Registered: Jun 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 1731

Hunt Test fall under the same jurisdictions that regular Nite Hunts do, where you may not harvest any animals on your hunt. We are however kicking around the idea of making the Hunt Test Excellence degree a title, or, making it a more challenging event. Any ideas floating around out there that you guys would like to suggest???

Another hint for you guys wanting to have more success at yout HTX hunts, you may want to look into advertising a little bit to the Cur/Feist people as well. Curs and Coonhounds can enter the same UKC HTX Hunts, since each dog is evaluated individually. I have yet to be to an HTX Hunt personally where a cur or feist was present. Just a suggestion, but it may help everyones numbers to know that

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Corey Gruver
Greenville, PA
(724) 456-6813

Last edited by Corey Gruver on 09-03-2014 at 03:29 PM

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 6168

As an "early adopter" of the HTX tests, I was able to have one of my dogs finish as one of the "firsts" (two dogs finished on the same night, so we can both claim that distinction) I can say this much.

If anyone thinks that an HTX degree is "easy"...think again. Yes, a dog should be able to go out alone and in an hour tree a coon..I agree, but when you put time limits on the dog, and a set of rules, the landscape changes and it becomes a little more difficult.

My dog was already a Grand Night Champion in UKC, a Supreme Grand Night Champion in AKC, and a PKC Champion. He had competed in and placed in the top of National Hunts, and was in the top 16 of World hunts....so yes, he should be able to walk through this hunt test. I entered him for two reasons....#1 was to support the local club, and #2 was in an attempt to remove any doubt as to if he could tree coon alone.

At the end of the day, he did exactly as I expected and earned the degree without fanfare or difficulty. BUT aside from personal satisfaction, it means NOTHING to anyone but me.

Until we as houndsmen embrace the HTX as an accomplishment, and until HTX actually MEANS somethig to us as competition hunters it is just an exercise

I have been at this game for 40 years. I have seen the landscape change from when it was VERY difficult to make a dog a Night Champion, because you had to beat 100 registered dogs at a night hunt to get a first place win, to today when it is not unusual to have a whole cast of dogs less than a year old competing with three other dogs in "the other cast" for that first place.....and it cheapens the title of Night Champion. Grand Nights were once rare as hens teeth, because it was difficult to finish one, and when you had one....you had something. Today if you haul a dog that will get treed enough, you can make it a Grand!

Titles today are "cheap"....HTX is the cheapest of all of them in a lot of folks eyes... Until we as hunters and houndsmen embrace this program, and until we find a way to place some kind of value on the degree.....it is never going to take a front seat. Bottom line is nobody CARES if a dog has an HTX title. Maybe Mr. Clean the two time National Grand Night, multiple World Champion needs to get an HTX title to "prove" he can tree a coon...

I am currently in the camp that believes that ALL dogs entering a UKC licensed hunt should have to complete an HTX degree before they can enter a registered cast...that would raise the bar for HTX hunts, and raise the bar on all of the other degrees while giving clubs a shot in the arm!!!!

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Joe Newlin
UKC Cur Advocate
Home of Oak Ridge Kennels

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Registered: Jul 2009
Location: Southwest Virginia
Posts: 415

Joe,
I too, have been around for many years at this game. 35 to be exact, I have a UKC Nt. Ch. and he is a *Kc Ch. I have no desire to finish him to a Gr. Nt. because of two things. 1. Money as I have a family to support and 2. The title of Gr. Nt. now means nothing in just about everyones eyes. but exactly as you have stated we must embrace this program before it takes off. I for one am a big supporter of this program, but no one around here even cares about going to any events anymore and we all know alot of the reasons why. I wish clubs around here would help get this program going and again make this a title of some sort. Thanks Joe, you put alot of things in perspective.

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Little Reed Black and Tans, Powered by:

*Nt. Ch. Black Magic Roscoe's Hot Persuit (aka Jr.) one win toward Gr. Nt. Ch. ($120 dollars won in PKC).
(Nt. Ch. Winner of Princeton, W.Va. Blk. and Tan Sectional 2012). HTX winner. 5th place winner 2014 Black and Tan Days Thursday night. SIRE OF THE 2015 U.K.C. WORLD COONHOUND RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION!

*Kemps Little Reed Blk. Chester (1st and 2nd place wins in UKC) (two wins in A.C.H.A.) (pup off of Jr.) FULL LITTERMATE TO THE 2015 UKC RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION !!
Mr. ACCURATE!

*Nt. Ch. Kemps Little Reed Blk. Prowler (1st place UKC World Qualifier '09, 6th Place Hi Scoring Blk. and Tan at Southeastern Treeing Walker Days, '07).





The Kemps (Greg, Vickie, Erica, and Noah)
6 Little Vine Rd.
Hillsville, Va. 24343
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Registered: Apr 2012
Location: Enon Valley Pa.
Posts: 128

I think the HTX hunts are great. I have taken 2 of my dogs to HTX titles. I'm disabled and have to get a friend or someone else to handle my dogs in UKC nite hunts. I enjoy the HTX because I can handle my own dogs. I also like the fact that it proves the dog can hunt and tree it's own coon. A few things need to happen to make it a better program. The UKC needs to recognize the dog's
offspring as HTX on their registration just like GN 2 NTCH6 GRW 3 etc. Also announce the degree in CHB. I think a little recognition will help with the attendance of the HTX hunts. I will be going to make as many as I can because it gives me a chance to make new friends, see some different dogs, and hunt new woods. Thanks for reading .Dan

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Registered: Jul 2009
Location: Southwest Virginia
Posts: 415

bingo Dan!

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Little Reed Black and Tans, Powered by:

*Nt. Ch. Black Magic Roscoe's Hot Persuit (aka Jr.) one win toward Gr. Nt. Ch. ($120 dollars won in PKC).
(Nt. Ch. Winner of Princeton, W.Va. Blk. and Tan Sectional 2012). HTX winner. 5th place winner 2014 Black and Tan Days Thursday night. SIRE OF THE 2015 U.K.C. WORLD COONHOUND RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION!

*Kemps Little Reed Blk. Chester (1st and 2nd place wins in UKC) (two wins in A.C.H.A.) (pup off of Jr.) FULL LITTERMATE TO THE 2015 UKC RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION !!
Mr. ACCURATE!

*Nt. Ch. Kemps Little Reed Blk. Prowler (1st place UKC World Qualifier '09, 6th Place Hi Scoring Blk. and Tan at Southeastern Treeing Walker Days, '07).





The Kemps (Greg, Vickie, Erica, and Noah)
6 Little Vine Rd.
Hillsville, Va. 24343
276-733-8590

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Registered: Jun 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 1731

BTT

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Corey Gruver
Greenville, PA
(724) 456-6813

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Registered: Oct 2006
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 170

These are the most intelligent post I have ever read on here.I also enjoy the htx hunts. Pat

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Registered: Sep 2010
Location: New Paris, Indiana
Posts: 7076

I just checked the schedule. Indiana has one, Michigan has none. There aren't any within 4 hours of where I live. There are however 10 Nite Hunts in just the month of Nov in my state of Indiana alone.

Joe is right, the only way it will ever fly is if they force it down our throats. No HTX title, no entry to the Nite Hunts. That should really work well.......for all the other KC's.

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AKC/UKC NtCh Sizemore's Timber Jam Jeff 5/2/2000 to 1/22/2012 R.I.P.
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Registered: May 2008
Location: Gillett, Pa
Posts: 1876

no night champion degree until it passes a htx test is the simple fix !

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Registered: Jul 2009
Location: Southwest Virginia
Posts: 415

quote:

---

Originally posted by groworg1
no night champion degree until it passes a htx test is the simple fix !

---

__________________
Little Reed Black and Tans, Powered by:

*Nt. Ch. Black Magic Roscoe's Hot Persuit (aka Jr.) one win toward Gr. Nt. Ch. ($120 dollars won in PKC).
(Nt. Ch. Winner of Princeton, W.Va. Blk. and Tan Sectional 2012). HTX winner. 5th place winner 2014 Black and Tan Days Thursday night. SIRE OF THE 2015 U.K.C. WORLD COONHOUND RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION!

*Kemps Little Reed Blk. Chester (1st and 2nd place wins in UKC) (two wins in A.C.H.A.) (pup off of Jr.) FULL LITTERMATE TO THE 2015 UKC RESERVE WORLD CHAMPION !!
Mr. ACCURATE!

*Nt. Ch. Kemps Little Reed Blk. Prowler (1st place UKC World Qualifier '09, 6th Place Hi Scoring Blk. and Tan at Southeastern Treeing Walker Days, '07).





The Kemps (Greg, Vickie, Erica, and Noah)
6 Little Vine Rd.
Hillsville, Va. 24343
276-733-8590

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 4321

I wouldn't link the Ntch degree to HTX. I know of guys who will enter a HTX who won't enter a nite hunt. And, vice versa. Why drive them away when participation is already at an all time low?

I love the concept of HTX. It has more to do with what coonhunting is about, than any other organized activity.

We've only had minor problems in my club with HTX and they were all solve-able. However, one lingering problem is coming up with enough qualified inspectors. Interest was high when we first started having them and guys came to help. Now we are down to 1-2 dogs and nobody wants to inspect.

I may suggest to my club that for every dog a person enters in an HTX they must also inspect a dog. The club members are doing this anyway. Its the guys that drive a ways and want to hunt early and leave that cause a burden. IMO, someone coming to a HTX should assume they will get to hunt their dog AND that they will be asked to inspect another dog. Is that too much to ask?

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Registered: Jul 2012
Location: Odessa, Mo
Posts: 2066

Just got it on my dog. Was a good time. I got them started at our club, at first the idea came with a lot of resistance. It took another year of "talks" to get them voted in. Once we got it off the ground participation was good we had about 10-12 dogs one night. Now a year later it's almost dead. Members got their passes and don't come. Nite Hunts saturate our area making it hard to find hunters/good night to have them. In fact I was the only dog entered the other night when I got my final pass. Not sure what the future holds for them, but it ain't good at our club. UKC needs to get behind this program and sink their teeth in it. These title don't even show up on a dogs TRL or get that much promotion. SOS-HTX-SOS

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Bawl, Chop, Bang, Thump.

PR. Missouri Hi-Dollar Slowpoke HTX

PR. Missouri Nite Hunt Hitman - R.I.P
08-08-2013 - 07-15-2015
Starved to death by a S.O.B named Austin Tibbits.

American Black and Tan Coon Hounds
----------------------------------------------------------

Nt.Ch. "PR." Wildside's BugEyed Betty (W)

Matthew Fann
816-565-1660

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Any program that cannot stand on it's own without a mandate from the UKC that makes a person earn one degree to complete a different one is doomed to failure.
To make someone earn a HTX degree before you can complete a NT CH. This is the same old argument about show and Nt Ch.

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Registered: Dec 2013
Location: PA.
Posts: 1738

I think making it a requirement to enter a night hunt would be a mistake. Like some peole on here I believe it would hurt attendance at the night hunts. I think the perfect spot for HTX to be would be between nitech. and grand nite, before moving on to grand your dog must have it's HTX title.

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For all you people that think you should have a HTX degree before making a NT CH or GR NT CH here is my challenge to you. Volunteer to be the (HTX) person at your club. Do the work that it takes to run the HTX program. I did this at our club, then come back on here in one year and tell us your opinion.

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Registered: Dec 2013
Location: PA.
Posts: 1738

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Seeker
For all you people that think you should have a HTX degree before making a NT CH or GR NT CH here is my challenge to you. Volunteer to be the (HTX) person at your club. Do the work that it takes to run the HTX program. I did this at our club, then come back on here in one year and tell us your opinion.

---

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Location: off the res.
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quote:

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Originally posted by RLenhart
I understand there is some work involved, but it should'nt be any more than running a night hunt, and the lack of help and participation is kinda the point to making it a requirement at some point before making gr nt ch. If we all needed it there would be more participation. jmo.

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Last edited by Bob Hennessey on 10-28-2014 at 08:09 PM

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Registered: Dec 2013
Location: PA.
Posts: 1738

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Seeker
The work didn't bother me. I can tell you if UKC would make this a requirement most small clubs in my area will either fold up or go to another KC for their hunts.

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Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Pomeroy, Ohio
Posts: 2834

IF, UKC made it a requirement that to be awarded the rightfully earned competition hunt degree that the HTX degree also had to be earned, the HTX degree would be questionable at best. There would be a lot of HTX degrees that would be awarded that wouldn't be rightfully earned.

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John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

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Posts: 3415

Some suggestions : Make HTX equal to NT CH in prestige.
Change inspector requirement at least 2 inspectors for every 3 passes instead of different one each pass (will help smaller clubs.)
After dogs makes HTX1, dog will be failed for off game, immediately.
1 hour time limit. (no overtime unless treed during with the hour, like night hunt)
Drop the requirement inspector cannot have bred, trained,or housed the dog.
Inspector and handler or owner of dog are not regular hunting partners.
This is the requirement that killed the HTX hunts at our club as we quickly run out of inspectors that passed a dog that met the above requirement and if (as at the end) only 4 or 5 dogs would show up we couldn't meet the UKC's requirement.
Will this lead to more cheating? Maybe but when 2 people go to the woods there is that chance and if people are going to cheat they will. The night hunts now have cheating and there are sometimes 6 or 7 people present.
To me if you have to cheat either you or your dog aren't much. JMO!

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Registered: Jul 2012
Location: Odessa, Mo
Posts: 2066

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Seeker
Some suggestions : Make HTX equal to NT CH in prestige.
Change inspector requirement at least 2 inspectors for every 3 passes instead of different one each pass (will help smaller clubs.)
After dogs makes HTX1, dog will be failed for off game, immediately.
1 hour time limit. (no overtime unless treed during with the hour, like night hunt)
Drop the requirement inspector cannot have bred, trained,or housed the dog.
Inspector and handler or owner of dog are not regular hunting partners.
This is the requirement that killed the HTX hunts at our club as we quickly run out of inspectors that passed a dog that met the above requirement and if (as at the end) only 4 or 5 dogs would show up we couldn't meet the UKC's requirement.
Will this lead to more cheating? Maybe but when 2 people go to the woods there is that chance and if people are going to cheat they will. The night hunts now have cheating and there are sometimes 6 or 7 people present.
To me if you have to cheat either you or your dog aren't much. JMO!

---

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Bawl, Chop, Bang, Thump.

PR. Missouri Hi-Dollar Slowpoke HTX

PR. Missouri Nite Hunt Hitman - R.I.P
08-08-2013 - 07-15-2015
Starved to death by a S.O.B named Austin Tibbits.

American Black and Tan Coon Hounds
----------------------------------------------------------

Nt.Ch. "PR." Wildside's BugEyed Betty (W)

Matthew Fann
816-565-1660

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Registered: Feb 2010
Location: off the res.
Posts: 3415

And it would be nice to be able to send to guys out and let them judge each other. We had a lot of second round meeting back up to swap so the guy that just judged could now get judged.
I knew I was forgetting one, Thanks

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Registered: Nov 2013
Location: Convoy,Ohio
Posts: 1693

I don't competition hunt,but I went to a HTX hunt,and loved it,,I just wish there were more in my area,,if I want to attend a HTX hunt,I have to drive 100 plus miles,and that is not an option for me,I live on a budget and money is very tight,I would attend many of them if they were closer

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, Mich.
Posts: 6113

quote:

---

Originally posted by The Seeker
Some suggestions : Make HTX equal to NT CH in prestige.
Change inspector requirement at least 2 inspectors for every 3 passes instead of different one each pass (will help smaller clubs.)
After dogs makes HTX1, dog will be failed for off game, immediately.
1 hour time limit. (no overtime unless treed during with the hour, like night hunt)
Drop the requirement inspector cannot have bred, trained,or housed the dog.
Inspector and handler or owner of dog are not regular hunting partners.

---

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Weyers Cave Va
Posts: 13408

People are going to cheat to earn a title no matter what rules are in place. Most local people know the ones who cheat to earn their titles and never do anything about it.

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