Registered: Mar 2008
Location: gillsville ga
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scenario four dog cast two dogs tree the judge puts the stationary on the two dogs no handler trees there dog stationary expires the cast proceeds to the tree arrive both dogs are in a hole what happens to the two dogs.

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Delete the strikes as long as one of those dogs are showing the hole. I assume you knew something wasn't right thats why you didn't tree them. The judge can't minus you for not treeing your dog as long as he was in the hole.

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I wasn't in the cast hunting another registry that night but it happen on my buddies cast and the judge scratched the two dogs questioned it and the moh said you can't scratched dogs are in a hole not on a tree. Just curious as to what others thought on it

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Last edited by evan ashley on 12-22-2008 at 09:57 AM

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5. CIRCLED AND DELETED POINTS

Circle points:

(a) When dog strikes and trees up a tree or a hole in the ground where there could be a coon, yet Judge does not see coon and no off game is seen. (No tree climbing.) NOTE: In case of running coon in hole or place of refuge other than a tree, handler may call dog treed. However, if not called treed, cast may proceed to general area, and track can be considered finished if dogs, by actions either tree barking or otherwise, show to the satisfaction of the Judge, coon to be there. One dog must show end of trail. For dogs declared treed in hole or tile, see Rule 3(b) or 4(c), if applicable.


*6. DOGS WILL BE SCRATCHED

(q) If handler fails to declare treed a dog obviously treeing (Judge's decision) for a period of five minutes. Dog may be declared treed while five is running but not after the five has expired. Judge must verify dog to be at a tree before it can be scratched.

This was all I could find. Another question would be, what would of you do if you looked in the hole and seen a coon or off game? Just wondering.

I know around here if you tree in a hole, there's a real good chance it's going to be a diller.....

Last edited by Brad Southard on 12-22-2008 at 10:40 AM

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Actually you would circle the strike if one of the dogs showed the hole. You would NOT delet it.

IF you seen a coon then all strike would be plus provided nobody had called a dog treed.

Any dog called treed would have his strike AND tree plussed if they saw a coon.

Same thing involving minus if a registered cast saw off game in the hole, strike minused if nobody is treed in, strike and tree of those that are treed.

You would NOT delete any points, they showed the end of the track and the place of refuge should be scored plus, minus, or circle.

To top it off this would apply to all dogs that were there so even though only two of them were in the hole if all four were there they would ALL get a piece of it. Only one dog has to show the place of refuge for all dogs to get scored on it.

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Last edited by Rip on 12-22-2008 at 01:21 PM

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quote:

---

Originally posted by evan ashley
I wasn't in the cast hunting another registry that night but it happen on my buddies cast and the judge scratched the two dogs questioned it and the moh said you can't scratched dogs are in a hole not on a tree. Just curious as to what others thought on it

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Ga dawg I moved up here close to you on 53 bout 4 miles before you get to 400

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Dang,When you move up here? Which side of 400 dawsonville or gainsville side? We will have our club meeting in Jan.You need to come join.We will have to hit the forest one night pretty soon.Get you used to these hills lol......

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Gainesville side across from grannys on old keith bridge rd I moved up here bout a month ago. I don't know if I can youst to these hills. But I will still be a hunting

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For all of you guys that would scratch the dog....

Rule 6(q) If handler fails to declare treed a dog obviously treeing (Judge's decision) for a period of five minutes. Dog may be declared treed while five is running but not after the five has expired. Judge must verify dog to be at a tree before it can be scratched.


The way this should be handled is this....after the five is up, cast proceeds to the hole...once it is determined that the dogs are NOT on a tree...then the cast should simply walk away.

There is no provision to score the dogs, without a call from the handler. If the handlers want to tree the dogs at that time, then and only then can the cast score the dogs...The only exception is if a dog catches a coon on the ground, then the cast can and should proceed without a call from the handler(s)....

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i think if it's obvious the dogs are showing the end of the track to the judges satisfaction they can handle there dogs without having to make a tree call...

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Rip
Actually you would circle the strike if one of the dogs showed the hole. You would NOT delet it.

IF you seen a coon then all strike would be plus provided nobody had called a dog treed.

Any dog called treed would have his strike AND tree plussed if they saw a coon.

Same thing involving minus if a registered cast saw off game in the hole, strike minused if nobody is treed in, strike and tree of those that are treed.

You would NOT delete any points, they showed the end of the track and the place of refuge should be scored plus, minus, or circle.

To top it off this would apply to all dogs that were there so even though only two of them were in the hole if all four were there they would ALL get a piece of it. Only one dog has to show the place of refuge for all dogs to get scored on it.

---

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Oak Ridge
...once it is determined that the dogs are NOT on a tree...then the cast should simply walk away.

There is no provision to score the dogs, without a call from the handler. If the handlers want to tree the dogs at that time, then and only then can the cast score the dogs...The only exception is if a dog catches a coon on the ground, then the cast can and should proceed without a call from the handler(s)....

---

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LOOK FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT WANT HD/ PANEL CANT EVEN GET THREE PEOPLE AGREE ON THIS QUETION!!!!

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I would like to make a correction to my origional post though, if you saw off game in the hole then all dogs treeing at that hole when the cast arrived would also have tree points assigned if they weren't already treed in, those at the hole but not treeing would have their strike minused. Sorry bout that, got a little carried away.

So, bottom line is nobody has to call a dog treed to score a hole, if the cast thinks they are in a hole they can go score it and score strike points of those that aren't treed in, strike and tree to those that are treed in. Only one dog has to show the hole, if the rest are close enough to be considered there they get scored as well. Use scoring rules correctly, plus for coon seen, circle if no game seen, and minus for off game according to what each dog is doing.

Sorry for the confusion of leaving out that you can assign points to dogs treeing off game but not declared treed. You can do that at a hole just as good as you can at a tree.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Maniac
LOOK FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT WANT HD/ PANEL CANT EVEN GET THREE PEOPLE AGREE ON THIS QUETION!!!!

---

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Well,


First off....there is not one single person who has disagreed that the dogs should not have been scratched....the rule is plain....as it is written that dogs must be showing a TREE to be scratched using the stationary rule.

Yes, I stand corrected about scoring the hole....however, one could argue that if the judge put the stationary on the dogs, nobody realized that it was a hole, and as such, there was no "justification" for going in to score the dogs....however, once there...you score it accordingly.

So, the panel system would work, the ability to talk the situation through, consult the rules, and come to an agreement between the members of the panel would ensure that the PROPER decision was reached.

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WELL I CAN TELL YOU THIS YOU DONT BACK AWAY FROM A HOLE . YOU SCORE A HOLE. IF THE STASTIONARY IS PUT ON A DOG AND YOU SEE THAT THEY ARE TREED ON A FENCE YOU BACK AWAY. BUT A HOLE YOU DONT YOU SCORE IT!!! AND THAT MEANS LOOK IN THE HOLE AND SCORE IT. NOT WALK AWAY AND NOT LOOK IN THE HOLE. LIKE ALOT OF PEOPLE DO!!! I WONDER WHY!!

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Last edited by Maniac on 12-23-2008 at 01:57 AM

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Another good reason to break them from treeing in holes!! 99% of the time nothing good can come from it..

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WOW! What a mess this turned into. In the original scenario the Judge was WRONG for scratching the dogs.
Next someone asked what if a coon is seen. If a coon was seen strike points, for the dogs there, would be plussed. There were no dogs treed so tree points were not relevant. If a dog had been declared treed it would receive plus strike and plus tree if the coon was seen.
Now the next issue. What if off game was seen. If off game was seen, in registered cast, the strike points would be minused for those dogs at the hole. If off game was seen and it was Nite Champion or Grand Nite, the dogs are scratched. Again since none of the dogs were treed there are no tree points relevant. Sorry RIP BUT YOU DO NOT ASIGN NEXT TREE POINTS TO DOGS IN A HOLE!
Feel free to contact Allen or Todd for anymore questions or verification of my answers.

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Last edited by Clay Lautzenhiser on 12-23-2008 at 07:37 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by Clay Lautzenhiser
WOW! What a mess this turned into. In the original scenario the Judge was WRONG for scratching the dogs and the MOH was WRONG for upholding the scratch.

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I see and edited my remarks. I didn't realize that this was the same incident but actually one of the involved handlers was Scotty handling my Gunner dog. I was contacted by phone and made aware of the situation.

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Last edited by Clay Lautzenhiser on 12-23-2008 at 07:40 PM

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The moh did not scratch the dogs and scotty aka country aint bad on here got a second place win

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Evan; notice I edited my post evidentally I misread it initially. I am well aware who Scotty is. He has had my dog for about a month and a half.

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It is alright clay I was just curious on the answers that is why I posted this and congrats to scotty and you and gunner on winning maybe I will be lucky to draw him and see what the blue dog can do there's none around here since the preacher quit

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