Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
Posts: 3685

quote:

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Originally posted by rance56
i can understand the democrat vs republican debate, but truly is takign this to a capilitis vs socialist debate. he evens thinks bill clintions way of running a country is wrong. he admires china over the usa and thinks its ok for the governement to take 9 out of 10 dollars a person makes.not a corporation, but a individual.

i hope those of yall on the left will publically denounce this way of thinking. sociaism has been tried and fails. people like truly are a enemy of the usa and our way of life. they dont deserve this great country that we live in

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patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

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Registered: Mar 2008
Location: Western N.Y.
Posts: 4005

We have the highest corporate tax rates in the world, and it is becoming more and more common for american companys to do business in other parts of the world. So i would like for you Libs to explain to me how taxing them and regulating them to the point where in order to be profitable for their stockholders they are forced to relocate to another part of the world is going to help our economy and provide jobs for americans. Punish those evil corporations for their sucess, make those capitalist pigs suffer, GET EM, even if you destroy america in the process.

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Everything that makes them a COONDOG is on the inside

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

quote:

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Originally posted by truly
It occurred to me after rereading that you most likely have a fundamental misunderstanding of how our income tax [marginal] rate system works.
Our current system stands at:
10% up to $8925
15% up to $36,250
25% up to $87,850
28% up to $398,350
35% up to $400,000
and 39.6% above $400,000
The misunderstanding that most folks have is to think that someone who makes $400,001 pays an income tax rate of 39.6%. In fact the reality is that they pay that rate on only one dollar. they then pay 35% on the money they made between 398,350 and 400,000. and they pay 28% on the money they made between 87,850 and 398,350. and they pay25% on the money between 36,250 and 87,850. and they pay 15% on the money between 8925 and 36,250. and they pay 10% on the first 8925.
So the guy who moans and complains that because he made 400,001 complains cause he is in the 39.6% tax rate when in fact the majority of the money that he made will be taxed in the 28% range. Look at how bizarre that it is that we have a 35% tax rate for the $1650 dollars that a person makes between 398,350 and 400,000! Why bother to have that rate at all?
But to me the hidden injustice in this is that someone making around 100,000 pays almost the same rate as someone making 395,000$ per year!?!? And obviously someone making 395k$ per year is going to have a lot more deductions [mortgage interest alone!] and would therefore actually pay a lower "effective" rate when it is all said and done.
Our tax code is full of all sorts of "slight of hand" maneuvers like this that almost entirely benefit the wealth class. Yes, EITC benefits the working poor, but the middle class working American in the 50-100k$ is getting hit the hardest. The rich and the poor get handouts, the middle carries their weight.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

quote:

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Originally posted by truly
Rance if you know anything about the specifics about the Boston Tea Party, this country came to be because of a dispute in which corporations [tea importers] were given unfair tax benefits that were not extended to all. Tax policies were designed with the specific intent of bailing out the India Tea Company with no regard to the well being of the average citizen. Policy that favored corporations and the wealth class. Back then it was as it is now- the wealthy and corporations have the ear of the lawmakers and can get policies designed for their well being rather than ours. It was opposition to this that started the revolution that created America.....
It is an American as it can get to want tax policies that benefit the majority of Americans. Folks like you who refuse to have an honest conversation about tax policy are the enemy of the USA and our way of life.

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
Posts: 3685

quote:

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Originally posted by john Duemmer
We have the highest corporate tax rates in the world, and it is becoming more and more common for american companys to do business in other parts of the world. So i would like for you Libs to explain to me how taxing them and regulating them to the point where in order to be profitable for their stockholders they are forced to relocate to another part of the world is going to help our economy and provide jobs for americans. Punish those evil corporations for their sucess, make those capitalist pigs suffer, GET EM, even if you destroy america in the process.

---

__________________
patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
Posts: 3685

Last November, Citizens for Tax Justice and the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy issued a major study of the federal income taxes paid, or not paid, by 280 big, profitable Fortune 500 corporations. That report found, among other things, that 30 of the companies paid no net federal income tax from 2008 through 2010. New information for 2011 shows that almost all these 30 companies have maintained their tax dodging ways.
In fact, all but four of the 30 companies remained in the no-federal-income-tax category over the 2008-11 period.
Over the four years:
# 26 of the 30 companies continued to enjoy negative federal income tax rates. That means they still made more money after tax than before tax over the four years!
# Of the remaining four companies, three paid four- year effective tax rates of less than 4 percent (specifically, 0.2%, 2.0% and 3.8%). One company paid a 2008-11 tax rate of 10.9 percent.
# In total, 2008-11 federal income taxes for the 30 companies remained negative, despite $205 billion in pretax U.S. profits. Overall, they enjoyed an average effective federal income tax rate of –3.1 percent over the four years.
http://www.ctj.org/pdf/notax2012.pdf
Check out that last bullet point- 30 companies, negative tax rate- as in the got more money back than they ever paid in ON 205 BILLION OF PROFIT! IF THEY HAD EVEN PAID IN AT A 28% RATE AS MANY AMERICANS DO THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 57.4 BILLION DOLLARS! How can you justify them not paying in at a similar rate to what we working class Americans do?

__________________
patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

quote:

---

Originally posted by truly
Last November, Citizens for Tax Justice and the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy issued a major study of the federal income taxes paid, or not paid, by 280 big, profitable Fortune 500 corporations. That report found, among other things, that 30 of the companies paid no net federal income tax from 2008 through 2010. New information for 2011 shows that almost all these 30 companies have maintained their tax dodging ways.
In fact, all but four of the 30 companies remained in the no-federal-income-tax category over the 2008-11 period.
Over the four years:
# 26 of the 30 companies continued to enjoy negative federal income tax rates. That means they still made more money after tax than before tax over the four years!
# Of the remaining four companies, three paid four- year effective tax rates of less than 4 percent (specifically, 0.2%, 2.0% and 3.8%). One company paid a 2008-11 tax rate of 10.9 percent.
# In total, 2008-11 federal income taxes for the 30 companies remained negative, despite $205 billion in pretax U.S. profits. Overall, they enjoyed an average effective federal income tax rate of –3.1 percent over the four years.
http://www.ctj.org/pdf/notax2012.pdf
Check out that last bullet point- 30 companies, negative tax rate- as in the got more money back than they ever paid in ON 205 BILLION OF PROFIT! IF THEY HAD EVEN PAID IN AT A 28% RATE AS MANY AMERICANS DO THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 57.4 BILLION DOLLARS! How can you justify them not paying in at a similar rate to what we working class Americans do?

---

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the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Dec 2008
Location: S.W. Wisc.
Posts: 734

quote:

---

Originally posted by truly
It occurred to me after rereading that you most likely have a fundamental misunderstanding of how our income tax [marginal] rate system works.
Our current system stands at:
10% up to $8925
15% up to $36,250
25% up to $87,850
28% up to $398,350
35% up to $400,000
and 39.6% above $400,000
The misunderstanding that most folks have is to think that someone who makes $400,001 pays an income tax rate of 39.6%. In fact the reality is that they pay that rate on only one dollar. they then pay 35% on the money they made between 398,350 and 400,000. and they pay 28% on the money they made between 87,850 and 398,350. and they pay25% on the money between 36,250 and 87,850. and they pay 15% on the money between 8925 and 36,250. and they pay 10% on the first 8925.
So the guy who moans and complains that because he made 400,001 complains cause he is in the 39.6% tax rate when in fact the majority of the money that he made will be taxed in the 28% range. Look at how bizarre that it is that we have a 35% tax rate for the $1650 dollars that a person makes between 398,350 and 400,000! Why bother to have that rate at all?
But to me the hidden injustice in this is that someone making around 100,000 pays almost the same rate as someone making 395,000$ per year!?!? And obviously someone making 395k$ per year is going to have a lot more deductions [mortgage interest alone!] and would therefore actually pay a lower "effective" rate when it is all said and done.
Our tax code is full of all sorts of "slight of hand" maneuvers like this that almost entirely benefit the wealth class. Yes, EITC benefits the working poor, but the middle class working American in the 50-100k$ is getting hit the hardest. The rich and the poor get handouts, the middle carries their weight.

---

__________________
All my life I wanted to be somebody, now I realize I should have been more specific. I carry a gun because I am too young to die and too old to take an asswhoopin.

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Registered: May 2004
Location:
Posts: 349

quote:

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Originally posted by Triple K Kennel
It doesn't matter if they are deadbeats, their vote counted as much as anyone.
The Majority means there were folks from different walks of life, from the Super Rich to the Very Poor-----It takes all kinds to make the World to go around.....

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Registered: May 2008
Location: southcentral arkansas
Posts: 1581

quote:

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Originally posted by truly
It occurred to me a
Our tax code is full of all sorts of "slight of hand" maneuvers like this that almost entirely benefit the wealth class. Yes, EITC benefits the working poor, but the middle class working American in the 50-100k$ is getting hit the hardest. The rich and the poor get handouts, the middle carries their weight.

---

__________________
"it's easy to sit there and say you'd like to have more money. and i guess that's what i like about it. it's easy. just sitting there, rocking back and forth, wanting that money."
Jack Handy

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

http://www.fidelity.com/inside-fide...ionaire-outlook

The above article states over 80 percent of USA millionaires are self made. So how in a system where the middle class is so opressed are they able to become millionaires. The true misconception is that the majority of the rich had it handed to them. But don't let actual facts get in your way comrade ben

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Last edited by rance56 on 03-21-2013 at 01:50 AM

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Registered: Feb 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4547

quote:

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Originally posted by Erik Fisher
Idk who the best or worst is or was but I can tell you this. If you're not employed, retired, disabled, or applied for at least 20 jobs per year. ( on record) you shouldn't have a right to vote. That's the problem with this country is it was built on hard work and patriotism and ther doesn't seem to be ALOT of either anymore. (Hence all the outsourcing to other countries). We've gotten LAZY as a nation in general and we are the only ones who can change it. Work hard/ support what you believe! That would fix a whole lot! Not saying the guys that posted here don't. But MANY people in this great country don't do either let alone one of the two!

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Last edited by Triple K Kennel on 03-21-2013 at 04:24 AM

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
Posts: 3685

quote:

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Originally posted by rance56
just curious, who is not saying we need tax reform in this country?

AND THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TAX REFORM AND THE SOCIALIST AGENDA YOU SPEW ON HERE.

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__________________
patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

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Registered: Dec 2008
Location: S.W. Wisc.
Posts: 734

quote:

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Originally posted by truly
THe problem with trying to tackle tax reform is that righties/conservatives/republicans refuse to consider any revenue increase. They consider closing tax loopholes to be a tax increase and refuse to consider it. they won't consider raising rates. they won't consider any new taxes. so all they have left is cutting taxes. and righties love to talk about the old "tough dining room table decisions" made about finances. If your family was struggling with financial issues, having a hard time making ends meet, would you automatically rule out increasing your income? raising your revenue stream? wouldn't that be foolish? a democrat would consider cutting expenditures while also acknowledging that they might need to raise income by putting a little overtime in or picking up a second job, or performing better at their job so that they got a pay raise.
Republicans can never be taken seriously on budgetary issues when they refuse to consider the revenue side of any balance sheet.

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__________________
All my life I wanted to be somebody, now I realize I should have been more specific. I carry a gun because I am too young to die and too old to take an asswhoopin.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

quote:

---

Originally posted by truly
THe problem with trying to tackle tax reform is that righties/conservatives/republicans refuse to consider any revenue increase. They consider closing tax loopholes to be a tax increase and refuse to consider it. they won't consider raising rates. they won't consider any new taxes. so all they have left is cutting taxes. and righties love to talk about the old "tough dining room table decisions" made about finances. If your family was struggling with financial issues, having a hard time making ends meet, would you automatically rule out increasing your income? raising your revenue stream? wouldn't that be foolish? a democrat would consider cutting expenditures while also acknowledging that they might need to raise income by putting a little overtime in or picking up a second job, or performing better at their job so that they got a pay raise.
Republicans can never be taken seriously on budgetary issues when they refuse to consider the revenue side of any balance sheet.

---

__________________
the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

Last edited by rance56 on 03-21-2013 at 02:03 PM

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Registered: May 2008
Location: southcentral arkansas
Posts: 1581

quote:

---

Originally posted by truly
THe problem with trying to tackle tax reform is that righties/conservatives/republicans refuse to consider any revenue increase. They consider closing tax loopholes to be a tax increase and refuse to consider it. they won't consider raising rates. they won't consider any new taxes. so all they have left is cutting taxes. and righties love to talk about the old "tough dining room table decisions" made about finances. If your family was struggling with financial issues, having a hard time making ends meet, would you automatically rule out increasing your income? raising your revenue stream? wouldn't that be foolish? a democrat would consider cutting expenditures while also acknowledging that they might need to raise income by putting a little overtime in or picking up a second job, or performing better at their job so that they got a pay raise.
Republicans can never be taken seriously on budgetary issues when they refuse to consider the revenue side of any balance sheet.

---

__________________
"it's easy to sit there and say you'd like to have more money. and i guess that's what i like about it. it's easy. just sitting there, rocking back and forth, wanting that money."
Jack Handy

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4046

quote:

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Originally posted by john nannemann
Lmfao, your fictional family considers theft and sale of the neighbors money and property to be a viable "second job". Looting for fun and profit!





v
V
V
V
V

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__________________
the oldest ride in the park, but still the longest line.

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
Posts: 3685

quote:

---

Originally posted by rance56
just curious, who is not saying we need tax reform in this country?

AND THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN TAX REFORM AND THE SOCIALIST AGENDA YOU SPEW ON HERE.

---

__________________
patriotism is supporting your country all of the time and your government when it deserves it.
if you think the price of education is high, check out the cost of ignorance!

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Registered: Sep 2011
Location: indiana
Posts: 236

I remember why stay away from this side of the board.


Here's my opinion. Repubs and Dems have ran the country for the last 100 plus years and are both to blame.

If you hired two guys to work together and all they got done was name calling and blaming each other neither would have a job very long. But everyone fiercely defends their chosen side and we keep voting them in. Wake up people. I bet ninety percent of you guys know which party you will vote for next election already. Keep on bickering with each about whose fault it is but continue putting the same two gangs in office and lie to yourself about them getting anything done. This kind of thing is the problem with America.


You know what is great about America though. The fact that we can have these discussions. We have our faults but I'll take my chances in this country.

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Registered: Sep 2007
Location: Occupied TN CSA
Posts: 1877

quote:

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We have the highest corporate tax rates in the world, and it is becoming more and more common for american companys to do business in other parts of the world. So i would like for you Libs to explain to me how taxing them and regulating them to the point where in order to be profitable for their stockholders they are forced to relocate to another part of the world is going to help our economy and provide jobs for americans. Punish those evil corporations for their sucess, make those capitalist pigs suffer, GET EM, even if you destroy america in the process.

---

__________________
I have to say yall got a good little support group going. Huddle together so yall can keep warm...trackdriver

"Kim Jong-Un speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” An actual sitting US President said that. Let that sink in.

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Registered: Feb 2005
Location: ohio
Posts: 145

GREAT POST !!!! Mark Knepp

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Registered: Dec 2008
Location: S.W. Wisc.
Posts: 734

quote:

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Originally posted by Wingman66
I ain't a lib but I feel that is a lot of where the problem is. I'd just about bet the owners of those companies won't move and become a citizen of those countries either. Personal taxes in those places would eat you alive. You can do business anywhere in the world that will let you. Thats not the problem. If China wants to sell American cars they can send a boat to pick them up with a good check at whatever profit we need to keep our doors open and our workers employed. Other than that, build your own cars and stay out of our Country. The car manufactures will meet the demand with our workers I assure you. If you want to sell cars to China you move to China, build a factory in China, use China workers and abide by Chinas business and tax codes.

Folks want to say I can't make a profit because of taxes. Its the governments fault, its obamas fault whine whine whine. When you made your business plans did you not take that into consideration? The truth is you tried your best and failed. You could not operate a business and its that simple. You can gripe at what the government SPENDS the tax money you collected for them on, but don't blame them for your failed attempt at being a business owner.

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__________________
All my life I wanted to be somebody, now I realize I should have been more specific. I carry a gun because I am too young to die and too old to take an asswhoopin.

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Registered: Sep 2007
Location: Occupied TN CSA
Posts: 1877

Fairy tale lol. I'll tell you who is living in a fairy tale. The stockholder who buys stock in a company that can't make enough profit to even pay their taxes.

__________________
I have to say yall got a good little support group going. Huddle together so yall can keep warm...trackdriver

"Kim Jong-Un speaks and his people sit up at attention. I want my people to do the same.” An actual sitting US President said that. Let that sink in.

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