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Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5103

.

Would it be a fair statement to say that most Vets are not knowledgeable on this subject? Most don't even see it a big enough problem to test for it and then most don't know how to treat it.

I have done my Thyroid research for today. I have bigger fish to fry. LOL

Anyway I just did some googling and came up with this.
Dr Dodds states that in nearly 90 percent of cases

hypothyroidism is an autoimmune disorder. According to Dr Marty Goldstein, autoimmune thyroiditis happens when the body mistakenly interprets its own thyroid gland and hormones as foreign threats. The body then produces antibodies to destroy the functional thyroid gland cells, resulting in loss of function.

Though some breeds are genetically predisposed towards hypothyroidism, Dr Goldstein says environmental factors also play a role: chemicals in medicines, flea and tick products, heartworm drugs and vaccines are all environmental triggers for autoimmune reactions.

Dr Goldstein also describes secondary hypothyroidism, which involves three glands – the hypothalamus, pituitary gland and thyroid – that work in conjunction with each other. The pituitary gland secretes TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone) that stimulates the thyroid to function. But the pituitary gland gets its “orders” from hormones released by the hypothalamus so these three glands can’t work properly without proper input from the others; the thyroid might be normal, but is not receiving the messages it needs to function.

Dr Dodds warns that a tight or prong collar on a dog who pulls a lot can also cause extensive thyroid damage so using a harness will avoid injury when walking him.

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MR.RATMAN
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Like you said Bruce most vets are clueless. I'm fortunate enough to have a vet that will listen to me on advice I have been getting from Dr. Allahada on here then my vet takes that information and researches it. No proven facts, but believe that with my case thinking that the Eurlychia my hound rebounded from has caused his loss of energy so we are now working on raising his thyroid level to see if that helps getting him back to 100 %

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joey
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Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

Your not crazy at all Bruce, I brought all of that up with my vet a couple of years ago.

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nitehunter2004
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
Posts: 12254

quote:
Originally posted by thomasg
It is a proven fact that genetics are the number 1 cause of thyroid dysfunction in dogs passed on by breeding . no different than hip dysplasia as another example of genetic traits passed on by breeding inferior foundation stock . if every one who has a dog that requires medication to preform the task it is breed for would post their dogs pedigrees we as breeders could eliminate those hounds from choices in our breeding programs . WHOS FIRST .LOL

You should be 1st.
Can you post The Proven Fact that it’s Genetic and Passed on from breeding to a thyroid dog to a non thyroid dog?

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Does anyone know of a pup or young dog that was born with a thyroid problem? Don't 95% of dogs "develop" the problem? Everyone that I have heard of was doing great and then went downhill. So are they born with a disposition to a bad thyroid or does their thyroid go bad due to environmental causes? This would be an awfully hard question to answer. I guess that you would have to breed a male and female with known hypothyroid problem and then test the pups at 11 mos old.

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N Williams
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From all the research I've done I've talked to many dog men that have experienced this. A man in my area says he can tell you when his dog gets low because his dog gets aggressive with other males. I've never heard of this and it makes no sense but that's what this particular dog does the man says. This dog has done a good bit of winning to. Think he's a gold ch. after I heard this I started researching it and read an article and they mentioned an increase in misplaced aggression.

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Richard Lambert
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Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Weird, I would think that the opposite would be true. It seems like when they were hyper they would get more aggresive. But maybe when they get tired they get grouchy.

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joey
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Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:
Originally posted by N Williams
From all the research I've done I've talked to many dog men that have experienced this. A man in my area says he can tell you when his dog gets low because his dog gets aggressive with other males. I've never heard of this and it makes no sense but that's what this particular dog does the man says. This dog has done a good bit of winning to. Think he's a gold ch. after I heard this I started researching it and read an article and they mentioned an increase in misplaced aggression.


Its definitely a sign of it. I have a gyp that is as sweet of a little dog as you will ever see. When it gets bad low she gets man aggressive. Get back up and it goes away. Its listed in the symptoms of low thyroid.

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Why is it that most thyroid dogs we hear about are top comp dogs? Do we just not know about the mediocre thyroid dogs? Or does getting their thyroid level above 3.5 make them top comp dogs?

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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I have seen/heard the symptoms of a low thyroid but what are the side effects of getting their level too high? And what is considered "too high"?

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MR.RATMAN
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1- 4 is normal anything above 4 is not good on dogs my vet says to high will cause kidney failure as well as destroying the thyroid glands

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Camanche, Iowa
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Richard Lambert
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Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Thanks, Todd.

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N Williams
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Registered: Dec 2010
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Why is it that most thyroid dogs we hear about are top comp dogs? Do we just not know about the mediocre thyroid dogs? Or does getting their thyroid level above 3.5 make them top comp dogs?


I don't know Richard. Just get you Dog from the local dog trader and a bunch of thyroid pills and test your hypothesis. Be interesting to see cause thyroid pills are much cheaper than nice dogs. I know a dintist that can polish your teeth for all your pictures in the magazine.

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Richard Lambert
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Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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I asked because I actually had one that was just mediocre and I had some thyroid pills. So I thought, what the heck. I gave him one in the morning and one at night. Guess what? It didn't help him at all. He was still just mediocre.

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Bruce m. Conkey
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Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5103

.

Richard, lets say I buy into your thoughts on Thyroid Pills to make the dog go. I am sure some or many have tried. I don't think those people would talk about doing it and worrying about their dog with low Thyroid levels. They would just increase them from normal and move on.

In my reading this morning on the subject from vet sites. Aggressive behavior was one of the signs. I haven't heard that discussed with hounds until Mr. Williams mentioned it.

I plan on finding a vet in the area that has knowledge of this or is willing to learn. I am going to do a complete tick profile and Thyroid work up on every hound I own when is is getting close to a year old and if I have so suspicions of issues I am going to have the work done again and see if there are any changes. That is the only way I can figure out to get a more educated handle on these issues. Maybe in ten years I can share some results that are valid and we can see if its the feed, the nasty critters in the swamps biting them or hereditary.

As far as comp hunt dogs. We talk about all the hunts. Well guess what, we are putting our dogs in competition more. The OLD TIME hounds were Titled out and then pictures taken for a magazine. Todays hounds are hunted and hunted and money deposited in the bank.

I love the past and it is the world I came from. But I understand the future and not scared to test the water.

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Last edited by Bruce m. Conkey on 04-06-2018 at 06:22 PM

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N Williams
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Registered: Dec 2010
Location:
Posts: 1202

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
I asked because I actually had one that was just mediocre and I had some thyroid pills. So I thought, what the heck. I gave him one in the morning and one at night. Guess what? It didn't help him at all. He was still just mediocre.

😂 well now I know.

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MR.RATMAN
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It's like most other meds now a days it takes about 2 weeks to even see a change if it is going to happen. My vet won't even retest his level until he has been on meds for 2 weeks. So next week I go for my 1st test to see were he is at after being on meds for 2 weeks

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Todd Byers
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Richard Lambert
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Location: Chattanooga, Tn
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Bruce they are just thoughts. I don't have an actual opinion as of yet. I am trying to learn. It is true that in the past good dogs were retired a lot sooner. One thing, they were not subjected to the environmental pressure that dogs of today are for many years. Another thing is that E-collar use was not as prevalent. We trained with a switch. And a third difference is they were retired at the first sign of any problems.

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nitehunter2004
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
Posts: 12254

PLEASE DELETE THIS POST!
Tar has learned how to text, he’s sending them faster than I can answer and he real close to blowing a gasket cause he can’t post, two things get under his skin Lipper and Dopping, if he ever finds out Lipper was on thyroid pills it may be the death of him LOL.

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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22460

Oh my goodness, I got one also. Tar, my posts have nothing to do with "doping". I for sure did not mean to imply that I think that the Top comp dogs of today are being "doped". I do not think that giving a dog a medication to correct a physical problem or natural chemical imbalance is "doping". Now if you give a dog with a thyroid level of 3.5-4, Synthroid to get his level up to 5 or 6 then that would be "doping". If your dog had arthritis and you gave him an nsaid, would that be doping? If your dog had erlichia, was rundown/lethargic and you gave him Doxy, would that be "doping"? Let's go back to hypothyroidism and it's causes and treatment. Don't let Tar turn it into a "doping conspiracy" post when he isn't even here.

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nitehunter2004
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
Posts: 12254

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness, I got one also. Tar, my posts have nothing to do with "doping". I for sure did not mean to imply that I think that the Top comp dogs of today are being "doped". I do not think that giving a dog a medication to correct a physical problem or natural chemical imbalance is "doping". Now if you give a dog with a thyroid level of 3.5-4, Synthroid to get his level up to 5 or 6 then that would be "doping". If your dog had arthritis and you gave him an nsaid, would that be doping? If your dog had erlichia, was rundown/lethargic and you gave him Doxy, would that be "doping"? Let's go back to hypothyroidism and it's causes and treatment. Don't let Tar turn it into a "doping conspiracy" post when he isn't even here.

Well He took your advice about his clubs hunts, you told him to cut back on the number of hunts and if the participation still didn’t pick up then he should consider shutting the club down. He Did! You may be one of only 3 people he takes advice from, Great Job.

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DMG_3
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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 220

quote:
Originally posted by nitehunter2004
PLEASE DELETE THIS POST!
Tar has learned how to text, he’s sending them faster than I can answer and he real close to blowing a gasket cause he can’t post, two things get under his skin Lipper and Dopping, if he ever finds out Lipper was on thyroid pills it may be the death of him LOL.




Just think what Lipper could have accomplished if he was on thyroid pills...may have 10,000 pups by now 😀.

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thomasg
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Registered: Apr 2014
Location: batsville ark
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quote:
Originally posted by nitehunter2004
You should be 1st.
Can you post The Proven Fact that it’s Genetic and Passed on from breeding to a thyroid dog to a non thyroid dog?

we now know that measuring autoantibodies is the best available way to diagnose hereditary hypothyroidism. the orthepedic foundation for animals thyroid registry database states " as a result of the variable onset of the presence of autoantibodies, periodic testing will be necessary. since the majority of affected dogs will have autoantiboides by 4 years of age annual testing for the first 4 years is recommended after that testing every other year should suffice any test showing significant levels of thyroid autoantibodies confirms a diagnosis of hereditary hypothyroidism.how often has your stud dog and females been tested for autoantibodies ?what were the results ? not a unreasonable question to ask a breeder when looking for a pup or stud dog to put a female under . still it is a question few will answer or provide documented vet records for confirmation of sound breeding stock.

Last edited by thomasg on 04-07-2018 at 12:41 AM

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nitehunter2004
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
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I haven’t had a thyroid check on ANY of my current dogs male or female, they seem to be fine and have more energy than I do lately, I do check sperm count and brucellosis on my males. I don’t know of One pup or grand pup that I have produced that is on thyroid meds.

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nitehunter2004
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Registered: Jun 2006
Location: Newton, North Carolina
Posts: 12254

I am confused about your question, if I have them checked and it comes back high or comes back low but I don’t start them on any meds because I’m satisfied just way they are, would the numbers have any thing to do rather you breed or not? Let’s say I start one on meds at 7 years old would that change the DNA on the pups born before he was 7 or change the DNA on the pups after he turned 7??

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