Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1278

quote:

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Originally posted by pamjohnson
people,,, who are people? The only 1 that matters is the judge. Now how is he supposed to know your dog? Is that his job?
Yes your dog may well be a honest track dog. Why should the judge decide if your dog is honest or any other dog in the cast is honest.
That is part of the problem with the babbling rule. There is know question about it rules need changed so you and your dog quit having this issue.

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IT SEEMS THAT EVERYTIME A BREED OR LINE OF DOGS GET POPULAR IT EVENTUALLY LEADS TO ITS RUINATION BY UNINFORMED PEOPLE BREEDING WITHOUT DOING THEIR RESEARCH FIRST.

Gone but never forgotten:
NtChGrCh Dryfork Punkin
NtChGrCh Dryfork Little Blue Baby Doll
2009 Pa Show Dog Of The Year
GrCh Dryfork Little Black Book
Gr.Ch. Make My Day Sunny
Gone too soon RIP my baby girl
Gr.Ch. Black Dog Black Cherry
GrCh Dryfork Black Dog Raine
One of kind and would make a believer out of you when you thought there were no coon left
Home of:
2009,2013,2018 Pa. State
Show Handler Of The Year
CH. Power Pack Pepper
2018 Pa. Show Dog Of Year
Gr.Ch. Batman's Poison Ivy
2011&2013 WTDA Pa State Champion
2011&2013 Overall Hunt For The Cure
Ch. Jay's Greenridge Heidi
In memory of my best friend "Jay"

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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
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Just like I said before, those who have not seen such a dog, do not believe believe a dog can do these things. There is a big difference in a dog opening on other dogs tracks and a real closed nosed dog leading the pack, running and treeing coons that other dogs can not even smell. I have seen hundreds of pretty good coonhounds in my 60 plus years of coon Hunting and only 2 dogs that were truly exceptional cold nosed, run in front, coon treeing machines, that showed coons in their trees to prove what they were doing. I guess that I am lucky, as it seems most people have not ever seen one..Lol. Dave

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Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

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Location: Marietta
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Pat does she win all her cast is she a ntch or Grntch ?


Are you going to breed her ?


Tar

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Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Does the track always warm up to the point that the other dogs start opening before they tree or does she tree coons at the end of her tracks and the other dogs never open and are just milling around when you get to the tree? Does the track sometimes slow down when the other dogs start opening?
You are right there are cold noses track dogs that can sometimes run and open on tracks that other dogs can't smell. I have had a couple. But they are few and far between. On the other hand, there are a whole lot of dog trackers that can sure make it sound good. When all of the other hunters in your area think that you have a dog tracker... just maybe you do. When you hunt a dog in your local hunts all of your fellow hunters know that it is a babbler and that is when you get minused. You don't usually see it happening at bigger hunts where everyone is a stranger.

Last edited by Richard Lambert on 06-06-2019 at 09:55 PM

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Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
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Does the track always warm up to the point that the other dogs start opening before they tree or does she tree coons at the end of her tracks and the other dogs never open and are just milling around when you get to the tree? Does the track sometimes slow down when the other dogs start opening?

Richard to answer these questions.. First question .It happens both ways . I had one particular one I remember that I hunted with that was a nite champ. Never opened with her. Actually ended up treed on a gulf course tree, Coming across the green guy says I see the coon. We could see his dog was milling and rearing the tree and when we got to the tree it me too tree barked some but not like it really wanted to.
Had another time I remember three dogs never treed with her. One opened a few times they were all there but acted liked they had no idea what was going on.And she came on that tree like a banshee .Blowing the top out hard.
More often they eventually will open with her and finish the tracks with her. But usually after she has went some different distances at times.
And no the tracks do not seem to slow down when the others finally open with her. My recollection is they just continue a seemingly normal track.If nothing else better once she starts getting some help .

__________________
IT SEEMS THAT EVERYTIME A BREED OR LINE OF DOGS GET POPULAR IT EVENTUALLY LEADS TO ITS RUINATION BY UNINFORMED PEOPLE BREEDING WITHOUT DOING THEIR RESEARCH FIRST.

Gone but never forgotten:
NtChGrCh Dryfork Punkin
NtChGrCh Dryfork Little Blue Baby Doll
2009 Pa Show Dog Of The Year
GrCh Dryfork Little Black Book
Gr.Ch. Make My Day Sunny
Gone too soon RIP my baby girl
Gr.Ch. Black Dog Black Cherry
GrCh Dryfork Black Dog Raine
One of kind and would make a believer out of you when you thought there were no coon left
Home of:
2009,2013,2018 Pa. State
Show Handler Of The Year
CH. Power Pack Pepper
2018 Pa. Show Dog Of Year
Gr.Ch. Batman's Poison Ivy
2011&2013 WTDA Pa State Champion
2011&2013 Overall Hunt For The Cure
Ch. Jay's Greenridge Heidi
In memory of my best friend "Jay"

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Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1278

quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Pat does she win all her cast is she a ntch or Grntch ?

Are you going to breed her ?

Tar

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__________________
IT SEEMS THAT EVERYTIME A BREED OR LINE OF DOGS GET POPULAR IT EVENTUALLY LEADS TO ITS RUINATION BY UNINFORMED PEOPLE BREEDING WITHOUT DOING THEIR RESEARCH FIRST.

Gone but never forgotten:
NtChGrCh Dryfork Punkin
NtChGrCh Dryfork Little Blue Baby Doll
2009 Pa Show Dog Of The Year
GrCh Dryfork Little Black Book
Gr.Ch. Make My Day Sunny
Gone too soon RIP my baby girl
Gr.Ch. Black Dog Black Cherry
GrCh Dryfork Black Dog Raine
One of kind and would make a believer out of you when you thought there were no coon left
Home of:
2009,2013,2018 Pa. State
Show Handler Of The Year
CH. Power Pack Pepper
2018 Pa. Show Dog Of Year
Gr.Ch. Batman's Poison Ivy
2011&2013 WTDA Pa State Champion
2011&2013 Overall Hunt For The Cure
Ch. Jay's Greenridge Heidi
In memory of my best friend "Jay"

Last edited by Pat Bizich on 06-07-2019 at 12:32 AM

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Location: Marietta
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Reason why I asked is I have a life long friend that ownes part of a $$$$ kc he likes black dogs his female is tops but came down with coondog paralysis and is coming back from it. We both like a dominating track dog. Now my story I have had a lot of above average track dogs because of the bloodline I hunt. But this one litter I raised out of my dual grand yadkin tar deacon dog was above the rest. I bred deacon to a daughter of George majors moves dog and a she was a granddaughter of flatrock thrasher there was three pups grchntch macie ( my grch ntch female I am hunting nows dam ) grntch hell female granny ( my young dogs dam ) and grntch yadkin tar boomer boomer was absolutely a track dog like no other he might strike honest second to last strike but on a cold track he would open the other dogs are trying to figure it out and then three hundred yards out he would open six or so times then when the dogs get to where he last barked he was anouther 300 yards he would have dogs scattered everywhere trying to stay with him sometimes we would get to the tree before they did.


Tar

Last edited by yadkintar on 06-07-2019 at 01:11 AM

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quote:

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Originally posted by Preacher Tom
I hunt quite often with Chuck often and would say his dogs are a little more like the old fashioned dogs we used to hunt. Not everyone would like them but they tree coons and I think Chuck enjoys his dogs as much or more than anyone I know. So he lives by what he just said "hunt the type of dog you like to hunt, nothing else really matters."

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quote:

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Originally posted by Preacher Tom
I hunt quite often with Chuck often and would say his dogs are a little more like the old fashioned dogs we used to hunt. Not everyone would like them but they tree coons and I think Chuck enjoys his dogs as much or more than anyone I know. So he lives by what he just said "hunt the type of dog you like to hunt, nothing else really matters."

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When the law of the land becomes unjust outlaws will rise to take their place in history.

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Registered: Feb 2015
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 1108

Chuck if we could have gotten a couple of coon to look at us we would have thought it was a good night. Just too grown up and leafy. But I enjoyed every minute of it.

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Tom Wood

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You guys sound like my kind of coonhunter, men who like the sport and each other's companionship. I wish you were closer, I know I would enjoy hunting with you guys. Dave

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Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Last edited by Dave Richards on 06-08-2019 at 02:40 AM

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Dave your welcome anytime. Got 2 extra bedrooms.

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Tom Wood

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Thanks for the invite, it's really hard for me to get away these days with the horses and animals to tend too. I might be able to swing it some time. I honestly would consider it a privilege to hunt with you guys. Dave

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Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

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I think a lot of people are confusing cold nose with no nose. Most dogs I see that open on tracks but can't seem move them, either can't smell good enough to move it or don't have the brains to move it . That's the reason you see so many so- called den trees . I hunted the same strain for several decades , most of the dogs are one way track dogs with good speed when we get one that's not it goes to the cull pile. That's how you fix the problem!

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I love it when you've been standing out there awhile listening to one standing on his head going around in circles and they're bragging about his great cold nose.It only makes sense if he can smell it good enough to strike it ,it should get better the longer he follows it ,not stay the same or get worse.I love to hear the guys with the cold nosed dogs complaining about their dog doing all the work and then the hot nosed dog coming and stealing the first tree.If your dog has the nose to trail a track that mine can't smell,by the time it gets good enough for mine to even smell,your's should be running it like a hot track.He should be so far ahead that there's no competition for tree.

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I think a lot of dogs have a cold nose, but what I think everyone is looking for is cold nose and move the track quickly the right direction. Now those dogs are uncommon.

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Tom Wood

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quote:

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Originally posted by Preacher Tom
I think a lot of dogs have a cold nose, but what I think everyone is looking for is cold nose and move the track quickly the right direction. Now those dogs are uncommon.

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Dan

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I remember a conversation I once had with Dave Dean at the 1989 BBCHA Spring hunt in Ashland,Ohio. We were talking about track dogs and specifically, cold nosed track dogs. He told about being at a UKC hunt with Hammer II and drawing out with a nationally known blue dog that was heavily promoted as being a cold nosed dog that would run tracks most other dogs couldn't. Seems the Hammer II dog got struck 1st on an older track drifted it out opening here and there as he went and after 20-30 minutes fell treed. The other dogs wouldn't or couldn't honor Hammer II on the track but did get in on the tree. After scoring on the coon they leashed up and walked off a ways. Dave said one of the fellas turned to him and said now let's see how that dog of yours runs a cold track. Dave said I looked him in the eye and said "You just did!"

Many people are of the impression that a cold nosed dog has to straddle a track and potter a long like a blood hound. Not so.

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Dan

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Another issue is that not all cold tracks go anywhere much. Some are where a coon has fed and messed around a lot in a 100 yd circle. It still takes a coon dog to know which of the many trees the coon has been in that he is still in. It's nice when a cold track works up to a hotter track but doesn't always happen.

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Tom Wood

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quote:

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Originally posted by DL NH
I remember a conversation I once had with Dave Dean at the 1989 BBCHA Spring hunt in Ashland,Ohio. We were talking about track dogs and specifically, cold nosed track dogs. He told about being at a UKC hunt with Hammer II and drawing out with a nationally known blue dog that was heavily promoted as being a cold nosed dog that would run tracks most other dogs couldn't. Seems the Hammer II dog got struck 1st on an older track drifted it out opening here and there as he went and after 20-30 minutes fell treed. The other dogs wouldn't or couldn't honor Hammer II on the track but did get in on the tree. After scoring on the coon they leashed up and walked off a ways. Dave said one of the fellas turned to him and said now let's see how that dog of yours runs a cold track. Dave said I looked him in the eye and said "You just did!"

Many people are of the impression that a cold nosed dog has to straddle a track and potter a long like a blood hound. Not so.

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Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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quote:

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Originally posted by Preacher Tom
Another issue is that not all cold tracks go anywhere much. Some are where a coon has fed and messed around a lot in a 100 yd circle. It still takes a coon dog to know which of the many trees the coon has been in that he is still in. It's nice when a cold track works up to a hotter track but doesn't always happen.

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Dan

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quote:

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Originally posted by DL NH
This is very true..........and rarely found in a coon hound! Could part of the reason be that most don't have the patience to allow a hound that evidences this raw talent the time to develop its skill? Same with cold trailing. How many have the patience to sit and allow a hound to work out a track? Though I believe this ability is an inherited trait, I also believe as handlers we have to be patient at times and allow our hounds to develop. Personally I don't think you start seeing the best a hound has to offer until they're well into their 3rd year. Seems to me that's when their confidence begins to really meld with their inheritance. I think this applies to any hound no matter what game they pursue.

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Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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Registered: Feb 2015
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 1108

Kinda a funny story that happened about 25 years ago. I had a grade B&T female that's mother was found at the town dump. Called this female Weegee. Was getting out of hunting for a little while so put her up for sale. Now in my opinion she was a good dog but not a great dog. Anyway two guys come to try her. One (not the buyer) had a grand night. He told the other guy not to expect my dog to work with his because his dog was very cold nosed. We strike an old track that they work for probably 25 minutes. His dog comes in and mine trails across a gravel road and trees the coon. The guy bought my dog but I will tell you she was only average on a cold track.

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Tom Wood

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quote:

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Originally posted by DL NH
This is very true..........and rarely found in a coon hound! Could part of the reason be that most don't have the patience to allow a hound that evidences this raw talent the time to develop its skill? Same with cold trailing. How many have the patience to sit and allow a hound to work out a track? Though I believe this ability is an inherited trait, I also believe as handlers we have to be patient at times and allow our hounds to develop. Personally I don't think you start seeing the best a hound has to offer until they're well into their 3rd year. Seems to me that's when their confidence begins to really meld with their inheritance. I think this applies to any hound no matter what game they pursue.

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When the law of the land becomes unjust outlaws will rise to take their place in history.

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