic Hypothyroidism

2. Dietary Induced Hypothyroidism - ie. Iodine deficiency/excess, toxins

3. Euthyroid Sick Syndrome - ie. Tick Born Illness and others

These are the same conclusions I have made.
I have a difference of opinion though on the surge beginning with the grain free diet push.

I am going to repost something that AAFCO did that gave the go ahead to the increasing of Iodine in our dogs feed.
Pay particular attention that these increases were done without any study of consequences on our dogs health .
They were adopted from the FEDIAF, the equivalent of AAFCO in Europe. AND Europe had problems with Thyroid dogs before the US did.
Pay attention to the amount that the increases were and the year it was done.

One other thing I have railed against and that is FISHMEAL.
It has iodine levels that vary from batch to batch.
IT HAS NEVER, NEVER, NEVER , EVER BEEN APPROVED FOR LONG TERM USE IN COMPANION ANIMALS FEED!!!
Check your feed for added kelp products .

Now a lot of what I am going to post had been copied and pasted to my folders so I no longer can give credit of where I found it.BUMMER I had a bunch of links to medical journels I checked after posting that no longer are valid that backed a lot of what I have posted here.

IODINE
The 2006 NRC RA for iodine in dog foods is 0.88 mg/kg DM. The FEDIAF
Guideline concentrations range from 0.9 to 1.5 mg/kg DM. In considering the basis for
these various recommended concentrations the 2007 CNES felt a recommended
minimum concentration of 1.0 mg/kg to be prudent and adequate to support adult
maintenance as well as growth and reproduction.
The 2007 CNES revised the maximum concentration for iodine based on the
following considerations. Although neither the 2005 Mineral Tolerances for Animals
nor the 2006 Nutrient Requirements of Dogs and Cats established a tolerance or SUL
for iodine in diets for dogs, both publications cite data that indicate a commercial
formulation containing 5.6 mg iodine/kg diet had adverse effects on thyroid
function.

2008 FEDIAF Guidelines indicate a maximum concentration for iodine of 11 mg/kg
The tolerances for iodine in the 2005 Mineral Tolerances of
Animals that have been established for various species range from 5 mg/kg DM in diets
for horses to 400 mg/kg DM in diets for swine. Given that the NRC tolerance for
horses is 10 times less than the general maximum concentration of 50 mg iodine/kg
DM recommended by AAFCO, the 2007 CNES felt the value of 50 mg/kg DM to no
longer be appropriate for setting a maximum concentration for iodine in dog foods.
The 2007 CNES acknowledges that additional studies may allow further refinement of
a maximum amount of iodine in foods for dogs, but until such data are available the
CNES felt it prudent to adopt the FEDIAF position and set 11 mg iodine per kg DM as
the maximum concentration of iodine in dog foods.
-----------------------------------------------
https://www.ourdogsonline.com/viewt...=iodine#p107704
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.democraticunderground.co...dress=243x25841

Excess Iodine implicated in Thyroid disease: RDA's for Iodine in Dogs ...are they too high?

I raise this important topic for 4 reasons:

1) I recently proved that one of my dogs had suffered needlessly for more than 2 years due to a diet induced case of hypothyroidism(documented here at OurDogsOnline.com). This was the second dog (different breeds) of mine in the last 5 years that had been diagnosed with autoimmune thyroid disease.

2) I have noticed that thyroid disease (and associated symptomatic conditions) is one of the most common ailments reported on-line.

3) The National Research Council's RDA with respect to iodine (approx 300 mcg for a 50 lb adult dog) is more than triple the human RDA (approx 100 mcg) for an adult human weighing 3 times as much ... so potentially 9 times greater on the basis of weight alone.

4) Lastly, I have noticed that many commercial dog foods include kelp or seaweed as a key ingredient, often in unspecified quantities. One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg of iodine. The iodine content in 17 different kelp supplements studied by one group of researchers varied from 45 to 57,000 mcg per tablet or capsule!(1) Further many home-made dog food recipes seem to include kelp as a necessary dietary component of well-being ...why else would they call it "healthy powder"?

With the increasing number of both dogs being diagnosed with hypothyroidism, and the hype around the benefits of kelp, I feel it necessary to ask the question -- are we putting too much iodine in their diet?

-----------
Some facts and scientfic studies that suggest yes -- we may be ingesting too much iodine in both our own and in our pets' diet...

In humans, the RDA for iodine is approx 40 to 200 mcg per day (Source 1). Most nutrtional experts use 100 mcg of iodine per day as a target RDA.

One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg (5000 mcg) of iodine (Source 1) -- ie. 50x the upper limit RDA.

In Canada and the US table salt is iodized at a rate of 100 ppm. So 1 gram of salt contains 100 mcg of iodine (approx. the RDA for most adults). One teaspoon of iodized salt contains 400 mcg of iodine.

Iodine is considered to be an important environmental agent known to increase the risk of thyroid autoimmunity. Too much iodine or too little iodine can have very consequential effects on thyroid function. Several studies support a role for iodine in the initiation and promotion of auto-immune thyroid disease.The well known side effects of iodine include iodine induced hyperthyroidism and hypothyroidism. It has been shown that the introduction of iodine in a previously iodine deficient population may precipitate the emergence of thyroid autoimmunity. Thus, epidemiological studies have shown that appearance of thyroid autoantibodies has been associated with salt iodination in iodine-deficient regions. In addition, animal studies have confirmed that high iodine intake accelerates autoimmune thyroiditis in autoimmune-prone animal models. See Medical Journal Ref's (2), (3), (4).

The American Thyroid Association recommends that the low-iodine diet (used in the treatment of thyroid cancer patients) include less than 50 mcg of iodine per day. (Source 2) Besides iodized salt, the following food items contain copious amounts of iodine: seafood products, dairy products, egg yolks, baked products, red dye#3, molasses, soy products, some beans (red kidney beans, lima beans, navy beans, pinto beans, and cowpeas), fresh meat, and some rices.


====================================


Other Reading
Kelp is a good source of bioavailable iodine. One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg of iodine.

Health Canada advises against use of SEAVITE products containing iodine
Health Canada is advising consumers not to use SEAVITE Premium Atlantic Kelp Blend and SEAVITE Premium Atlantic Kelp Tablets. These products, when consumed according to the instructions on the label can provide 25 times the recommended daily allowance (RDA) per day of iodine for adults; and could lead to serious adverse health consequences.

5000 mcg of Iodine in Maine Coast Sea Vegetables
Maine Coast Sea Vegetables offers two types of Kelp. Whole leaf kelp (Laminaria longicruris) has approximately 450 mcg. (micrograms or parts per million) iodine per gram. Our milled kelp (Laminaria digitata), sold in bulk and in our Sea Seasonings, has even higher amounts, about 5000 mcg. In comparison, Dulse contains 50 mcg per gram. These amounts are approximations as there is variation depending on season of harvest and the age of plant.



I am currently reviewing a signficant body of literature on the dark side to soybean of which many byproducts are used in pet foods. Soy has been purported to have a role in thyroid-related problems.

This past week a poster (who suffers from hypothyroidism) alerted me to its potential cause/effect relationship. So I did a bit of poking around in the medical journals and sure enough there was some compelling evidence that soy may be implicated in thyroid disfunction and immune disorders.

This general/layperson's article in Mother Jones (2004) encapsulates many of the more recent findings. It is also accompanied by a full set of references.

Wrt to iodine,(and other additives) the biggest problem is that the pet food companies do not disclose how much is alleged to be in the formulas, and even if they did they have an astoundingly bad track record for getting the quantities of food items wrong. Kelp, a huge source of iodine with great variabilty in iodine content, is routinely added to most dog foods now on top of calcium iodate. Check out these dog food comparisons. Most contain both kelp & calcium iodate!

What the hell is going on?? Who's designing this chow?? How many sources of iodine do we need? And who's measuring it?


5. Some additional links on iodine, hypothyroidism & testing

Canine Autoimmune Thyroid Disease And Symptoms
http://siriusdog.com/articles/canin...mune-thyroid...

https://www.endocrine.org/search/#q...0Hypothyroidism

I agree that Kelp is one cause.

I have one dog with hypothyroidism, and buried another with hypothyroidism. They were both fed kibble containing kelp. The dog that is still living was put on a raw diet. Within several months, he had an intolerance to warmth and was panting. A blood draw indicated a lower dose of Soloxine thyroid hormone. He was put on once/day dosing instead of twice/day. The warmth intolerance stopped, as well as the panting.

Can I explain how a thyroid can start working somewhat properly again after changing the diet? No. But it happened. That's all the proof I needed to know that kelp should not be fed. Unfortunately, he was fed that kibble for 6 years, so some of the damage to the thyroid is permanent.

I think once humans intervene in what Nature provides for us and our animals, we're asking for trouble.


That is more or less the experience I have had with my little aussie. Sadly, I also had a previous dog (a springer spaniel) that suffered thru years of hypothroidism (I just didn't know enogh at the time) and finally died suddenly of Immune Mediated Hemolytic Anemia -- all brought on by the s*** in the commercial feed.


I lose lots of sleep due to the guilt of blindly following my vet's advice about what to feed my dogs. Never again!

__________________________________________________
______________________ LINKS

http://www.jarvm.com/articles/Vol1Iss1/CASTIJVM.htm

__________________
IT SEEMS THAT EVERYTIME A BREED OR LINE OF DOGS GET POPULAR IT EVENTUALLY LEADS TO ITS RUINATION BY UNINFORMED PEOPLE BREEDING WITHOUT DOING THEIR RESEARCH FIRST.

Gone but never forgotten:
NtChGrCh Dryfork Punkin
NtChGrCh Dryfork Little Blue Baby Doll
2009 Pa Show Dog Of The Year
GrCh Dryfork Little Black Book

Home of:

2009,2013,2018 Pa. State
Show Handler Of The Year
GrCh Dryfork Black Dog Raine
Gr.Ch. Black Dog Black Cherry
Gr.Ch. Make My Day Sunny
2018 Pa. Show Dog Of Year
Gr.Ch. Batman's Poison Ivy
2011&2013 WTDA Pa State Champion
2011&2013 Overall Hunt For The Cure
Ch. Jay's Greenridge Heidi
In memory of my best friend "Jay"

Last edited by Pat Bizich on 05-10-2019 at 12:31 AM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-07-2019 03:51 AM
Pat Bizich is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Pat Bizich Click here to Send Pat Bizich a Private Message Find more posts by Pat Bizich Add Pat Bizich to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1845

quote:
Originally posted by Pat Bizich
So after years of discussion on this issue I'd say it comes down to a couple things we need to really focus on.

1. Genetic Hypothyroidism

2. Dietary Induced Hypothyroidism - ie. Iodine deficiency/excess, toxins

3. Euthyroid Sick Syndrome - ie. Tick Born Illness and others

These are the same conclusions I have made.
I have a difference of opinion though on the surge beginning with the grain free diet push.

I am going to repost something that AAFCO did that gave the go ahead to the increasing of Iodine in our dogs feed.
Pay particular attention that these increases were done without any study of consequences on our dogs health .
They were adopted from the FEDIAF, the equivalent of AAFCO in Europe. AND Europe had problems with Thyroid dogs before the US did.
Pay attention to the amount that the increases were and the year it was done.

One other thing I have railed against and that is FISHMEAL.
It has iodine levels that vary from batch to batch.
IT HAS NEVER, NEVER, NEVER , EVER BEEN APPROVED FOR LONG TERM USE IN COMPANION ANIMALS FEED!!!
Check your feed for added kelp products .

Now a lot of what I am going to post had been copied and pasted to my folders so I no longer can give credit of where I found it.BUMMER I had a bunch of links to medical journels I checked after posting that no longer are valid that backed a lot of what I have posted here.

IODINE
The 2006 NRC RA for iodine in dog foods is 0.88 mg/kg DM. The FEDIAF
Guideline concentrations range from 0.9 to 1.5 mg/kg DM. In considering the basis for
these various recommended concentrations the 2007 CNES felt a recommended
minimum concentration of 1.0 mg/kg to be prudent and adequate to support adult
maintenance as well as growth and reproduction.
The 2007 CNES revised the maximum concentration for iodine based on the
following considerations. Although neither the 2005 Mineral Tolerances for Animals
nor the 2006 Nutrient Requirements of Dogs and Cats established a tolerance or SUL
for iodine in diets for dogs, both publications cite data that indicate a commercial
formulation containing 5.6 mg iodine/kg diet had adverse effects on thyroid
function.

2008 FEDIAF Guidelines indicate a maximum concentration for iodine of 11 mg/kg
The tolerances for iodine in the 2005 Mineral Tolerances of
Animals that have been established for various species range from 5 mg/kg DM in diets
for horses to 400 mg/kg DM in diets for swine. Given that the NRC tolerance for
horses is 10 times less than the general maximum concentration of 50 mg iodine/kg
DM recommended by AAFCO, the 2007 CNES felt the value of 50 mg/kg DM to no
longer be appropriate for setting a maximum concentration for iodine in dog foods.
The 2007 CNES acknowledges that additional studies may allow further refinement of
a maximum amount of iodine in foods for dogs, but until such data are available the
CNES felt it prudent to adopt the FEDIAF position and set 11 mg iodine per kg DM as
the maximum concentration of iodine in dog foods.
-----------------------------------------------
https://www.ourdogsonline.com/viewt...=iodine#p107704
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.democraticunderground.co...dress=243x25841

Excess Iodine implicated in Thyroid disease: RDA's for Iodine in Dogs ...are they too high?

I raise this important topic for 4 reasons:

1) I recently proved that one of my dogs had suffered needlessly for more than 2 years due to a diet induced case of hypothyroidism(documented here at OurDogsOnline.com). This was the second dog (different breeds) of mine in the last 5 years that had been diagnosed with autoimmune thyroid disease.

2) I have noticed that thyroid disease (and associated symptomatic conditions) is one of the most common ailments reported on-line.

3) The National Research Council's RDA with respect to iodine (approx 300 mcg for a 50 lb adult dog) is more than triple the human RDA (approx 100 mcg) for an adult human weighing 3 times as much ... so potentially 9 times greater on the basis of weight alone.

4) Lastly, I have noticed that many commercial dog foods include kelp or seaweed as a key ingredient, often in unspecified quantities. One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg of iodine. The iodine content in 17 different kelp supplements studied by one group of researchers varied from 45 to 57,000 mcg per tablet or capsule!(1) Further many home-made dog food recipes seem to include kelp as a necessary dietary component of well-being ...why else would they call it "healthy powder"?

With the increasing number of both dogs being diagnosed with hypothyroidism, and the hype around the benefits of kelp, I feel it necessary to ask the question -- are we putting too much iodine in their diet?

-----------
Some facts and scientfic studies that suggest yes -- we may be ingesting too much iodine in both our own and in our pets' diet...

In humans, the RDA for iodine is approx 40 to 200 mcg per day (Source 1). Most nutrtional experts use 100 mcg of iodine per day as a target RDA.

One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg (5000 mcg) of iodine (Source 1) -- ie. 50x the upper limit RDA.

In Canada and the US table salt is iodized at a rate of 100 ppm. So 1 gram of salt contains 100 mcg of iodine (approx. the RDA for most adults). One teaspoon of iodized salt contains 400 mcg of iodine.

Iodine is considered to be an important environmental agent known to increase the risk of thyroid autoimmunity. Too much iodine or too little iodine can have very consequential effects on thyroid function. Several studies support a role for iodine in the initiation and promotion of auto-immune thyroid disease.The well known side effects of iodine include iodine induced hyperthyroidism and hypothyroidism. It has been shown that the introduction of iodine in a previously iodine deficient population may precipitate the emergence of thyroid autoimmunity. Thus, epidemiological studies have shown that appearance of thyroid autoantibodies has been associated with salt iodination in iodine-deficient regions. In addition, animal studies have confirmed that high iodine intake accelerates autoimmune thyroiditis in autoimmune-prone animal models. See Medical Journal Ref's (2), (3), (4).

The American Thyroid Association recommends that the low-iodine diet (used in the treatment of thyroid cancer patients) include less than 50 mcg of iodine per day. (Source 2) Besides iodized salt, the following food items contain copious amounts of iodine: seafood products, dairy products, egg yolks, baked products, red dye#3, molasses, soy products, some beans (red kidney beans, lima beans, navy beans, pinto beans, and cowpeas), fresh meat, and some rices.


====================================


Other Reading
Kelp is a good source of bioavailable iodine. One gram of kelp of the species Laminaria digitata contains approximately 5mg of iodine.

Health Canada advises against use of SEAVITE products containing iodine
Health Canada is advising consumers not to use SEAVITE Premium Atlantic Kelp Blend and SEAVITE Premium Atlantic Kelp Tablets. These products, when consumed according to the instructions on the label can provide 25 times the recommended daily allowance (RDA) per day of iodine for adults; and could lead to serious adverse health consequences.

5000 mcg of Iodine in Maine Coast Sea Vegetables
Maine Coast Sea Vegetables offers two types of Kelp. Whole leaf kelp (Laminaria longicruris) has approximately 450 mcg. (micrograms or parts per million) iodine per gram. Our milled kelp (Laminaria digitata), sold in bulk and in our Sea Seasonings, has even higher amounts, about 5000 mcg. In comparison, Dulse contains 50 mcg per gram. These amounts are approximations as there is variation depending on season of harvest and the age of plant.



I am currently reviewing a signficant body of literature on the dark side to soybean of which many byproducts are used in pet foods. Soy has been purported to have a role in thyroid-related problems.

This past week a poster (who suffers from hypothyroidism) alerted me to its potential cause/effect relationship. So I did a bit of poking around in the medical journals and sure enough there was some compelling evidence that soy may be implicated in thyroid disfunction and immune disorders.

This general/layperson's article in Mother Jones (2004) encapsulates many of the more recent findings. It is also accompanied by a full set of references.

Wrt to iodine,(and other additives) the biggest problem is that the pet food companies do not disclose how much is alleged to be in the formulas, and even if they did they have an astoundingly bad track record for getting the quantities of food items wrong. Kelp, a huge source of iodine with great variabilty in iodine content, is routinely added to most dog foods now on top of calcium iodate. Check out these dog food comparisons. Most contain both kelp & calcium iodate!

What the hell is going on?? Who's designing this chow?? How many sources of iodine do we need? And who's measuring it?


5. Some additional links on iodine, hypothyroidism & testing

Canine Autoimmune Thyroid Disease And Symptoms
http://siriusdog.com/articles/canin...mune-thyroid...

Iodine Induced Hypothyroidism
http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/ra...n.2007-0082v...


I agree that Kelp is one cause.

I have one dog with hypothyroidism, and buried another with hypothyroidism. They were both fed kibble containing kelp. The dog that is still living was put on a raw diet. Within several months, he had an intolerance to warmth and was panting. A blood draw indicated a lower dose of Soloxine thyroid hormone. He was put on once/day dosing instead of twice/day. The warmth intolerance stopped, as well as the panting.

Can I explain how a thyroid can start working somewhat properly again after changing the diet? No. But it happened. That's all the proof I needed to know that kelp should not be fed. Unfortunately, he was fed that kibble for 6 years, so some of the damage to the thyroid is permanent.

I think once humans intervene in what Nature provides for us and our animals, we're asking for trouble.


That is more or less the experience I have had with my little aussie. Sadly, I also had a previous dog (a springer spaniel) that suffered thru years of hypothroidism (I just didn't know enogh at the time) and finally died suddenly of Immune Mediated Hemolytic Anemia -- all brought on by the s*** in the commercial feed.


I lose lots of sleep due to the guilt of blindly following my vet's advice about what to feed my dogs. Never again!

__________________________________________________
______________________ LINKS

http://www.jarvm.com/articles/Vol1Iss1/CASTIJVM.htm




What feeds did your vet recommend for your dogs? What are you feeding now?

__________________
Dr. Allen Hallada (Doc Halladay)

Current:

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Cat Scratch Fever
(Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Aftershock x Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Breanna)
2016 Finished to PKC Ch. in one week!

Dual Grand Champion CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Glissens JJ Jr. x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Billy Jean)
4 Generations of All Grand Nite Champions!
Timber Jack 3X and Timber Chopper over 30X
2019 Southern National Redbone Days Champion
2016 National Grand Nite Champion Redbone
2016 CHKC Redbone Days Champion
2016 PKC Super Stakes Reserve Champion
2016 CHKC Elite Shootout Winner - Texas
CHKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

Bodacious
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch.PKC. Gold Ch.CHKC CH. Outlaw G-Man x Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. Classy Cali)


Past:
Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch. Dawns Timber Jack
1988 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner
1989 UKC World Champion Redbone
1989 Purina Outstanding Redbone Coonhound
#2 Historic Redbone Sire/ Top 20 All Breeds
American Redbone Coonhound Assoc. Hall of Fame

Gr.Nt.Ch. Bussrow Bottom Brandy II
1991 American Redbone Days Champion
1992 AKC World Champion Redbone
1992 ACHA World Champion Redbone
1992 Wisconsin State Champion
1994 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex
Produced 2 Nt. Ch. , 1 Gr.Nt.Ch. out of 2 litters and two Redbone Days Winners

Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. PKC Gold Ch. Layton's Classy Cali
2012 UKC World Champion Redbone and 7th Place Overall
2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 UKC World Champion Redbone Female
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - Goodsprings, AL
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Series Race - 3rd Place Overall
2016 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - New Albany, MS
2016 PKC Texas State Race Winner
2016 PKC Redbone Breed Race Winner
PKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Coffman's Smokin Red Buck
2016 UKC World Hunt 5th Place and World Champion Redbone
2016 National Redbone Days Overall Winner

Gr.Nt.Ch. Reinhart's Central Page
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Brandy II)

Gr.Nt.Ch. Too the Maxx
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Jenkins Crying Katie)
1992 National Redbone Days Champion

Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Ambraw River Rock
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Hersh's Huntin Red Kate)
1992 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex

Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle
1986 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner

Nt.Ch. Timber Mace
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack X Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle)
Mother of Gr.Nt.Ch. Babb's Hazel

Nt. Ch. Timber Shock
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Jessie)

Gr. Ch. Nt. Ch. Squaw Mountain Goldie
(Direct Daughter of Gr.Nt.Ch.Smokey Mountain Brandy)
1990 Autumn Oaks Best of Show Winner
1988 Indiana State Champion

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-08-2019 03:55 AM
ahallada is offline Click Here to See the Profile for ahallada Click here to Send ahallada a Private Message Click Here to Email ahallada Find more posts by ahallada Add ahallada to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
edwardfasteddy
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2011
Location:
Posts: 411

WOW!

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 05-09-2019 05:23 AM
edwardfasteddy is offline Click Here to See the Profile for edwardfasteddy Click Here to Email edwardfasteddy Find more posts by edwardfasteddy Add edwardfasteddy to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
All times are GMT. The time now is 06:37 PM. Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Pages (7): « First ... « 5 6 [7]   Last Thread   Next Thread
Show Printable Version | Email this Page | Subscribe to this Thread


Forum Jump:
 

Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
 
< Contact Us - The United Kennel Club >

Copyright 2003-2017, United Kennel Club
Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.3.0
(vBulletin courtesy Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.)