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TylerOSU
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Registered: Jan 2017
Location: Miami, Ok
Posts: 298

Older folks and change

Why don't older folks welcome the thought of trying to change something for the better? They always want things to stay the same even if there's opportunity to improve. Not running anyone down and it's not even about hunting just life in general? Is everyone younger just "dumb kids"?

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Old Post 07-16-2019 04:16 PM
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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9337

Re: Older folks and change

quote:
Originally posted by TylerOSU
Why don't older folks welcome the thought of trying to change something for the better? They always want things to stay the same even if there's opportunity to improve. Not running anyone down and it's not even about hunting just life in general? Is everyone younger just "dumb kids"?




Now wait a minute!! Donít lump all us old guys in the same pile ! I am current , hip and groovey! I want all the new changes.



Tar

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Old Post 07-16-2019 04:24 PM
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Bruce m. Conkey
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Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 4157

.

Tyler wether older folks like it or not. Things do change. As things are changing the further one gets from that warm fuzzy feeling they got from knowing what was going on. The more they get uneasy. The more they start to resist it. Just the way life is.
My only regret to life's changes is the respect people have for one another, surly seems to be slipping away.
But the bottom line is. Life is still what you make it. The results are how you treat people and your beliefs.

You may want to think of people any age or sex as being dumb. If you choose to not listen and understand where they are coming from. You may not want to act like them, you may not want to think like them. But give them enough respect to at least understand them.

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Old Post 07-16-2019 04:28 PM
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Toad Hill
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Registered: Jun 2014
Location: missouri
Posts: 888

I remember my older brother making a comment about the "old men" pertaining to bass fishing and the tournaments he pursued ..
he said when then old guys got in a group and started talking I got near them , LISTENED and KEPT MY MOUTH SHUT .
I have never forgot this and never will.

you see ,These men wasnt against change , but they was WISE in their sport and my brother sensed it and took advantage of it .
You cant lump em all together , not all OLD MEN are against change.

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Old Post 07-16-2019 04:42 PM
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Lance Laymon
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2006
Location: Deputy, Indiana
Posts: 279

Well said Bruce!
Change for the sake of change is not the answer.
Most people I draw out with in a local hunt don't know the rules we have now. It sure isn't fun to judge a cast. First you have the headache of trying to keep track of every dog in the cast, instead of focusing on your own. Then if you have to minus a dog, you have to explain the rules to the handler while he is calling you a cheater.
I say keep the rules we have now for another 5 years.

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Preacher Tom
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2015
Location: NW Arkansas
Posts: 554

Tyler I don't hunt in the hunts much at all but I've always wondered what if we ran a hunt this way: All dogs strike in for 50 regardless of when struck. (Takes away the babbler advantage) Just giving the dog 50 points for opening on track. Dog declared treed first gets 100 and any dog treed within 2 or 3 minutes gets 50 regardless of order. Now here is the real part I think will make a difference. Any dog declared treed at any position that leaves the tree is scratched. Any dog fighting is scratched. (For me these are the two greatest faults and should be penalized the hardest) That's all the rules. I have always liked change. It would be fun to do some unsanctioned hunts under these rules and see what happened.

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Roy Grant
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Registered: Dec 2013
Location:
Posts: 1244

Tyler, would you list the GOOD changes that are happening to improve the world.

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TylerOSU
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2017
Location: Miami, Ok
Posts: 298

I donít guess I was actually grouping people together but as my age group also is grouped together Iím not exactly even close to the ones on the east or west coast. Anyhow everyone is entitled to their opinion and i guess it depends on what side of it youíre on. In my opinion technology is a thing that has pushed change up on us in a hurry. Is it better? Some say no, but what about healthcare? Itís a lot better right? We are living longer? What about hunting technologies? It allows someone that maybe canít get around as well be able to nearly drive to their dogs or cut 200 yards off of a tree distance by driving around. On the other side it ďruined the comp huntsĒ. Farmers now then have crop insurance and donít have to rely on Mother Nature, on the other side I think thatís what drives land prices up. I guess the point Iím getting to is there is two sides of the story. I know the older generation sometimes doesnít want change but on my side of things the younger guys have to hunt the change or non change for the next 50 years not the older guys

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Old Post 07-16-2019 06:06 PM
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Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 4157

.

Tyler to get totally away from coon hunting and to answer your question. The answer is NO to everyone being DUMB KIDS.

A lot has to do with the Young Persons moral compass on how they will fair in this world.
Think about our military. All those large ships floating around. All those planes flying around. Young men and women are a big part of all that happening. Young men and women that choose to do something with their lives.

Young people no matter where they live. If they choose to do something with their lives in a positive way they can. Thing with life is. The easy way out of a bump in the road which we all have. Is either drugs or alcohol. That only digs a hole most can't overcome. I said drugs or alcohol but the truth is any addiction. Addiction to coon hounds if they take away from or replace the necessary important things is life isn't good.

The thing about drugs that I hate to see is how it turns family members against family members. The loving, kind family member that wants to help and hates to see what's happening. Ends up enabling the person with the problem. Then they both are in a mess. We all need the Love of God in us but the Love that Blinds People to the problems in their Families is a big downfall to our way of life.

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Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 4157

.

Tyler to get totally away from coon hunting and to answer your question. The answer is NO to everyone being DUMB KIDS.

A lot has to do with the Young Persons moral compass on how they will fair in this world.
Think about our military. All those large ships floating around. All those planes flying around. Young men and women are a big part of all that happening. Young men and women that choose to do something with their lives.

Young people no matter where they live. If they choose to do something with their lives in a positive way they can. Thing with life is. The easy way out of a bump in the road which we all have. Is either drugs or alcohol. That only digs a hole most can't overcome. I said drugs or alcohol but the truth is any addiction. Addiction to coon hounds if they take away from or replace the necessary important things is life isn't good.

The thing about drugs that I hate to see is how it turns family members against family members. The loving, kind family member that wants to help and hates to see what's happening. Ends up enabling the person with the problem. Then they both are in a mess. We all need the Love of God in us but the Love that Blinds People to the problems in their Families is a big downfall to our way of life.

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Mbrown3283
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2017
Location: Ada, Oklahoma
Posts: 22

Older folks

Tyler, I struggle with older people wanting the younger folks to give them the upmost respect, but not getting it in return. For the life of me I donít understand why you ďold folksĒ donít ask younger generation how they want things for their futures when you do anything that affects their futures.

Whether itís voting, education, business, and or our beloved outdoor sports. I think you ďold folksĒ need to ask the ďyounger folksĒ how they want to shape the future of their sport, or life, and then you wonít be wondering why kids arenít signing up to grow our sport.

I enjoy this sport built by ďolder folksĒ and itís high time older folks start asking, and stop telling. The future is ours in everything, weíre thankful, but itís time pass the torch.

This is meant for every baby boomer, and older person, and includes everything in life.

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 17420

"Old folks" aren't against change "for the better" at all. I don't know where you got that idea. The problem lies in everyone's definition of "better". As you stated, everyone has their own opinion and they are entitled to that opinion.
We can debate and state our personal opinion of what is "better" on this message forum and in the end the majority opinion should and usually does prevail. But if someone's personal opinion is different from ours, we shouldn't attack their age, intelligence, honesty or integrity just because they don't agree with us and we don't understand why. That is, unless it is Tarbaby or myself. We both deserve it.

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Mbrown3283
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2017
Location: Ada, Oklahoma
Posts: 22

Old folks?

The question is, ďAre you building for the future, or you building for the now?Ē Your now is almost gone, and you might want to ask younger folks how they want their future or they wonít be a part of this sport.

Thatís about as plain as I can put it.

Yes Richard, older folks are against change for the better, and thatís because change in itself isnít better for old folks, but it is generally for younger folks.


Most younger folks just want to put their spin on things, and thatís ok.

Lastly, weíre all in this together, but some of us wonít be here tomorrow, and we might want to let those that will be, decide their tomorrow.

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Old Post 07-16-2019 06:45 PM
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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 17420

Maybe young folks don't have enough experience to realize that what seems better to them at the moment isn't the best thing to do. A whole lot of young folks think that one change is better today and another change is better tomorrow. They don't really know what they want from one day to the next.
A change might seem like the better thing to do at the time but every change can have unintended consequences. Older experienced hunters have seen or lived through a lot of changes and know this. That is called experience. It is very hard for a young hunter to have the experience and maturity of older hunters. Any change should be well thought out.
When you make changes for the young hunters, just remember they will soon be the older folks and then what will they do? They will have to listen to the younger hunters who want change to suit them.

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yadkinriver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Yadkin County NC
Posts: 1201

Tyler

Happy to see you are optimistic enough to think you'll still be hunting in 50 years.
But something to dwell on...with age comes wisdom.

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Mbrown3283
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2017
Location: Ada, Oklahoma
Posts: 22

Older folks

The Bible gives us this principle ďOld men dream dreams, and young men see visions.Ē

In laymanís terms ďold folks always dreaming about the good ole days, and young folks are seeing a new future.Ē

Itís always been this way, and always will!

Mr Hitt, thereís plenty of old sayings, but that donít make them true.

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yadkintar
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Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9337

Many on this board have seen many changes. From hunts that used to draw 300 dogs to now they draw 25 dogs. Thatís the sad part of being older you just hate to see it. I seen those things I also know what caused it I known micheal brown all his life and if he could fix it he would. If I Robert hitt could fix it I would. But if you got an old tractor and if you donít maintain it daily sooner or later it wonít run no more. Then you have to overhaul it. That cost money and you get to asking yourself do I want to spend this money or get a new tractor or just quit farming all together. Thatís were the kcs are itís going to cost lots of money to get that tractor running again just to see if the ground is still fertile. Itís up to the young folks to make it that way just hope they got the backbone for hard work.



We will see because the old folks are tired.

Tar

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Redneck Mafia
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2013
Location: Seneca, Mo
Posts: 4138

Tyler they want to go back to no Garmin and 3 hour hunts lol. Propose that and see how many resist! The thing about memories we all hold most dear are we hold onto the good the best stays prominent where the negative finds a hiding spot.
Cheyenne has very fond memories of hunting from a campfire while eating homemade biscuits and his great uncles drank coffee and whooped at the dogs. He had to climb every tree or chop into dens to get coons out. His memories are wonderful. He will be the first to tell you that though the accuracy of those old redbones was high if you have time to build a fire, eat biscuits and drink coffee while waiting on them maybe their ability really wasn't as good as he thought at the time.
All but a few of you younger ones remember driving around sometimes for hours playing freeze out with the windows down stopping to listen over and over trying to find dogs. We left coats on the ground and sometimes drove for days stopping everywhere within miles looking. Everyone has that "one" they never found. Don't let them fool you. They sometimes ran junk and sometimes changed zip codes then.They speak of pack dogs but all wanted to own the one that was the leader, just like now, who was most likely not a pack dog but regardless had 3 others following him scrambling for position. The 1st and 1st was highly coveted then too.
The reality that they would love to have your 20 something legs and ears for one day to go back and have the knowledge that age has given them. That and those priceless memories are where their resistance comes from. In a way it is a selfish thing that the more they hold back and dig in the hands of time will slow. Deep down we all know it is inevitable age comes and things change, there is no going back, there is no 5 more minutes. Take it easy on them we are all getting closer.

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yadkinriver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Yadkin County NC
Posts: 1201

Jennifer how old are you? Way too smart to be a spring chicken. (not really looking for an answer) I'm not trying to fool anyone. I've left my coat on the ground plenty of times. I had no deer in the area where I grew up and if I ever went to deer country I usually had a mess. When we got our tresspassing law where you must have written permission on every piece of land we step on it was the straw that broke the camels back. I gave up the fight. Tar can fight this fight though I can't figure out whatever for. Think he may just like to argue and he really don't want to at home, afraid he'll lose his cook.
Just hope the sport last long enough for these young whippersnappers to see where we're coming from. There is so much truth in the last sentence of your post.

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yadkintar
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 9337

I got a 32 yr old son that loves this sport thatís why I fight to make it better. But these young folks are going to have to start up clubs. And take the bull by the horns they talk about it. Vote on it then next thing you know they show up 10 minutes before draw and go and leave their trash and spit cup on the table for the old folks to pick up. When the old doggies are gone and that boob comes out of their mouth thatís when reality will hit.


I clean, wash dishes , do laundry, and I am a really good cook thatís why Mrs tar keeps me around lol.


Tar

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Old Post 07-16-2019 09:51 PM
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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Didn't the old folks change the hunts from 3 hrs to 2 hrs and now down to 1 hr? Didn't the old folks change the squalling rule from never to first 2 minutes? Didn't they change the leash lock rule to an option. Didn't they change the use of Garmin during a hunt rule? I guess that these youngsters weren't around then. They are all gimme, gimme, gimme. Give them an inch and they want a mile.
Tarbaby, they want to tell us old folks how we should do it but they won't do it themselves. I wonder how long comp coonhunting would last if the old folks stepped aside and let the youngsters take over?

Last edited by Richard Lambert on 07-16-2019 at 10:02 PM

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yadkintar
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Location: Marietta
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Didn't the old folks change the hunts from 3 hrs to 2 hrs and now down to 1 hr? Didn't the old folks change the squalling rule from never to first 2 minutes? Didn't they change the leash lock rule to an option. Didn't they change the use of Garmin during a hunt rule? I guess that these youngsters weren't around then. They are all gimme, gimme, gimme. Give them an inch and they want a mile.
Tarbaby, they want to tell us old folks how we should do it but they won't do it themselves. I wonder how long comp coonhunting would last if the old folks stepped aside and let the youngsters take over?




Even tho I was young back then you still had responsibilities. We hosted those who came all day. We judged champion cast we didnít even get to hunt at our own hunt due to large entryís. I became an officer when I was in my 20ís I was treasurer I would go buy enough briskets to smoke and trimmings and breakfast food to last two days we made more on the kitchen than we did in the hunt. You did not go home until everything was done. The older guys were the backbone of the club. You acted up they didnít call ukc they just told you that you were not welcome anymore. We donated more to charity and other hunters in need than most clubs make in a year. Sombody was in a bad spot one of those older hunters would just show up at your house with enough money to help you through it and nobody knew. Yes brouther it has changed but if the kids want it fixed they got to earn it like we did.


The talking part is done.


Tar

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Dave Richards
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Post

Jen, I absolutely loved your post. It was so accurate and articulated what so many of us actually went through in the good old days. Respect can only be earned by those willing to give respect, it is NOT a one way street. I love the energy of the younger generation and the fact they are willing to implement changes they believe will better the sport. Our younger generation IS the future, like every younger generation before them. I for one am excited to see the contributions this younger generation will make in the coming years. Dave

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Reuben
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Posts: 774

There isnít much difference between young and old...you can be below average, average or above average as a youngster...and you will be the same in your older age...the biggest difference is experience or wisdom...sometimes we mellow out and the fire doesnít burn as hot...I am one that always looks for the best way in most things I do but the drive isnít what it used to be...

We talk about natural hunting dog are born and not made...people are the same in many ways...

I worked in a big plant and when we had a big shutdown (turnaround) I would keep my eye on the younger contractors and when I saw someone with drive, smarts, and not afraid to take the lead and make things happen I would ask those few and far between to fill out an application and use me as reference...those young guys that have it will have it at an older age...

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Reuben
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Registered: Nov 2011
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Posts: 774

There isnít much difference between young and old...you can be below average, average or above average as a youngster...and you will be the same in your older age...the biggest difference is experience or wisdom...sometimes we mellow out and the fire doesnít burn as hot...I am one that always looks for the best way in most things I do but the drive isnít what it used to be...

We talk about natural hunting dog are born and not made...people are the same in many ways...

I worked in a big plant and when we had a big shutdown (turnaround) I would keep my eye on the younger contractors and when I saw someone with drive, smarts, and not afraid to take the lead and make things happen I would ask those few and far between to fill out an application and use me as reference...those young guys that have it will have it at an older age...

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Training dogs is not so much about quantity, it's more about timing, and the right situations...After that it's up to the dog....A hunting dog is born...

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