Registered: Dec 2007
Location: iowa
Posts: 330

When a cast gets down to just two dogs we need to make it mandatory that there is a third voting party, either one of the cast members stay or the two remaining dogs and handlers return to the club for a third voting member.Reason being if scoring a tree and one person. Votes to minus and the other handler votes to circle its deleted. This happened this weekend at one of the Zones and kept a dog from advancing to the finals I talked to Allen at UKC today he said to contact your breed association. I have already contacted the Walker Association . Please contact your Breed Association this could happen to you. We need to get this changed

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Registered: Aug 2012
Location:
Posts: 930

I agree

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Lockridge Iowa
Posts: 2844

I must not be getting it, but how does this keep a dog from advancing? What would be the purpose of making another rule?

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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
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I believe the poster was suggesting that with only 2 members left in s cast, that any scoring situation could result in a tie and thus deleted points. I.e. coon seen by one and not the other etc. At least this is how I understood the rationale behind the request. Dave

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Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

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Registered: Dec 2007
Location: iowa
Posts: 330

Exactly Dave and in this case, they were tied, dog was treed on a tree that should have been minused, but one voted to minus and the other voted to circle and since it was deleted that made him the cast winner.

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Registered: Sep 2010
Location: New Paris, Indiana
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A number of really bad things can happen with only two voters left. For one thing, the judge cannot be out voted. That means a judge with a dog in the hunt is king. Every coon seen can be circled by the other guy. Same with every slick, circled by the other guy. It's just a completely unacceptable situation. But I think it is also one with little to no chance of getting changed.

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22462

So you are saying that if one dog is treed .7 in front of you and another dog is treed .7 behind you, then you "have" to walk to both dogs because the 2 other handlers might not agree? You can't withdraw and go back to the club or home.
Or 2 handlers minus your dog for coming back to meet you so you can't win and withdraw. Then you "have" to walk .7 to their tree to help them score it.
Why should the third handler "have" to stay in and babysit the other 2 handlers? Now that will really bring more handers to the hunts. I realize that their are times when you would like to have another voting member, but you have to consider that other member also.

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Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
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It's called keeping the cast honest, you know you would want it that way. It might be you the next time, walking is just part of the hunt. Dave

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Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

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Location: Lockridge Iowa
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quote:

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Originally posted by Dave Richards
I believe the poster was suggesting that with only 2 members left in s cast, that any scoring situation could result in a tie and thus deleted points. I.e. coon seen by one and not the other etc. At least this is how I understood the rationale behind the request. Dave

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Lockridge Iowa
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quote:

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Originally posted by D Brothers
Exactly Dave and in this case, they were tied, dog was treed on a tree that should have been minused, but one voted to minus and the other voted to circle and since it was deleted that made him the cast winner.

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Registered: Aug 2012
Location:
Posts: 930

quote:

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Originally posted by Dave Richards
It's called keeping the cast honest, you know you would want it that way. It might be you the next time, walking is just part of the hunt. Dave

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Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
Posts: 1110

quote:

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Originally posted by swamp1
Agreed, any interpretation except honesty is cheating. If you can't walk to a dog treed in hunt, stay on the porch!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: The Hawkeye State
Posts: 1317

It would also put a small clubs in a pinch,some are allready scrambling for guides, those" extra voters"could be hard to come by....

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Registered: Nov 2017
Location: East Texas
Posts: 90

If I withdraw or minus out I always stay and help with the rest of the hunt...but that's just me...i really just like to see the outcome of the cast and watch the other dogs work ...

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Greg Burks

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Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Not saying what should or shouldn't be done buuuuuut put a collar on the tree $50 to put a question on the card panel goes to the tree you loose the question you loose your $$$ and get a vacation already works at the other kc's.




Tar

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Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Southern Illinois.
Posts: 54

If the handler didn't make a bad call Saturday then it wouldn't have went down to a vote. Half the problems in these hunts are people screw themself, but someone else stile their cast. You should know ukc rules when you enter, don't cry later.

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Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Not saying what should or shouldn't be done buuuuuut put a collar on the tree $50 to put a question on the card panel goes to the tree you loose the question you loose your $$$ and get a vacation already works at the other kc's.




Tar

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Registered: Aug 2012
Location:
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quote:

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Originally posted by Billy George
It would also put a small clubs in a pinch,some are allready scrambling for guides, those" extra voters"could be hard to come by....

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: S. Ga.
Posts: 4608

quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
Not saying what should or shouldn't be done buuuuuut put a collar on the tree $50 to put a question on the card panel goes to the tree you loose the question you loose your $$$ and get a vacation already works at the other kc's.
Tar

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James Lawrence, Big Slough Kennels

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Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Make it $100 then it's a deterrent and it works !!

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Registered: Jul 2015
Location: mo
Posts: 749

Plan a scratch him if it's that obvious of a slick tree, For unsportsman like behavior. I don't think being a cheating sob is considered being a good sportsman. Plan b slap him upside the head and leave him there and go get a panel to help pack him out. Now if it is questionable figure that's how luck goes sometimes and suck it up buttercup.

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Registered: Jun 2014
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3370

It's impossible to make enough rules to stop cheating. Integrity is what's lacking and you won't fix it with rules.

Last edited by shadinc on 09-18-2018 at 05:09 PM

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Registered: Sep 2014
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Posts: 231

Come on guys let’s not make this PKC it’s UKC for goodness sakes. We all know that when it says “Honor Rules” that everyone will honor the rules and play fair!! Lol🤣

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Registered: Aug 2011
Location: Perrinton, Michigan
Posts: 632

quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
A number of really bad things can happen with only two voters left. For one thing, the judge cannot be out voted. That means a judge with a dog in the hunt is king. Every coon seen can be circled by the other guy. Same with every slick, circled by the other guy. It's just a completely unacceptable situation. But I think it is also one with little to no chance of getting changed.

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22462

quote:

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Originally posted by swamp1
If they can't hunt a hunt out, stay on the porch To many times hunters are left to fend for themselves for various reasons.It can and has led to terrible consequences. If you come to hunt, Hunt. If not porch sit.

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Oh my goodness, if you can't fend for yourself, stay on the porch. If your hunt is over and you don't want to stay, go home.

Don't try to make another rule that says you "have" to stay. What are you going to do if they don't stay, scratch them? What about a hander whose dog you have scratched? Are you going to make him stay? What if you scratch a handler for misconduct? Does he have to stay?

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