Registered: Dec 2013
Location:
Posts: 1514

Todd, I have talked with 2 friends this week. One has 3 cast wins and one has 5 cast wins, neither won these hunts. Would it be feasible or the correct thing to do, if you say have 4 or 5 cast wins in a yr. it would compute as a win towards GR NT. Just asking.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:

---

Originally posted by Roy Grant
Todd, I have talked with 2 friends this week. One has 3 cast wins and one has 5 cast wins, neither won these hunts. Would it be feasible or the correct thing to do, if you say have 4 or 5 cast wins in a yr. it would compute as a win towards GR NT. Just asking.

---

__________________
Michael Rosamond
Sunspot Lights
936-827-6309
http://www.sunspotlights.com/
When brightness matters!!

Home Of:
PKC Ch, Grch Grnch 2008 Tx state champion They call me Crazy Betty

PKC SCh CH Grnch They call me Howler too

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, Mich.
Posts: 6113

That has been proposed several times over the years. I guess my answer has always been do you think it's too hard to finish to Grand Nite? I think most people would say it's not which is why it has never got any traction. I can see where it would be frustrating if it were happening to you though. I do wish them luck.

__________________
If we're not suppose to eat animals, then why are they made out of meat?

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Sep 2014
Location:
Posts: 231

I believe the stats were ran one time that said 1/100 makes a Nite champion and 1/1000 Grand nites

__________________
Aint nothing but a yard dog.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3369

MY daughter went to an eighth grade graduation last night. They gave perfect attendance awards to kids that missed 5 days or less. Perfect ain't what it used to be.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Dec 2013
Location:
Posts: 1514

How are the hunts doing around the country, number wise? Here in central Il. 8 dogs would be a big hunt.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5630

It should not be that hard to get a nite champion win if there are so few dogs in the hunts. Let a dog making grand night champion mean something! I believe that it is too easy as it stands. Grand nights are a dime a dozen these days, I can not Remember seeing this many grand night champions around these parts. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Mar 2009
Location: OKLA
Posts: 1132

I've made a number of grands over the years, and to me that's the fun of it competing for the win.

__________________
Home of:
NTCH Honky Tonk Joe
GRNTCH The Duke
Dual GRNTCH Wendy
GRNTCH Cola
GrNtCH Honky Tonk Rock and Roll
Dual GRCH Bumper
Dual CH June
Dual CH Jill

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Apr 2005
Location: Franklinton,La.
Posts: 81

I believe on the local level, Gr Nites are easier to finish than ever. However I do think that for major events all plus point cast winners should get a win. If a man and his dog travel out of their local area and compete with others doing the same I feel that is at least as meaningful as a win at a local club. JMO

__________________
Home of :
GR.Nite CH. PKC CH. TONEYS MAX
CH. Nite CH. TONEYS CRY
Nite CH: TONEYS SCREAM
Nite CH. PKC CH: TONEYS SCREAM 2
NIte CH. SWEET TALKIN ANNIE
Nite CH. CH. FAYARDS BAD BERNIECE
Nite Ch.PKC Ch. Toneys Daisy

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Apr 2007
Location: gnadenhutten oh
Posts: 1436

My Grand had about 12-14 second place reg wins before getting her first and a lot of 3rds then in Nitech she came back with a lot of high scores only for the last cast to come back a little higher to beat her it is frustrating but it will come!

__________________
Ntch PR Shivers Rushcreek Shelly-Ntch Perry's Rushcreek OppyXMichells Val(passed)
Grnitech CH Wch PR Shivers Magic Buckeye-Grch Gnitech PR Dillions Smoken Blue MagicXNtch Shivers Rush Creek Shelly(passed)
ChPR Shivers Blue Belle-HoochX Shelly
Nitech Ch PR Shivers Magic Lead-MagicXHooker
Breeder and handler and half owner of Nitech Grch Grwch Grfch PR Rock Acres Brutus HTX sire MagicXShelly
Cali- Ch Wch Grnite Shivers Magic Buckeye x Dual Grand Tuff

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5630

Looks like your female was a consistent cast winner. She is the kind of dog that I like, one that is consistent. Sounds like a winner to me, one anyone could be proud to own. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Pomeroy, Ohio
Posts: 2834

I'd like to see Night Champions and Grand Night Champions drawn out together with 7 plus point cast wins to make Grand Night Champion, then 7 more plus point cast wins to make Super Grand Night Champion. I believe it would make the wins mean more and also it would help attendance at the local club level.

__________________
John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:

---

Originally posted by ov_blues
I'd like to see Night Champions and Grand Night Champions drawn out together with 7 plus point cast wins to make Grand Night Champion, then 7 more plus point cast wins to make Super Grand Night Champion. I believe it would make the wins mean more and also it would help attendance at the local club level.

---

__________________
Michael Rosamond
Sunspot Lights
936-827-6309
http://www.sunspotlights.com/
When brightness matters!!

Home Of:
PKC Ch, Grch Grnch 2008 Tx state champion They call me Crazy Betty

PKC SCh CH Grnch They call me Howler too

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 2765

I think they should all hunt together at least at the local level.

__________________
Friends don't let friends hunt blueticks

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Feb 2005
Location:
Posts: 1739

A dog that scores 800+ to 1200+ consistently will grand out quicker than one that scores 400+ to 775+ consistently.Thats at any level of competition.We all get 120 min.to score on coons .....So what is at the end of your lead that tweaking of CW's to equate to points earned towards "GRNTCH" needs addressed ?
IMO we don't need to reinvent a wheel.....just get a faster one.
We can haul the same 2 dogs to 6 hunts or 18 hunts u decide after all u feed it ..... I'll choose a 6 hunt dog.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Feb 2015
Location: Ohio
Posts: 572

The fact of the matter is... you and your dog can only compete with those you draw out with. Why not give NITECH's some kind of credit for cast wins against other NITECH's. Maybe something like 10 points and make the requirements that to become GRNITECH dog must have 5- 1st place wins or a 1st and 100 points. I'm sure others have mentioned something like this.

__________________
NITECH GRCH Gibsons Tree Leanin' Boogeyman HTX (ALH)

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Pomeroy, Ohio
Posts: 2834

For years, UKC was the main player in competition hunting, the main game in town and arguably still the main player but times are changing in our sport whether we like it or not. There are fewer hunters and more competition for UKC in the coon hunting world. The older hunters may still have that loyalty to UKC but younger hunters can look at what is available and then go to the hunts that they decide fits their needs the best. In business, one of the worst things that a company can do is say "this is how we have always done it". If the company doesn't evolve with the competition they will lose market share and then eventually may completely get squashed by the competition. I feel that the saving grace with UKC is their registry. UKC papers are still needed and are the most important set of papers for the majority of coon hound owners, but that should not make UKC complacent on wanting to be the biggest and the best arena for us to want to compete in. In my opinion a change in procedure to make dogs Nt Ch and also Gr Nt Ch, and possibly offering a Super Gr Nt Ch degree would help boost attendance at the hunts. Drawing all dogs together no matter what degree they have and also going on cast win with plus points also has several advantages.

1. More experienced judges because of less "rookies" getting drawn together.

2. More competition against seasoned dogs making the Nt Ch degree harder to obtain.

3. Less one or two dog casts.

4. Tied into the UKC performance program could give points to a cast winner so a cast win would pay like the other kennel clubs although a person would still have to wait a period of time for their money. (however UKC hunts generally have a lower entry fee)

5. Not having to compete with a feeder bucket guide wouldn't be an issue with who you draw out with. Also, some people would go ahead and guide because they might know their area might not produce a great score, but as long as they feel they could produce a cast win with some plus points they might go ahead and guide a cast anyway knowing they don't have to worry as much about the high scoring cast win.

6. Not having the quick turn loose and time out to move in order to run up a high score would help with the hunting area problems.

7. Having a Super Grand Night Champion degree would keep some people coming back and not putting their dogs on the shelf at the UKC hunts and then bringing a young dog to the hunts thus giving the young dog more time to mature and in turn give better competition when that dog is entered in the hunts.

Those are just some things that I thought of off the top of my head. I'm sure their are more and with everything, I'm sure there are some negatives but overall I feel cast wins in order to earn degrees is the better option.

__________________
John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Sep 2010
Location: New Paris, Indiana
Posts: 7076

You guys are kidding yourselves if you think any kind of rule changes or title requirement changes will increase entries. No way. The decrease in entries is caused by factors that have nothing to do with rules or titles.

This week, the discussion is how to make it easier to title a dog, next week it will be how to make it harder. This week we are losing entries because its too hard to make a NtCh and next week we will be losing entries because the titles have no credibilty because its too easy. Again, its neither. The entries are down for reasons that have nothing to do with any of the above.

With that said, this much is for sure. If you need a change in title requirements to put a title on your dog in todays hunts, you need to have a dog shoot'in and start over.

__________________
UKC Nite Champion Stylish Harry's Trixie - 2017 World Hunt Qualified - Owners - Sizemore/Martin
PKC CH/UKC GrNtCh Stylish Kate - 9/12/08 to 9/23/2016 R.I.P - Owners Sizemore/Martin
AKC/UKC NtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jeff 5/2/2000 to 1/22/2012 R.I.P.
AKC/UKC GrNtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jessi 12/21/04 to 1/21/2011 R.I.P.

Last edited by JiM on 05-27-2017 at 05:46 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5106

I agree with Jim!

If you need a change in title requirements to put a title on your dog in todays hunts, you need to have a dog shoot'in and start over.

I think this post just shows the varying levels we hunt our dogs at. If you spend your life in kindergarten and struggle to get out. Then that is the only world you see and changes to graduate are something you think about. If you experience many of the different hunts and different dogs out there and can compete on any level, in any KC. Getting any UKC title is not hard.
There are a lot of dogs out there that do nothing but go hunting and tree coons about every time they are turned loose. Get one of those. Make Grand Nite in 10-12 hunts and you will understand!

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Last edited by Bruce m. Conkey on 05-27-2017 at 06:30 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Dec 2016
Location: Ark/Miss
Posts: 524

With attendance what it is they should=Require 5 hunt wins to make Nite ch same as grands. If you've had any problem titling a dog in this decade you're either a poor handler or aren't hunting competition type dogs..

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5106

Let me add, that before this thread is completed, there will be some hurt feelings. That is another problem with coon hunting today. Somehow we don't ever separate the man from the dog. There are a lot of very good men that will give you the shirt off your back, that may not have the best dog in the world. Nothing at all wrong with that and the only person that has to be happy with the dog is the one owning it. I expect too much out of a dog. I am not going to coddle one for 2 years. Guy down the road see his dogs different and keeps and loves his dogs. Doesn't take away how that man is or how I am as a person in society. Men stand and survive on what they do. A mans dog stands and survives most of the time on how much the man likes him and not his performance. With my hounds if there is no performance, there is no liking!. Do I feel sad, sorry for the dog. Of course. I would feel worse if I kept it around.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2005
Location: Prince Edward Island,Canada
Posts: 4589

quote:

---

Originally posted by Donnie Stevens
I think they should all hunt together at least at the local level.

---

__________________
Autumn Clements

'PR'LEAD'S MIDNITE SASSY
CFC CH Canadian GCH Multi Group Placing MBPIG BBPIG LEGACYK STANNYFIELD PRIME TIME (AKC & UKC Pointed)
BPIG MBBPIG WINDAMIRS RED LIGHT DISTRICT V AMBERLANE
LEGACYK DARE TO DREAM V CBLUES
LEGACYK WHITE AS A GHOST V CBLUES

Gone but not forgotten
GRNITECH GRCH PKC CH'PR'CLEMENTS' BLUE PRANCER
GRNITECH GRCH'PR'SPIKE'S TWILITE HOOKER
'PR'PRANCER'S GETTIN DOWN N DIRTY (PrancerxHooker)
NITECH CH’PR’BUELL’S BLUE ROCKY(Whitey x Spice)
CKC BBPIG MARIES BABY BREEZE

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

I don't think some of you understand that the vast majority of hunters do not have another one in the shoot ready to go as soon as they finish the one they are working on. Like Bruce just mentioned it doesn't take a really good one more than 12 hunts or so to be finished. That's normally 3 or 4 months of hunts. Who has another one lined up and ready in 4 months? So there is a large gap of time before that guy comes back, probably a year or 2. Make it so they can continue to hunt and the numbers will get stronger.

I haven't hunted one hardly in years. With this one I started in January and I will be done this month. Then I will be gone to play with the other guys. Put something in place so me and many others can come back.

__________________
Michael Rosamond
Sunspot Lights
936-827-6309
http://www.sunspotlights.com/
When brightness matters!!

Home Of:
PKC Ch, Grch Grnch 2008 Tx state champion They call me Crazy Betty

PKC SCh CH Grnch They call me Howler too

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Dec 2016
Location: Ark/Miss
Posts: 524

Don't fix the the problem from the back, start at the front. Make competition at the reg. level tougher. It would save UKC a lot on paperwork and make the title mean something again.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Registered: Dec 2013
Location:
Posts: 1514

I just put this out there for opinions, WOW. But they are like a$$ holes everyone has one. My 2 friends do not live in central Il. 1 in Indiana 2 in central Mo. just to set you straight. If you don't think coon hunting is not a dying sport you are living a dream.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged