UKC Forums UKC Website :: Hunting Ops :: All-Breed Sports :: Registration :: UKC Online Store
Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences Registration is free! Calendar Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Home  
UKC Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.3.0 UKC Forums > Departments > UKC Coonhounds > Money, Money, Money
Pages (9): [1] 2 3 » ... Last »   Last Thread   Next Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Richard Lambert
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22460

Money, Money, Money

I see a lot of hunters saying that it is all about the money these days. I don't remember it always being that way, but then my memory is not the best. When did this start and why? Is it even true?

A lot of hunters say that the younger generation only hunts for the money. Why is that? Do they get paid for their other hobbies or recreation? Do they get paid to play video games? Do they get paid to play high school or college sports? If true, where has the younger generation gotten this concept from?

When our older generation first started coon hunting or was the younger generation did they make money at comp coon hunting or did they even care?

What happened to the personal satisfaction earned from winning a cast or titling a hound. Whatever happened to the personal bond between a man and his hound?

How many of you would just quit hunting and sell your dog if you couldn't win any money?

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 06:05 PM
Richard Lambert is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Lambert Click here to Send Richard Lambert a Private Message Click Here to Email Richard Lambert Find more posts by Richard Lambert Add Richard Lambert to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
ov_blues
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Pomeroy, Ohio
Posts: 2833

How many coon hunters started out years ago to get money for coon hides. When the money for hides disappeared so did a lot of those hunters. Same thing, different times and generations.

__________________
John Smith
Ohio Valley Bluetick Kennel

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 06:12 PM
ov_blues is offline Click Here to See the Profile for ov_blues Click here to Send ov_blues a Private Message Click Here to Email ov_blues Find more posts by ov_blues Add ov_blues to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Nothing wrong with owning dogs that pay their own way !! But I never had any good enough to buy me a Winnie baygo , a jeep , or buy the boss lunch lol.



Tar

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 06:21 PM
yadkintar is offline Click Here to See the Profile for yadkintar Click here to Send yadkintar a Private Message Click Here to Email yadkintar Find more posts by yadkintar Add yadkintar to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5103

.

Richard you quoted the young ones saying they only hunted for money. I think 75 years ago it was the same way. Except you have to skin them and take them to a fur buyer before you got your money. I am sure if it wasn't for the money and or food on the table. Many a farmer wouldn't work all day and then coon hunt all night.

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 06:43 PM
Bruce m. Conkey is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Bruce m. Conkey Click here to Send Bruce m. Conkey a Private Message Click Here to Email Bruce m. Conkey Visit Bruce m. Conkey's homepage! Find more posts by Bruce m. Conkey Add Bruce m. Conkey to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Bruce m. Conkey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2016
Location: Palatka, FL
Posts: 5103

.

I just saw a STOCK DOG sell on Facebook at an auction for $30 grand. Grandpa could of filled up his stock yard with real cows for that. Times have changed!

__________________
www.ConkeysOutdoors.com
"Boss Lights"

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 06:55 PM
Bruce m. Conkey is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Bruce m. Conkey Click here to Send Bruce m. Conkey a Private Message Click Here to Email Bruce m. Conkey Visit Bruce m. Conkey's homepage! Find more posts by Bruce m. Conkey Add Bruce m. Conkey to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Richard Lambert
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22460

I was mostly talking about competition hunting.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 07:20 PM
Richard Lambert is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Lambert Click here to Send Richard Lambert a Private Message Click Here to Email Richard Lambert Find more posts by Richard Lambert Add Richard Lambert to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
swamp1
Banned

Registered: Aug 2012
Location:
Posts: 930

Money talks

Thats just the way it is. It all started when competion hunts started being held. Then along came 💰 hunts and it evolved to the point its at today. Win by any means necessary,does'nt matter as long as you win 💰.

When it first started out it was similar to car sales. Advertising wins to become one of most popular breeds to make the most 💰,hopefully.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 07:43 PM
swamp1 is offline Click Here to See the Profile for swamp1 Click here to Send swamp1 a Private Message Find more posts by swamp1 Add swamp1 to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Al Medcalf
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2005
Location: Barnesville, Ga.
Posts: 409

My thoughts for years and I stick by them. Anyone who makes a profit off coondogs is a crook. Be it selling dogs, puppies, comp. hunts or whatever.

__________________
If It Climbs, It Ain't Trash

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 07:53 PM
Al Medcalf is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Al Medcalf Click here to Send Al Medcalf a Private Message Click Here to Email Al Medcalf Find more posts by Al Medcalf Add Al Medcalf to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
shane_atchison
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2007
Location:
Posts: 1009

No new concept. In the 80s-early 90s A man could not only pay for his hobby, but make good profit. Selling hides, raising a litter, starting young dogs, or winning a few hunts & selling a titled hound used to pay a lot of my bills..

__________________
Shane

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 08:34 PM
shane_atchison is offline Click Here to See the Profile for shane_atchison Click here to Send shane_atchison a Private Message Click Here to Email shane_atchison Find more posts by shane_atchison Add shane_atchison to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
newport
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2012
Location: indiana/brazil
Posts: 307

I enjoy winning money because you get something out of that win. ive seen so many guys on this forum talk about yellow pieces of paper so many times. well now we don't even get that starting in January. I guess I just like to get something out of a win. I definitely don't win all the time by any means but when I do I like to have something to show for it. as much work and time goes into this its nice to just get something for a win kinda a pat on the back for all that hard work. we all know that its hard if not impossible to make a living running hounds. so yes I like the whole winning money thing.

__________________
NEWPORTS LATE NIGHT KENNELS

Home of
PKC CH GRNITECH PR Newports Late Night Chill HTX
PR eel river rye
PR late night walker texas ranger (tex)
PR Big Walnuts Late Night Branch



proud member of The Deer Creek Cartel
Check out the deercreek cartel youtube channel at- youtube.com/c/thedeercreekcartel

BSKC founding member

matt newport

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 08:49 PM
newport is offline Click Here to See the Profile for newport Click here to Send newport a Private Message Click Here to Email newport Find more posts by newport Add newport to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Jason Bourne
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2017
Location:
Posts: 114

I'm with Richard on this

What happened to the personal satisfaction earned from winning a cast or titling a hound. Whatever happened to the personal bond between a man and his hound?
Like the old school bond, otherwise you are missing out on a lot of satisfaction.

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 09:15 PM
Jason Bourne is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Jason Bourne Click here to Send Jason Bourne a Private Message Click Here to Email Jason Bourne Find more posts by Jason Bourne Add Jason Bourne to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5612

Mr. Lambert

Anyone that's in this sport for the money is going to be highly disappointed. Do the math, dog feed gas, time, other expenses , if it's money you seek, get a real job that pays and has benefits. I would not coon hunt these mountains for any price, yet I do it for fun. If you aren't having fun coonhunting, you need another hobby. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-10-2018 10:13 PM
Dave Richards is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Richards Click here to Send Dave Richards a Private Message Click Here to Email Dave Richards Find more posts by Dave Richards Add Dave Richards to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
DocAcumen
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jan 2008
Location: Kell, Il
Posts: 169

Re: Money, Money, Money

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
I see a lot of hunters saying that it is all about the money these days. I don't remember it always being that way, but then my memory is not the best. When did this start and why? Is it even true?

A lot of hunters say that the younger generation only hunts for the money. Why is that? Do they get paid for their other hobbies or recreation? Do they get paid to play video games? Do they get paid to play high school or college sports? If true, where has the younger generation gotten this concept from?

When our older generation first started coon hunting or was the younger generation did they make money at comp coon hunting or did they even care?

What happened to the personal satisfaction earned from winning a cast or titling a hound. Whatever happened to the personal bond between a man and his hound?

How many of you would just quit hunting and sell your dog if you couldn't win any money?




OH BOY! This is such a LOADED QUESTION!!!!
First, Yes!!! There are ones that get paid to PLAY VIDEO GAMES!!!!
TRUE!!!!
There are competitions , that PAY well for it!!!
as strange as it may seem?

And as you well KNOW !!!!
Coon Hunting did pay well , at points in time!!!
From way back!!! till what the mid 80's?
When Hides paid well!!!
Gas was cheap! some had good dogs go get that $$$$$
Others were shining to claim some of that easy $$$$

Some stayed at it , as they enjoyed it!
Some did not!

At that point , many left!!!
And some ran across the $$$$ hunts !

Found a reason to hunt!! as they could still make some $$$$ that way!!!!!

Even at that time, there was still $$$$ to be made !!!!
As they could still WIN Titles , and Promote a dog for STUD!!!!!

I am only taking a guess at this as to what happens next? LOL!

The ones in the KNOW!!!!
Realized , this is a Business !

Just as Horse Racers did!!!
Make it a Business!

I believe ? all one has to do is show a PROFIT , Once every 7 Years?
and It is a tax right off?

SOOOOO

that is what i get from it all!

Am I wrong?
Good chance!!!

So , I am as you probably know ?
The KIDs as yuo say....
Like the Sport!!
But , want to be paid !!!
As the ones back in the Day where!!!

They got PAID!! For getting Skins to be SOLD!!!!
The Kids get it form Putting a Title on a dog , or winning $$$$ with the DOG!!!!

They are not going to do that with selling any skins!!!!

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 12:43 AM
DocAcumen is offline Click Here to See the Profile for DocAcumen Click here to Send DocAcumen a Private Message Find more posts by DocAcumen Add DocAcumen to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

I would have paid Sombody big money to pick me up on the death march me and Corey just took.



Tar

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 02:01 AM
yadkintar is offline Click Here to See the Profile for yadkintar Click here to Send yadkintar a Private Message Click Here to Email yadkintar Find more posts by yadkintar Add yadkintar to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
newport
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2012
Location: indiana/brazil
Posts: 307

Re: I'm with Richard on this

quote:
Originally posted by Jason Bourne
What happened to the personal satisfaction earned from winning a cast or titling a hound. Whatever happened to the personal bond between a man and his hound?
Like the old school bond, otherwise you are missing out on a lot of satisfaction.



Anyone that really calls themselves a true houndsman still has all those things. Ask my wife she will tell you about my bond I have with my dogs lol she often thinks I have a deeperone with them than her. I do get a lot of satisfaction out of getting a cast win and having titles on dogs but it is nice to get something back from it all. That is just another satisfaction for some people. This is a very expensive hobby that you will never get rich from but I just like the fact of possibly getting some of it back.

__________________
NEWPORTS LATE NIGHT KENNELS

Home of
PKC CH GRNITECH PR Newports Late Night Chill HTX
PR eel river rye
PR late night walker texas ranger (tex)
PR Big Walnuts Late Night Branch



proud member of The Deer Creek Cartel
Check out the deercreek cartel youtube channel at- youtube.com/c/thedeercreekcartel

BSKC founding member

matt newport

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 02:17 AM
newport is offline Click Here to See the Profile for newport Click here to Send newport a Private Message Click Here to Email newport Find more posts by newport Add newport to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
newport
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2012
Location: indiana/brazil
Posts: 307

And this question is and always will be a loaded gun in our world of coon hunting. I'll admit I'm a younger guy but I'm also not from the participation trophy era either. I work very hard at two jobs have a family and hunt as much as possible and I'll just be honest that's my hard earned money that goes into this sport and I like winning some of it back every now and then. Y'all can look down on me or think I'm wrong all you want but opinions are just like well you know and we all are untitled to them. With the way our wonderful economy is now days I just don't get what the big fuss is about getting money for winning a hunt if you don't like that that's your opinion and I'll never look down on someone for it. No one is holding a gun to anyone's head saying you will go to this hunt that's paying money if you win. So fact of the matter is times are changing just like they always will if I don't like something I simply don't do it.

__________________
NEWPORTS LATE NIGHT KENNELS

Home of
PKC CH GRNITECH PR Newports Late Night Chill HTX
PR eel river rye
PR late night walker texas ranger (tex)
PR Big Walnuts Late Night Branch



proud member of The Deer Creek Cartel
Check out the deercreek cartel youtube channel at- youtube.com/c/thedeercreekcartel

BSKC founding member

matt newport

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 02:28 AM
newport is offline Click Here to See the Profile for newport Click here to Send newport a Private Message Click Here to Email newport Find more posts by newport Add newport to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5612

Matt Newport

I like your post, nothing wrong with wanting to get a little something back from the sport. Problem is you are never even going to break even, much less make any money coon hunting. It's really no different than any hobby, you will spend much more than you get back. A hobby is just that, something we do for fun and pleasure. A job is what we do for money. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 02:28 AM
Dave Richards is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Richards Click here to Send Dave Richards a Private Message Click Here to Email Dave Richards Find more posts by Dave Richards Add Dave Richards to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
shane_atchison
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2007
Location:
Posts: 1009

Days of common part time hunters making money are over I agree, but nothing wrong with hitting a few $ hunts to offset cost. I recently sold a Silver champ that was a nite champ and an interested man asked why he wasn't granded and I replied probably cause of cost vs. reward..

__________________
Shane

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 02:48 AM
shane_atchison is offline Click Here to See the Profile for shane_atchison Click here to Send shane_atchison a Private Message Click Here to Email shane_atchison Find more posts by shane_atchison Add shane_atchison to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
jkhutch
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2009
Location: West Central Indiana
Posts: 1318

Hmm, good post Mr Lambert. I think that the money does help get me to the hunts. Even though it’s not a lot at least it does pay for gas if I win. Let’s see if I just go hunting for a couple hours I’m using gas to get to the woods just to turn the dog loose. I can drive to a hunt pay an entry and possibly pay for my gas to hunt as well. I think I also read up above that people have always seemed to hunt for money of some sort. Isn’t that why coonhounds were bred anyways?? To catch raccoons so people would have furs to sell, trade, or barter with?? I don’t think it really started out as sport or hobby as it is today. I think it was originally intended for a lot people’s way of life, to help provide an income. I don’t how many times my dad has told me the stories of how he and my mom bought our kids Christmas with the money from hides in the 70’s and 80’s. Back then he was selling hides for $15 to $40 each. I bet if Coons were worth that now there would be a lot less people going to hunts and trying to get there money back, they would be in the woods trying to make some money by skinning hides instead.

__________________
Jared Hutcheson
Indiana
Redbones:
GRNTCH PKC Ch PR Hutch's Big Walnut Boone HTX DNA-V(Haze X Reba)-
2 Time UKC World Top 100
UKC World Top 20 (13th)
UKC Purina Redbone of the year
PKC Redbone CH
UKC Top Producers List
UKC Winter Classic High Scoring Redbone
Co owned with Richard Lambert

GrNtCh PKC Ch One Chance Fancy- (Boone X Toadie)
2018 Autumn Oaks Grand 16
2018 Grand National Redbone
2018 Redbones Days RQE 1st Place

Walkers-
NTCh PKC CH Jeb’s Finley River Peanut- Co owned with Bishop Stallcop
Claremont PKC Legacy hunt Final 4
PKC Breeders Showcase Final 4

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 03:12 AM
jkhutch is offline Click Here to See the Profile for jkhutch Click here to Send jkhutch a Private Message Find more posts by jkhutch Add jkhutch to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
honalieh
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 2154

Hunting For Money???

I work for money. Hunting is one of the ways I spend it.

I don't even think that most that claim to be hunting for money are doing so for that reason. Whatever small amount of money they win will be much less than they spend (in dollars and time). They do like to see their names on the winning list though (I think that's a bigger part of it if they are being honest with themselves).

There are a lot more deer hunters than coonhunters. Are they hunting for money? No. They spend it.

There are a lot of people that make hunting trips for big game. Are they hunting for money? No. They spend it.

Same thing applies to fishing (except maybe the Bassmasters).

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 04:34 AM
honalieh is offline Click Here to See the Profile for honalieh Click here to Send honalieh a Private Message Click Here to Email honalieh Find more posts by honalieh Add honalieh to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Dave Richards
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2015
Location: church hill tn
Posts: 5612

Honalieh

The only ones making money fishing are the ones that have sponsors backing them. I have some friends that fish a lot of tournaments, winning some, but their expenses are way more than their winnings. Like you said, it's all about getting recognized when they win, they still lose money but do have fun. Dave

__________________
Dave Richards Treeing Walkers Reg American Saddlebred and Registered Rocky Mt. Show Horses

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 06:07 AM
Dave Richards is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Dave Richards Click here to Send Dave Richards a Private Message Click Here to Email Dave Richards Find more posts by Dave Richards Add Dave Richards to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Corey Gruver
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 1731

I hate money hunts, and I’m a young’un :O

__________________
Corey Gruver
Greenville, PA
(724) 456-6813

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 07:44 AM
Corey Gruver is offline Click Here to See the Profile for Corey Gruver Click here to Send Corey Gruver a Private Message Find more posts by Corey Gruver Add Corey Gruver to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
johnny reb
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2004
Location: tennessee
Posts: 856

Corey Grover just curios why do you say you hate money hunts?

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 12:15 PM
johnny reb is offline Click Here to See the Profile for johnny reb Click here to Send johnny reb a Private Message Click Here to Email johnny reb Find more posts by johnny reb Add johnny reb to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

The reason I like $$$ hunts is not what one might think. I am old enough to have seen a lot of hunts. Through the years ukc's refusal to change rules as the dogs evolved to fit the loopholes in ther rules when the $$$ kc's do so regularly! The money is good but like in any other sport it's hard for an old boy with limited income to compete in the races ect with Sombody flush with cash. I hunted in a ton of three hour hunts and threw a fit when they went to 2 hours now I like 1 hr hunts lol. Just like I told the boss the other day and I am not being a Debbie downer I had a bunch of guys wanting me to open this club back up but they wanted updated rules and $$$$. When I told them it wasn't going to happen they just said well there is a $$$$ kc right here that has those things we asked ukc for. So you see ukc in a sense is sending them away because they refuse to listen to them. Takes a different type dog down here but we have to play by the rules the nothern patch hunters want. Hopefully what changes they have made with create enough interest to keep some younger hunters interested. But be carefull turn them away and it won't take much .............. Well you know the rest of the story.



Tar

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 12:40 PM
yadkintar is offline Click Here to See the Profile for yadkintar Click here to Send yadkintar a Private Message Click Here to Email yadkintar Find more posts by yadkintar Add yadkintar to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
newport
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2012
Location: indiana/brazil
Posts: 307

corey I also would like to know why you hate them honestly id like to know solid reasons behind anyone that "hates money hunts". theres a lot of people out there that hate ukc hunts because they don't pay or they don't like ukc rules do you guys that hate money hunts hate those guys just asking. to everyone saying you don't make money at this holy crap we know that ive said it and so has everyone else that has ever talked about this. quit beating the horse that died 20 years ago lol. we know!

__________________
NEWPORTS LATE NIGHT KENNELS

Home of
PKC CH GRNITECH PR Newports Late Night Chill HTX
PR eel river rye
PR late night walker texas ranger (tex)
PR Big Walnuts Late Night Branch



proud member of The Deer Creek Cartel
Check out the deercreek cartel youtube channel at- youtube.com/c/thedeercreekcartel

BSKC founding member

matt newport

Last edited by newport on 12-11-2018 at 12:44 PM

Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged

Old Post 12-11-2018 12:41 PM
newport is offline Click Here to See the Profile for newport Click here to Send newport a Private Message Click Here to Email newport Find more posts by newport Add newport to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
All times are GMT. The time now is 10:05 PM. Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Pages (9): [1] 2 3 » ... Last »   Last Thread   Next Thread
Show Printable Version | Email this Page | Subscribe to this Thread


Forum Jump:
 

Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
 
< Contact Us - United Kennel Club >

Copyright 2003-2020, United Kennel Club
Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.3.0
(vBulletin courtesy Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.)