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Will M.
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2005
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 74

It's already happening. What was it 44 wolves killed this year in MI. MN. And the most in WI. And that's just how many were found. How many where shot and never found?

It's a shame that the courts are playing wildlife managers and forcing normally honest citizens to take actions on protecting their property. Mange seam’s to be hitting the yotes this year fairly hard. Maybe it will carry over to their cousins?

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Old Post 02-06-2010 12:26 AM
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hellcat
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1522

Jay

That just sucks, I wish you well in your future hunts <HINT HINT>

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Old Post 02-06-2010 01:30 AM
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byersboy86
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Registered: Jan 2008
Location: Alton,nh
Posts: 260

I cant even imagine... Sorry for youe Loss

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rmcmillan
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2007
Location: WESTERN MARYLAND
Posts: 5948

Sorry for your loss guys. They need to do something now, before someone finds a kid like that.

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Old Post 02-07-2010 02:57 PM
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Kyle W. Graf
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Park Falls, WI.
Posts: 487

quote:
Originally posted by rmcmillan
Sorry for your loss guys. They need to do something now, before someone finds a kid like that.


The arrogant jerks wont even admit that is possible. When you tell them how some wolves behave they treat you like you don't understand animal behavior.

They will never have to admit they are wrong because citizens are taking matters into their own hands and saving the DNR from themselves.

It took a long time to get them to admit that wolves will kill when they are not hungry.
Kyle

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Old Post 02-08-2010 05:55 AM
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Iceman197
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2010
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 13

Yes, Kyle is right. When our dogs were attacked this summer and we called the DNR, the don't even send out one of their own guys, the send out a guy from the USDA! He is kind of a mediator in a sense. But even him, he came out and had to measure all of the bite marks and what-nots and he would say things like, "well how do you know this wasn't just a mean bear that did this to your dogs" Dads reply, I seen it happen, I saw the wolves! Which was completely true. Then even though my father had watched it happen, the guy went and measured the teeth marks, and would say, "well, these canine teeth marks are right on the border of being too big for a wolf, it might have been a bear..." It was rediculous, they don't want to admitt to anything. Luckily on all four of our hounds and the vet (who has delt with wolf attacks alread), there were canine teeth marks that did match completely of that of a wolf. So it was classified as a wolf attack and then he did admitt that there was a wolf pack right in the same area the year before, that was kind of hush hush, where the wolves had killed a dog. He also said, "that the blame does not lie on the shoulders of the DNR, its the politicians that want to keep the wolves on the endangered list, the DNR wants a season on them just as bad as the hunters." Which is completely untrue! The politicians have their hands completely tied. They are not the ones that are doing the population estimates and are out in the field, THE DNR are the ones that are doing the population estimates! If they were giving the true population estimates, then the politicians would have a little sway in passing bills for a season. But right now, the DNR says there are 600+ wolves, which we all know is no where near the real population, and they set those numbers on the politician's desk, that is what the politicians have to go off of, well, 600+ wolves across the whole state does not sound like that much, so no, there will not be any bills passed to make a season or management plan. But if the DNR said there are 2,000+ wolves, which would be more accurate (but still probably low estimate), then the politicians could voice their thoughts about a control plan.

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Old Post 02-08-2010 04:07 PM
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Kyle W. Graf
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Park Falls, WI.
Posts: 487

I don't know if Todd is still following this but he can tell his co-worker there have been three wolf attacks in WI. in less than two months.

http://dnr.wi.gov/org/land/er/mamma...f/dogdepred.htm


WI. had the wolf off of the endangered species list. The wolf was upgraded to threatened. They said in interviews that there would not be a wolf season. They would use the quota that could be killed to take wolves predating on livestock. To the pet owner on public land their message was tough luck don't turn your dog loose if you don't want it killed. It was however legal to kill them on your own property if they were attacking your dog. A man six miles from my house killed the first legally killed wolf in his yard. His dog wandered out into the hay field where it encountered the wolf and ran home. The man ran into the house and came back out with a gun. The dog was uninjured.

The Endangered Species Act has a clause that allows a judge to put a species on the endangered list if there is doubt whether that species is being managed properly. The Anti Hunting Groups challenged the WI. DNR's management plan and got the wolf placed back on the endangered list. To do this they must present some evidence that the management plan is not sound. The Judge must error in favor of the species in question.

The DNR being the wimpy Government Employees that they are play the role of the victim and whine about how bad they have it rather than make sure they have an iron clad management plan like someone working in the private sector would. The biggest problem I see is the same as with any Government Agency. They know they will not be fired for anything other than not complying with their superiors. That is how the last Wolf Biologist got terminated. He said that these wolves were going to have conflicts with humans and needed to be controlled. This took place before the first wolf depredation. The only hope is to find a way to keep the bunny huggers out of DNR positions.
Kyle

Last edited by Kyle W. Graf on 02-09-2010 at 04:50 PM

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josh tetting
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Farmington WI.
Posts: 644

grntch Ice age rage

was the last dog to get attacked he got it last wednesday in oconto county he was treeing a cat and they came rite in the tree to him he survived thank god but they chewed him up pretty good
luckly hes a big dog thats real fast or hed be dead, and also thanks to the garmin gps if he had a beep beep collar on hed be dead aswell

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Old Post 02-10-2010 01:33 AM
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fatboy77
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2006
Location: CENTRAL WI
Posts: 831

Re: grntch Ice age rage

quote:
Originally posted by josh tetting
was the last dog to get attacked he got it last wednesday in oconto county he was treeing a cat and they came rite in the tree to him he survived thank god but they chewed him up pretty good
luckly hes a big dog thats real fast or hed be dead, and also thanks to the garmin gps if he had a beep beep collar on hed be dead aswell



glad rage wasnt killed i hunted with him this summer
he must have luck on his side i would say the garmin helped out alot

how many wolves did they think was there

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moonshinerSD
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2007
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 72

wolves

had a friend hunting a young dog for me in northern minn.last winter turned out on a bobcat track ,a she got split up from other dog by the time they tracked her down , the wolves had got her,he was very upset about this and said the population was getting to be too much.

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Old Post 02-14-2010 02:08 AM
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rmcmillan
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2007
Location: WESTERN MARYLAND
Posts: 5948

HSUS & WOLVES

June 29, 2009

Settlement Restores Endangered Species Act Protections To Great Lakes Wolves

The Humane Society of the United States

WASHINGTON — In a victory for the gray wolf, a coalition of wolf advocates led by The Humane Society of the United States has reached a settlement with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service to restore federal Endangered Species Act protections for wolves in the Great Lakes region, including the states of Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin.

The settlement comes in response to a motion filed by The HSUS, the Center for Biological Diversity, Help Our Wolves Live, Friends of Animals and Their Environment and Born Free USA. The motion sought an immediate injunction to halt the killing of wolves pending resolution of the case, which the groups filed two weeks ago.

This is the sixth time in the last five years that a federal government decision to strip wolves of Endangered Species Act protections has been stopped through legal action, but the settlement does not prevent the administration from making another attempt to de-list wolves and turn their fate over to state killing plans.

"We applaud the Obama administration for restoring federal protections for wolves in the Great Lakes," said Jonathan Lovvorn, vice president and chief counsel for animal protection litigation with The HSUS. "This agreement will give the administration a much-needed opportunity to reconsider the failed wolf-management policies of the past, and hopefully put to rest the states' reckless plans to start sport hunting and trapping imperiled wolves."

The suit challenged the federal government's decision to remove all Endangered Species Act protections for gray wolves in the western Great Lakes region – a decision that would have allowed hostile state wildlife agencies to subject the wolves to widespread and indiscriminate killings at the hands of state agents, farmers and trophy hunters. Some of the state management plans allow a nearly 50 percent reduction of the region's wolf population.

"Poaching and persecution remain severe threats to wolves in the upper Midwest and elsewhere," said Michael Robinson, conservation advocate for the Center for Biological Diversity. "Wolf recovery has made tremendous strides, but with wolves occupying roughly five percent of their historic range, the job is not yet finished."

Last week, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reported that the Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources intends to implement sport hunting and trapping seasons for wolves if they are ever successfully stripped of federal Endangered Species Act protection. The management plans for Minnesota and Michigan also allow for the establishment of future recreational hunting and trapping of wolves.

"The court's decision is great news for wolves and for the integrity of science in government decision-making," said Nicole Paquette, senior vice president of Born Free USA. "We hope that the Fish and Wildlife Service will honestly assess the scientific information it previously refused to review."

The plaintiffs are represented pro bono by the law firm Faegre & Benson. The settlement will be submitted to the federal district court for the District of Columbia today for final approval.



-30-



The Humane Society of the United States is the nation's largest animal protection organization — backed by 11 million Americans, or one of every 28. For more than a half-century, The HSUS has been fighting for the protection of all animals through advocacy, education and hands-on programs. Celebrating animals and confronting cruelty — On the web at humanesociety.org.

The Center for Biological Diversity is a non-profit organization dedicated to securing a future for all species hovering on the brink of extinction. More information is available at biologicaldiversity.org.

Help Our Wolves Live is a Minnesota nonprofit organization, dedicated to the protection and preservation of the gray wolf, lynx, and other endangered or threatened predator species. HOWL has over 200 members, many of whom live in the State of Minnesota.

Friends of Animals and Their Environment is a Minnesota nonprofit organization committed to the protection of animals and the ecosystems on which they depend. FATE has approximately 200 members and supporters who regularly advocate on behalf of animals, and in particular wolves.

Born Free USA works to alleviate captive animal suffering, rescue individual animals, protect wildlife — including highly endangered species — in their natural habitats, and encourage compassionate conservation globally. More at bornfreeusa.org.
DonateSign UpTake ActionMedia Contact List2 Related ContentResource: Fact Sheet



THIS IS TERRIBLE.

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Old Post 02-14-2010 02:33 AM
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rmcmillan
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Wisconsin DNR Page on WOLVES

Wolves and Hunting Dogs in Wisconsin
A Guide for Reducing Conflict Between Wolves and Hunting Dogs
Provided by the Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources, USDA-APHIS- Wildlife Services, Wisconsin Bear Hunters Association, National Wildlife Federation, Wisconsin Wildlife Federation, and the Timber Wolf Alliance.

Wolves in Wisconsin
Europeans began settling Wisconsin in the early 1800's, and at the time as many as 3,000 to 5,000 wolves may have existed in the area. However, Europeans often had much more negative attitudes toward wolves, and soon began programs to eliminate wolves. A state bounty was placed on wolves in Wisconsin in 1865, and lasted until 1957. By 1900, wolves had disappeared from southern Wisconsin. In 1950, less than 50 wolves remained in extreme northern Wisconsin. In 1957 wolves were listed as a protected species, but the wolf population was down to a handful of wolves, and in 1960 it was considered extinct. In 1967 and 1974 the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service designated the timber wolf a federally endangered species. In 1975, wolves began to re-colonize Wisconsin in the northwest portions of the state, along the Minnesota border. Wolves were not reintroduced into the state, but moved in on their own. Wisconsin listed the timber wolf a state endangered species in 1975.

In 1999 wolves were reclassified to state threatened status with 205 wolves in the state. By 2002 wolves were distributed across much of the heavily forested portions of northwest and north central Wisconsin, and were starting to spread into forests of the northeastern part of the state. Wolves were federally reclassified to threatened on April 1, 2003, but on January 31, 2005 wolves were relisted as endangered due to a lawsuit. In Wisconsin and other states in the western Great Lakes region was were removed from the federal list of threatened and endangered species in this region on March 12, 2007. On September 29, 2008, as a result of a district court decision in Washington, D.C., wolves were again listed as endangered in Wisconsin.

Today, Wisconsin's wolf population is 540 with 436 in the northern forest region, 72 in Wisconsin's central forest region, and 32 in other portions of central Wisconsin.


Wolf Conflicts with Dogs

As with other wild canids, wolves are very territorial. Wolves guard their territories from other wolves, coyotes, and domestic dogs. Wolves are probably most aggressive toward strange wolves and dogs when wolf pups are small at den and rendezvous sites, during the breeding season in January and February, and when they are protecting a fresh kill. Packs use rendezvous sites from mid June to late September, after the pups are big enough to leave their den. Adult wolves are very defensive of pups at rendezvous sites and will attack other predators, including dogs, that get too close to the rendezvous site or the pups. Hound dogs used for hunting bear, coyotes, bobcat, and raccoons, are perhaps at greatest risk of being attacked by wolves. Dogs used for bird hunting are less likely to be attacked. Wolves normally avoid people and are less likely to approach dogs that are in visual or auditory range of humans.

Hounds often hunt some distance from hunters, and their baying sound may also present a challenge to the territorial wolves. Highest risk of wolf depredation to dogs seems to occur in July through September, and a moderately high risk occurs in December. These periods signal the summer rendezvous period, and the approach of the winter breeding season.

Reducing Conflict of Wolves with Dogs
Avoidance of wolves, by hunters with dogs is the best way to minimize conflict, but because wolves are so wide spread, total avoidance may not be possible. Although wolves do have large territories, they do concentrate a lot of activity in specific areas, such as the rendezvous sites. One of the keys for minimizing wolf problems with dogs is to avoid areas with concentrated wolf use.

Move 2 or 3 miles from any rendezvous site, if possible, before releasing dogs. Avoid releasing dogs at baits recently visited by wolves. When looking for bear sign at a bait, make sure to also look for wolf tracks. Be familiar with your own dog's tracks, so that you can distinguish it from any wolf tracks. If a specific bait site is receiving a lot of wolf use, discontinue using it until wolves have left, and concentrate on an alternative bait site....

More information on these topics as well as identifying wolf signs, what to do if your dog is killed or injured by a wolf, canid track identification, and other contacts is available in a printable version:


Wolves and Hunting Dogs in Wisconsin [PDF 780KB

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Old Post 02-14-2010 03:41 AM
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Kelli
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Laurens, South Carolina
Posts: 347

Josh Tetting.....how long did it take for them to do that to the dog in the pictures? That's horrible. Is it something that happened in a matter of minutes or did it take a while to find the dog? Never seen anything like that before.

No wolves in my area....coyotes and feral dogs are bad enough. Wolves can be much more serious, I imagine. So sorry to everyone who has lost hounds to them.

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Old Post 02-14-2010 11:26 PM
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bz dog80
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 10

Kelli, I can't speak for Josh but the wolf kills that I have seen take only minutes! By the time you can get there it is usually to late. You are very lucky if you can stop it.

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Old Post 02-15-2010 03:12 PM
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Kelli
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Laurens, South Carolina
Posts: 347

And they can be completely ripped apart like that in only minutes? Well, I guess so if there were enough wolves. WOW..... That just absolutely tears my nerves up. My heart goes out to the people who have had this happen.

I'm just asking questions because I don't really know that much about wolves except what I've seen on TV or read in books....most of which glorify the wolf. Never really gave them much more thought.

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David Boggs
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Registered: Dec 2006
Location: Sandy Hook, KY
Posts: 1009

a good wolf

is a dead wolf

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Old Post 02-18-2010 09:01 AM
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Cat and bear
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2007
Location: Northern WI
Posts: 126

dogs treeing

I heard the old timers say years ago, when a dog was killed by a wolf, they would go back to that area, put a few dogs treeing, and the wolves would come running right in to the dogs. Once wolves killed their first dog, it was an easy set up.

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cedarhillkennel
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2009
Location: chesterfield va.
Posts: 549

this topic intrest me a great bit........now i live in virginia so i dont know first hand about wolf's execpt what ive heard here and read.
let me ask a few questions..........first,is this the grey wolf or timber wolf doing this.
i have heard a few diffrent things on what species they actually are.
second question is does the DNR or other federal agencey reimbursing the houndmens losses?

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jay ritchie
New UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2008
Location: troy montana
Posts: 9

These are grey wolves, and the DNR, F@G and all the rest could not care less and don't consider hounds worthy of reimbursement! They are not livestock so tough, doesn't matter how much you paid for or have in a dog!

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Old Post 02-18-2010 11:52 PM
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josh tetting
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Farmington WI.
Posts: 644

in wisconsin

if your dog is hurt or mamed by wolves and can be proven you get vet bills paid up to not exceeding 2500 if your dog is killed and can be proven you can get up to but not exceeding 2500

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Old Post 02-19-2010 12:30 AM
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Dan Dogs
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Platteville, Wi
Posts: 5676

but isn't it also true, that once a dog is killed in a certain area and documented. the dnr will not payout anymore, because they say your hunting at your own risk.. being a kill was reported..just another way for them to cover there a$$es..and not pay out.

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Old Post 02-19-2010 01:05 AM
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jay ritchie
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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: troy montana
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Maybe that's how it works in Wisconsin, but here in Montana they either deny that wolves did the damage, or flat out say sorry, but we can't help ya! Our hounds were killed on a ridge where the wolves den, they knew it, but the public had no idea! Obviously, if we had any idea, we would have avoided that are like the plague! I think it is an inexcusable act on their part to allow us and our animals to suffer because they withhold that information. They post grizzley bear hot spots...why not do the same for known wolf dens? Bottom line is... were screwed and they could really care less!

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Old Post 02-19-2010 01:34 AM
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Bear dog 99
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 110

payout

quote:
Originally posted by Dan Dogs
but isn't it also true, that once a dog is killed in a certain area and documented. the dnr will not payout anymore, because they say your hunting at your own risk.. being a kill was reported..just another way for them to cover there a$$es..and not pay out.
As far as I know they never got that thru.When Nik's dog was killed in September they paid out,the following July another group of hunters had wolves come to the tree and hurt 3 dogs,about 3.5 miles north and they covered his vet bills. Karl

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Old Post 02-20-2010 05:24 AM
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byersboy86
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2008
Location: Alton,nh
Posts: 260

Mike

LMAO. ive heard of that being done for them pesky yotes

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Old Post 02-20-2010 03:21 PM
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mpondr310
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 315

For Wisconsin....
When they were off the endangered list they would only pay out once for the area that the depredation took place, however, once the wolves were put back on the endangered list they have to pay out for ever incident.

We lost a dog last summer and almost got screwed out of reimbursement because another dog got attacked 3 miles away a few months prior. The warden that assisted us said that we wouldn't be paid, so we did a little research and found out that the warden was incorrect.

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Old Post 02-20-2010 05:13 PM
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