Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oakdale, Pennsylvania
Posts: 3753

quote:

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Originally posted by Ron Moore
Now, let me get this strait. Once a hound reaches 85% they can be returned back to the original registery from where they came from, right? In other words, what we would consider a cull could become an X breed. So once they are back to 85%, they can go back into whatever registery they started, and further complicate the problem with culls that we were trying to get rid of in the first place???? People, does this really make sense?
My father hunted mixed breeds when I was growing up because it was a comon thing. He never had much luck with the off spring from those dogs but once and a while one would do good. We have come a long way in all of the breeds, refining them, culling them and straining out many of the bad traits, do we really want to do this?

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__________________
Fan of the of the Bragg and Vaughn Blues !! TREE OLD HUSSLER in Memory of DOC Householder... Rest in Peace Rev. Kenneth Adkins my dear friend !! Home Will's Creek Savage Sioux-Zee!!
Yeah, I competition hunt !! All Fall and Winter long.. My Blues compete with the local coon.. My Blues win a ton !!! We use and recommend MOONSHINER LIGHTS, Peggs , Ok.

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Registered: Feb 2012
Location: airville,pa
Posts: 2078

i hope u boys aren't done that soon. 3 years is all it will take. change is somtimes hard to handle!

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: New Market Va
Posts: 4670

quote:

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Originally posted by pamjohnson
i hope u boys aren't done that soon. 3 years is all it will take. change is somtimes hard to handle!

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Steve Morrow "Saltlick Majestic's"
"Never Have Hounds Or Kids And You Won't Get Your Heart Broke"!!

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PR, Saltlick's Blue Misty Linga "Bluetick Coonhound"

French X American Hounds

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Registered: Jul 2007
Location: WESTERN MARYLAND
Posts: 5946

I HAVE TO AGREE WITH WAYNE AND RON 100%. ON THIS.

I DO NOT MEAN TO UPSET ANYONE BUT I THINK UKC SEES $$$$$ SIGNS.

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Home of;

Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch. Gr.WCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Crystal
Ntch. GrCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Magic
Gr.Nt.Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Hawk
Nt. Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Rage
all are gone now but will NEVER BE FORGOTTEN


CH. PR. MCMILLANS TREE ROCKIN BRANDY
CH. PR. MCMILLANS MIDNITES STINGIN SADIE

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: WV
Posts: 821

quote:

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Originally posted by Majestic Tree H
3 Years ??? Try 8-10 years at a min. if your Breeding and Testing properly .

I'm 18 years into breeding my crosses and I haven't made a 3 generation .. If it doesn't work or if the prodigee isn't Better than the parent then you have to change course ..

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Registered: Sep 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 1775

I'm totally missing why you guys are so concerned?

No one is forcing anybody to use a "X" bred dog in their breeding program. Even if a "X" bred dog has been bred to an 80% pure status, do not use it if you don't want to. Very simple.

I wish everyone who wants to try "X" breeding the best! I don't think driving reason behind it has to do with $$. If anything, the papers will now be more accurate on a lot of hounds than they ever have been in the past.

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Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: WV
Posts: 821

I don't think driving reason behind it has to do with $$. If anything, the papers will now be more accurate on a lot of hounds than they ever have been in the past.

I am for everyone do what he or she wants. I can see what you're saying but if not for money, then what? Also how can the papers be more accurate? I always thought, expecially sense the DNA came out, that the papers were as true and honest as the owner that had them. Now, when we factor in the owners, there's where we may have problems. It's possible that all owners aren't as honest as you or I. Of course, it's been that way sense I've been coon hunting, going on 50 years now. I'd better shut up, thats a little too much info! LOL

Ron

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Registered: Jul 2007
Location: WESTERN MARYLAND
Posts: 5946

VIC,

I TO DO NOT THINK MONEY IS DRIVING THIS. THAT WAS JUST A PICK AT UKC. I JUST DO NOT LIKE THE IDEA OF CROSS BREDS. AS FOR NOT BREEDING TO IT. WHAT ABOUT WHAT IS BEHIND WHAT YOU ARE BREEDING TO. SOONER OR LATER IT WILL CROP UP.

RON,
I TO THOUGHT PAPERS WOULD BE MORE ACCURATE WITH DNA. BUT PEOPLE ARE NOT ALL HONEST. I TOO CAN REMEMBER HEARING ABOUT PAPERS BEING PUT ON DOGS WHEN I WAS YOUNGER.

I GUESS I FALL INTO THE CATEGORY OF NOT LIKEING CHANGE.

__________________
Home of;

Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch. Gr.WCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Crystal
Ntch. GrCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Magic
Gr.Nt.Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Hawk
Nt. Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Rage
all are gone now but will NEVER BE FORGOTTEN


CH. PR. MCMILLANS TREE ROCKIN BRANDY
CH. PR. MCMILLANS MIDNITES STINGIN SADIE

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: WV
Posts: 821

quote:

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Originally posted by rmcmillan
VIC,

I TO DO NOT THINK MONEY IS DRIVING THIS. THAT WAS JUST A PICK AT UKC. I JUST DO NOT LIKE THE IDEA OF CROSS BREDS. AS FOR NOT BREEDING TO IT. WHAT ABOUT WHAT IS BEHIND WHAT YOU ARE BREEDING TO. SOONER OR LATER IT WILL CROP UP.

RON,
I TO THOUGHT PAPERS WOULD BE MORE ACCURATE WITH DNA. BUT PEOPLE ARE NOT ALL HONEST. I TOO CAN REMEMBER HEARING ABOUT PAPERS BEING PUT ON DOGS WHEN I WAS YOUNGER.

I GUESS I FALL INTO THE CATEGORY OF NOT LIKEING CHANGE.

---

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Registered: Sep 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 1775

quote:

---

Originally posted by rmcmillan
AS FOR NOT BREEDING TO IT. WHAT ABOUT WHAT IS BEHIND WHAT YOU ARE BREEDING TO. SOONER OR LATER IT WILL CROP UP.

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I disagree. If you are serious about what you are breeding to, you will have done the research and be sure about what is behind them.

If anything, the way the current system is lends itself more to the chance of something being not 100% kosher in the background. I would also bet a dollar to a stale doughnut that the blue haired potlicker in my back yard or your back yard may very well have a blemish or two in the genetic woodpile

Ron, papers will be more accurate because people can tell the truth about what the dog is actually out of, not claim ignorance & single register the hound based on color.

Then again, I hunt blue dogs, so my thought process can't be all that great !! LOL

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

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Registered: Nov 2013
Location: Kansas
Posts: 345

Good post Vic.


There is more than just money involved, there is opportunity. Now guy's can legitimately take there cross dogs to a UKC hunt, the UKC makes money but that may be one more dog at a club hunt that needs help.

Heck, this could even drive up demand for "pure" pups.

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Registered: Apr 2006
Location: DEEP FORK VALLEY, OKLAHOMA
Posts: 1815

It is about money. Let x breed in a make it mandatory to DNA any sire or dam to be able to have pups PR bred. Its coming!! Aqha requires it and so does abbi bucking bulls

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Mcalester,oklahoma
Posts: 893

Good post Vic!


I personally see nothing wrong with bringing this x breed in.

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Owner: Brent Bowling 918-421-0043

Nitech Double Springs Woodrow (2015 Performance Sire)
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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1454

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Jones
It is about money. Let x breed in a make it mandatory to DNA any sire or dam to be able to have pups PR bred. Its coming!! Aqha requires it and so does abbi bucking bulls

---

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Registered: Sep 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 1775

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Jones
It is about money. Let x breed in a make it mandatory to DNA any sire or dam to be able to have pups PR bred. Its coming!! Aqha requires it and so does abbi bucking bulls

---

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

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Registered: Apr 2006
Location: DEEP FORK VALLEY, OKLAHOMA
Posts: 1815

your right Travis, probably could be a good thing. Should be a lot less potlickers bred if they start requiring dna.

Vic, I don't care one way or the other really. That goes for folks breeding mutts or dna. I see a good mutt I like and they get it done I just hope I can get it for a mutt price

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Last edited by Tom Jones on 09-09-2014 at 01:25 PM

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Mcalester,oklahoma
Posts: 893

Lol those mutts will make a showing you watch and see!

__________________
Miracle Hills Kennels
Owner: Brent Bowling 918-421-0043

Nitech Double Springs Woodrow (2015 Performance Sire)
Nitech True Blue Maybe
Miracle Hills Big Nasty Girl
Woodrows Sugar ~ n~ Spice

Don't settle for less strive for the best

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Registered: Sep 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 1775

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Jones
your right Travis, probably could be a good thing. Should be a lot less potlickers bred if they start requiring dna.

Vic, I don't care one way or the other really. That goes for folks breeding mutts or dna. I see a good mutt I like and they get it done I just hope I can get it for a mutt price

---

LOL Isn't that what we have now? A bunch of DNA'd Purple Ribbon bred mutts? Seems like those mutt prices are always available till you want one of em ... go figure!

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Camden,NC
Posts: 2719

Gentleman, I guess I've read this posting and others from the other breeds as well. What I just can't figure out is the why ??

OK, I guess it would rid the breed associations of having to deal with single registration.......and the Bluetick Organization was the only one that required DNA as part of that process.

Now my take on it for what its worth, and yes I've been lucky and owned some great hounds in my life time at least in my mind and bred and followed up with daughters from those females.

Why do we need it ?? Each of the breeds have great hounds in them, and if we are truthful with ourselves and willing to note the short falls of our hounds and work to find the male that will fill those, build on the strengths of our hounds to complement each other we breed for a better hound.

If we have to go outside of our breed to supposedly get what is missing, then WE HAVE FAILED AS BREEDERS of our breed !!!! Being truthful with yourself, finding the strengths to build upon will get us where we need.

But, we must be willing to find the faults of our own dog and look for the crossing bloodline that will make the next generation better. If we have to cross the walker, Redbone, Black & Tan whatever to get what you think you need then your not looking hard enough, being truthful with yourself and last again WE HAVE FAILED AS BREEDERS AND GUARDIANS OF OUR BREED.

I'm not against it, I just choose to work harder to breed a better Bluetick so I can enjoy the sport I love and share with friends and family. Its just not my cup of tea and never will be for me. I will do the homework, work to find the strengths I need and build on that.

If making the cross of the X-breed is your goal its a free country and more power to ya, but before you do it how about being honest and looking at what you need and go out and find it. its there if you just do the work.

Just my opinion, and good luck no matter what you hunt and choose to breed.

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Take a Child Hunting, and you will never forget it !!

GR NIte CH GR CH'PR' Dalton & Haucks BluRidge Lynn

GR Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's So Blue Queen

GR NIte Ch Rogers Blue Molly

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Daltons BluRidge Pat (Full liitermate brother to Smokey II)

Nite CH GR CH GR W CH'PR' Hauck's Carlolina Star

Nite CH GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Queen II (Daughter of Queen)

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Nancy Ann

GR CH'PR' Southland's Blue Ebony (Daughter of Ann)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oakdale, Pennsylvania
Posts: 3753

quote:

---

Originally posted by ratpack
Lol those mutts will make a showing you watch and see!

---

__________________
Fan of the of the Bragg and Vaughn Blues !! TREE OLD HUSSLER in Memory of DOC Householder... Rest in Peace Rev. Kenneth Adkins my dear friend !! Home Will's Creek Savage Sioux-Zee!!
Yeah, I competition hunt !! All Fall and Winter long.. My Blues compete with the local coon.. My Blues win a ton !!! We use and recommend MOONSHINER LIGHTS, Peggs , Ok.

Last edited by Wayne Valentino on 09-10-2014 at 02:55 AM

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Registered: Jul 2007
Location: WESTERN MARYLAND
Posts: 5946

RON,
I AGREE I LIKE WHAT WE HAVE NOW AND ALSO HOPE THE YOUNGER GUYS DO WELL WITH IT. I GUESS WE WILL SEE.

__________________
Home of;

Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch. Gr.WCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Crystal
Ntch. GrCh. Pr. McMillans Blue Magic
Gr.Nt.Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Hawk
Nt. Ch. Pr. McMillans Blue Rage
all are gone now but will NEVER BE FORGOTTEN


CH. PR. MCMILLANS TREE ROCKIN BRANDY
CH. PR. MCMILLANS MIDNITES STINGIN SADIE

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Registered: Apr 2006
Location: DEEP FORK VALLEY, OKLAHOMA
Posts: 1815

quote:

---

Originally posted by Vic Stoll
LOL Isn't that what we have now? A bunch of DNA'd Purple Ribbon bred mutts? Seems like those mutt prices are always available till you want one of em ... go figure!

---

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" an old wood burnin stove with no
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Registered: Sep 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 1775

quote:

---

Originally posted by Tom Jones
Im missing your point unless it isn't there. when you get to 7/8 2 1/8 or 15/16 true blood.............good enough 4 me!!!

hound lines don't really need freshened up though but some individuals do

---

__________________
Home of:
A couple blue haired potlickers

Gone but not forgotten:
Nt Ch Fanny's Midnite Blue Annie - aka Sodie Pop R.I.P. - I will miss you old girl

Nt Ch Becky’s Midnite Blue Hank - R.I.P. Old Boy, thank you for the memories

Gr Nt Ch S&E's Midnite Lite Blue Snow (Co-Owned with my good friend Harry Eidenier) - We had a blast following you ole girl!

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: WV
Posts: 821

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mark A. Hauck
Gentleman, I guess I've read this posting and others from the other breeds as well. What I just can't figure out is the why ??

OK, I guess it would rid the breed associations of having to deal with single registration.......and the Bluetick Organization was the only one that required DNA as part of that process.

Now my take on it for what its worth, and yes I've been lucky and owned some great hounds in my life time at least in my mind and bred and followed up with daughters from those females.

Why do we need it ?? Each of the breeds have great hounds in them, and if we are truthful with ourselves and willing to note the short falls of our hounds and work to find the male that will fill those, build on the strengths of our hounds to complement each other we breed for a better hound.

If we have to go outside of our breed to supposedly get what is missing, then WE HAVE FAILED AS BREEDERS of our breed !!!! Being truthful with yourself, finding the strengths to build upon will get us where we need.

But, we must be willing to find the faults of our own dog and look for the crossing bloodline that will make the next generation better. If we have to cross the walker, Redbone, Black & Tan whatever to get what you think you need then your not looking hard enough, being truthful with yourself and last again WE HAVE FAILED AS BREEDERS AND GUARDIANS OF OUR BREED.

I'm not against it, I just choose to work harder to breed a better Bluetick so I can enjoy the sport I love and share with friends and family. Its just not my cup of tea and never will be for me. I will do the homework, work to find the strengths I need and build on that.

If making the cross of the X-breed is your goal its a free country and more power to ya, but before you do it how about being honest and looking at what you need and go out and find it. its there if you just do the work.

Just my opinion, and good luck no matter what you hunt and choose to breed.

---

Mark,
VERY GOOD POST! My thoughts exactly, you just said it better

Ron

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Registered: Jun 2007
Location:
Posts: 1788

Sounds like to me a dog is no good unless it wins the World Hunt. I know that has always been the big prize. There are several world hunts now. Years back there was only one. You couldn't make much money only having one world hunt so now there's several. It would be my belief if you had a world hunt then took all the same dogs and started over you wouldn't have the same dog win again. I believe that the X dog is going to bring in more money for UKC and it is a business move. I also believe the handler plays a big part in the World Champion. I really don't care how people breed their hounds, like Vic said if you don't like it don't do it. I don't plan to do it. Good luck to all that love to hunt with hounds. If we used the idea that if a breeder didn't produce a world champion he fell short in his breeding program then there would be a lot of breeders in all breeds that I have looked up to that has fell short in their programs. There's one heisman trophy winner in college football but a lot of good players. I think we have a lot of good PR dogs in most breeds and would like to keep them that way. I had a couple people want to breed walker females to Amous but told them no. It's just what ever a guy wants I guess. If it's your thing get it on if it's with in the rules. The big prize to me is to enjoy my hounds and my friends I have in the hound world at my age. You young guys get out there and get R done. Good Hunting to all. Dave P.S. Back in the day we had 3 hour hunts with Registered Dogs and Grade dogs that were drawn out seperate. Now we will have the same thing again but we can draw them together.

Last edited by david woofter on 09-10-2014 at 04:25 PM

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