Registered: Dec 2012
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Coon Sense is this a real genetic trait or is it pretty much guys blowing smoke. Thoughts and opinions?

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Seriously I think what your calling "coon sense" is genetic because intelligence in general is somewhat genetic. A dog that get's shown more may learn more thru repetition but he'll never out think a dog that's just more intelligent. I think the pup that figures out how to open the kennel door when he's 10 weeks old is probably also going to be the 1st dog to figure out coons climb trees also.

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what I call coon sense is a dogs instinct to know where to find a coon rather than stumble across one. and it has to do with brains.

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Dogs are smarter then people like to give them credit for. A dog that has spent a lot of time in the woods will put together were to find a coon fast. If its hot a dog knows to go to were he smells water because time after time he has hit a track off water. Some dogs remember where they have treed a coon in the past and run right to the tree 1st and check it. I had a dog like that and hated it. The dog would check the last 2 or 3 trees it treed on first before it began to hunt. I believe "coonsence" is learned.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Dan Dogs
what I call coon sense is a dogs instinct to know where to find a coon rather than stumble across one. and it has to do brains.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fisher13
This is what I am referenceing a genetic disposition to know where to find coon and to hunt coon. Does it exist?

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fisher13
This is what I am referenceing a genetic disposition to know where to find coon and to hunt coon. Does it exist?

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Registered: Oct 2008
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its learned.
same breeds of dogs are used for bear, cat ,hogs and so on.
they learn sense for what ever animal you expose them to.

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quote:

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Originally posted by toe cutter
its learned.
same breeds of dogs are used for bear, cat ,hogs and so on.
they learn sense for what ever animal you expose them to.

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If it was all about learning and nothing to do with genetics I guess you'd see allot more poodles treeing coons than you do wouldn't you? They're supposed to be one of the smartest dogs of all.

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It would be a mix of both im not sure on the 50 / 50 split but if it was not bread into the dog you may hunt a dog their whole life and they never run or tree anything or just make a fair dog but if they are bread right they know before they start and the hunting just pulls it out of them.

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quote:

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Originally posted by msinc
Okay, so who taught my 6 month old puppy to look for coons his first time out??????

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quote:

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Originally posted by RLenhart
If it was all about learning and nothing to do with genetics I guess you'd see allot more poodles treeing coons than you do wouldn't you? They're supposed to be one of the smartest dogs of all.

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Last edited by toe cutter on 10-01-2015 at 05:50 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by toe cutter
if you did'nt do any pre training by exposing it to coon then it was probly just gamey and got lucky and it come across a coon instead of a grinner.
no dog is born with any concept of what a coon is,
no more than its born with any concept of what a tree is.

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Some dogs seem to be born with the tree bred in them and some dogs need to be taught to tree. Some dogs seem to be born with "coon sense" and some seem to learn it. There are different types of dogs. In my experience, real "coon sense" is very rare. I have only had one dog in my lifetime that had it. Oh sure, there are a lot of dogs that learn where coons hang out. But Mongo just seemed to have a sixth sense to know where a coon was. If you turned him loose in a pine thicket, he could find the coon in it. If you turned him loose in a patch woods, he could go from tree to tree and tree every coon in the patch. He was almost impossible to dryhole. I tried to do it several times. I would turn him loose in hunted to death public game land 2 mos after the season started and he would find a coon. So, I guess that y'all are all correct. Sometimes coon sense and tree sense are born into dogs and sometimes it is learned. It sure is a lot easier when they are "naturals" and are born with it however.

7 week old pups

Last edited by Richard Lambert on 10-01-2015 at 06:34 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by msinc
I think maybe I typed it too quick or something...my dog did not stumble across his first coon and I am now calling that coon sense...what I said was he has shown a propensity towards looking or hunting in areas that he is way more likely to stumble across a coon naturally as opposed to going for the high ground or pine thickets. Maybe he thinks he will find a lotto ticket in the bottoms, but I doubt it.
Your last sentence is very confusing to me...are you saying that no dog is born with the instinct to tree {know what the tree is} and you, or somebody teaches them how to tree?????

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quote:

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Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Some dogs seem to be born with the tree bred in them and some dogs need to be taught to tree.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Josh Michaelis
He is saying none of them are born with pre-concieved notions of any kind. Every complex thing they know must be learned.

Your dog has learned to go to a certain area at some point. He was not born with this knowledge, and it most likely not instinct.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Dan Dogs
what I call coon sense is a dogs instinct to know where to find a coon rather than stumble across one. and it has to do with brains.

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I have a friend that had gyp that would cock her head and listem for frogs when you got her out of the truck. When you turned her loose she would go straight to them cooning. Very smart.

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quote:

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Originally posted by toe cutter
I don't read all about learning and nothing to do with genetics any where on my post, the only aspect I was answering was the posted question about "coon sense".

no dog is born with any concept of what a coon is.
no more than its born with knowledge of what a tree is.
people use ( for example) walkers to hunt bear, to hunt lions and to hunt hogs.. they are not born with any idea of what it is they are suppose to get after till you expose it to what you want it to hunt. so what ? it is born with coon sense because a coon hunter has them. if a lion hunter has the same cross of walker is it then born with lion sense.
its all about genetics.
a coon hound breed is born with the ability to use its nose to hunt for , track and bark and bay for anything it wants bad enough. a 6 week old pup can track and tree on a hot dog if it wants it bad enough. did anyone teach it to. no, they just got it to want a hot dog.
the only training is what to use those bred in instincts on.
and for a coon hunter ,, that would be coon.. to learn "coon sense".

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Last edited by Fisher13 on 10-05-2015 at 08:41 AM

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quote:

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Originally posted by Fisher13
In the book he brings up the subject that if a hound had a preference or notion to running to running other game then a coon, like fox or bear. Rather then attempting to break it off that animal, it would simply be better to use the hound to hunt that game instead. I thought this was an interesting point, and had never thought of a dog having a genetic disposition towards a certain game.

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Last edited by msinc on 10-05-2015 at 11:24 AM

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Now hold on and don't get upset at me BUT. First treeing is a instint that was bred into a dog, we as humans have bred that trait into our hounds NO undomesticated dog anywhere in the world trees, a wild animal knows it would starve to death standing at a tree treeing. SO we as hunters fixed that, how you say well by "breeding" way too much treeing into our hounds so now we have treeing idiots today. Now I will bet $ you can teach a dog to tree if you can't how in the world would you ever teach a dog to alert meaning a way to show it is in the odor of a desired substance by a sit, a scratch, a down position or a BARK yesser you can teach a dog to tree also. Now on that same thought pattern if you praise a dog to much on a slick tree then you are teaching that dog that what he is doing is ok so a dog is a creature of habbit and you train it by doing the same thing the same way over and over "reptition" so keep praising him on slick trees and then YOU become the problum not the dog . I guess I had way to much training in the K-9 world. NOW IN CLOSING THIS IS JUST MY OPINION ONLY. Load um up and lets go hunting.
H L Meyer

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quote:

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Originally posted by H. L. Meyer
Now hold on and don't get upset at me BUT. First treeing is a instint that was bred into a dog, we as humans have bred that trait into our hounds NO undomesticated dog anywhere in the world trees, a wild animal knows it would starve to death standing at a tree treeing. SO we as hunters fixed that, how you say well by "breeding" way too much treeing into our hounds so now we have treeing idiots today. Now I will bet $ you can teach a dog to tree if you can't how in the world would you ever teach a dog to alert meaning a way to show it is in the odor of a desired substance by a sit, a scratch, a down position or a BARK yesser you can teach a dog to tree also. Now on that same thought pattern if you praise a dog to much on a slick tree then you are teaching that dog that what he is doing is ok so a dog is a creature of habbit and you train it by doing the same thing the same way over and over "reptition" so keep praising him on slick trees and then YOU become the problum not the dog . I guess I had way to much training in the K-9 world. NOW IN CLOSING THIS IS JUST MY OPINION ONLY. Load um up and lets go hunting.
H L Meyer

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Registered: Aug 2004
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How about bird dogs, do they instinctively point or do they have to be trained? How about Labs, do they instinctively retrieve or do they have to be trained? I wonder why "some" people think that Rat Attack hounds had too much tree in them?

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