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Coby Wright
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2017
Location: Manchester, TN
Posts: 87

Delete or Minus strike points?

I was having a discussion with some other hunters recently and we had a disagreement on something.

We couldn't agree on when to delete or minus strike points on dogs not declared treed.

For example, let's say Dog A is treed alone and Dog B comes in before the 5 is up but is not declared treed.

Upon arrival at the tree both dogs are treeing on the same tree.

I thought Dog B should be scored this way...

1.) Coon is seen = Dog B's strike points are minused.

2.) Tree is circled = Dog B's strike points are deleted.

3.) Tree is slick = Dog B's strike points are deleted.

4.) Off Game = ??? Not sure on this one. Guessing it would be delete on a registered cast and a scratch on a champion cast?

Are any of these situations correct? If not please let me know what is correct. Also, would this change if Dog B came in after the 5 was up but before the cast arrives at the tree? Finally, would this change if Dog B came in after the cast had arrived at the tree?

Thanks for your help.

Cheers,
Coby

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Last edited by Coby Wright on 10-01-2019 at 12:22 AM

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nextcoonhunters
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2015
Location: mo
Posts: 383

Rulers

Delete points:
(e) If half the cast votes to circle and half the cast
votes to minus a tree.
(f) If dogs are trailing when time is out.
(g) If Judge has to call time out in accordance with Rule 7. (h) When dog trees on a tree or coon previously scored. (Cast may go to tree without dogs being declared treed, if majority of cast agree, when hunting Judges are used.)
(i) When dog that is shut out* comes into tree shut out on. Refer to 3(e).
These are the only times points get deleted

Circle points:
(a) When dog strikes and trees on a tree or a hole in the ground where there could be a coon, yet Judge does not see coon and no off game is seen. NOTE: In case of running coon in a hole or place of refuge other than a tree, handler may call dog treed. However, if not called treed, cast may proceed to general area, and track can be considered finished if dogs, by actions either tree barking or otherwise, show to the satisfaction of the Judge, coon to be there. One dog must show end of trail. For dogs declared treed in a hole or tile, see Rule 3(b) or 4(g), if applicable.
(b) No dog to receive minus points for coming into tree after Judge arrives unless a coon is seen and the dogs treeing are awarded plus points.
(c) If half the cast votes to plus and half the cast votes to circle a tree.
(d) If a squirrel is seen on a den tree (must have visible hole large enough for a coon to enter into) or tree has a nest, or a place of refuge where a coon could be hidden

These are when points get circled. If you look at (b) it tells you to circle points if they come in after unless a coon is seen.

Strike Minus:
(a) When a dog quits a trail that is being worked and comes in. Exception: 5(b)
(b) If none of the declared struck dogs open within 8 minutes.
(c) Dog(s) declared struck and determined to be babbling*. (d) First offense failure to strike a dog on or before the third bark, after the first minute each time dog(s) is released will result in those points being awarded and minused.
(e) For calling dogs off trail.
(f) If dog declared treed, after five minutes has elapsed no additional dog can be declared treed at that particular tree but if they come in to tree will get minus on track and nothing on tree if coon is seen.

Here's your minus strike. (f) says minus if coon seen.

Only way you get anything other than circle is if a coon is seen (minus)or if the dog was shut out on that tree or if tree has already been scored(delete) Night champ. if off game is seen and not scored yet dog is scratched, if already scored dog gets deleted using the (g) rule.

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Old Post 10-01-2019 01:35 AM
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Coby Wright
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2017
Location: Manchester, TN
Posts: 87

I'm still confused on the exact scenarios I listed.

I understand the things you posted but that doesn't clear it up for me.

I'm mostly interested in what happens if two dogs are at the tree when cast arrives but only one has been declared treed.

I appreciate your reply,. I'm just still confused.

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Hoosier Man1
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2010
Location: Ohio
Posts: 6423

quote:
Originally posted by Coby Wright
I'm still confused on the exact scenarios I listed.

I understand the things you posted but that doesn't clear it up for me.

I'm mostly interested in what happens if two dogs are at the tree when cast arrives but only one has been declared treed.

I appreciate your reply,. I'm just still confused.



If dogs were struck but not treed they would get minused strike only if a coon is seen.

If a tree is scored slick or circled the dogs strike points are circled.

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Old Post 10-01-2019 04:21 AM
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Pat Bizich
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2004
Location: northeast
Posts: 1225

quote:
Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
If dogs were struck but not treed they would get minused strike only if a coon is seen.

If a tree is scored slick or circled the dogs strike points are circled.




No Better check that.
Dogs treeing but not declared treed when judge arrives on off game or slick trees are awarded next available tree points and minus both strike and tree points.

If a coon is seen only their strike points get minus and nothing on tree.

If tree is circled strike points get circled and nothing on tree.

These rules are on the back of score card.

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nextcoonhunters
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2015
Location: mo
Posts: 383

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pat Bizich
[B]Dogs treeing but not declared treed when judge arrives on off game or slick trees are awarded next available tree points
Split points in case of more than one dog. Dogs shut out to only receive minus tree points ( which means dogs not shut out to receive minus strike points)
That is rule 4k on the back of the card.

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Old Post 10-01-2019 05:59 AM
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jkidd1
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Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2240

If the dog is treed but not declared treed when the judge arrives on off game or a slick tree then it gets next available tree and minus both ways, unless it was shut out, the just minus tree points only.

Dog B should be scored this way...

1.) Coon is seen = Dog B's strike points are minused, nothing on tree.

2.) Tree is circled = Dog B's strike points are circled, nothin on tree.

3.) Tree is slick = Next available tree and minused both ways

4.) Off Game = Next available and minused both way/ Scratched if Nitech cast


Also Coby, things do change if the dog comes in AFTER the judge arrives, as the rule is now, the dog will only get minused on strike if a coon is seen. On slick, circle and off game strike is circled. Remember that's only if the the dog comes in After the judge arrives.I don't like it but that how it is.

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yadkintar
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Registered: Jan 2013
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Posts: 9507

When I see it on the back of a new score card then I will start learning it not until 😂


Tar

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Coby Wright
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2017
Location: Manchester, TN
Posts: 87

Okay now I've got it straight. Thank you gentlemen!

I think I might have been getting my registries mixed up.

Taking a nearly 10 year hiatus has me playing catch up on some of the rules. 😁

Cheers,
Coby

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