Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Lockridge Iowa
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quote:

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Originally posted by Dogwhisper
One babbling dog in a cast or at a hunt is one to many !

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The babbling rule..allows blatant dishonesty within a set of "honor rules".....to me that's unacceptable, no matter how long it's been that way ..

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quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
My guess would be that UKC wanted to relieve their judges of having to make a call that they knew was going to start a serious, extremely unpleasant and sometimes bloody argument every single time they enforced the rule. So they made a change that gave their judges a way out without completely eliminating the rule against babbling.

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quote:

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Originally posted by berger
If those dogs are still in that open field in the minute they have a lot bigger problem then babbling!!!!!!!

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Let's put it in perspective ! You cut 4 dogs and they babble leaving your are not awarding the dog that struck first ! You are awarding the first human being strike for striking his dog and neither one are smelling a coon.


Tar

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i'm sick and tired of making rules that screw over an honest dog. I won't own a dog unless it's a 1st or second honest strike dog. Yes they can be honest and fast. All this rule would do is give the slow strike dogs a chance to beat a far better dog. And still don't do ANYTHING to the babbler. If you live in OH, MI, IN, PA your going to be struck in the 1st 30 sec more often then not.

So say were hunting at AO. I draw out a good cast with a good guide. We are slamming tree after tree. We see and score on 4 coon out of 6 trees made. But because we are struck off the tailgate each time our CW is 600+. Another cast has avg. dogs that take 5 min to get struck in thick coon and takes 20 min to work a good track. They score on 4 coon and come in with 900+. How is that fair? Think about placing at zones do you want to get bounced out of placing because you have a fast strike dog????

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Rebecca Agee

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Scratching the babbling handler/dog already xist ....it's just to lenient of a rule .
The babbler get a second chance . How ignorant is that ?
Scratch on the 1 offence !

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quote:

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Originally posted by Dogwhisper
The babbling rule..allows blatant dishonesty within a set of "honor rules".....to me that's unacceptable, no matter how long it's been that way ..

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quote:

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Originally posted by River Birch Run
i'm sick and tired of making rules that screw over an honest dog. I won't own a dog unless it's a 1st or second honest strike dog. Yes they can be honest and fast. All this rule would do is give the slow strike dogs a chance to beat a far better dog. And still don't do ANYTHING to the babbler. If you live in OH, MI, IN, PA your going to be struck in the 1st 30 sec more often then not.

So say were hunting at AO. I draw out a good cast with a good guide. We are slamming tree after tree. We see and score on 4 coon out of 6 trees made. But because we are struck off the tailgate each time our CW is 600+. Another cast has avg. dogs that take 5 min to get struck in thick coon and takes 20 min to work a good track. They score on 4 coon and come in with 900+. How is that fair? Think about placing at zones do you want to get bounced out of placing because you have a fast strike dog????

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Berger , personal attacks ought not have a place when a debate is happening . Things tend to go sideways with no advancements.
Your bigger than that I would hope.

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I for 1 see it more in UKC because judges let it happen. $$ hunts they minus you and most dogs are deep and lonely not babbling.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Dogwhisper
Berger , personal attacks ought not have a place when a debate is happening . Things tend to go sideways with no advancements.
Your bigger than that I would hope.

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Well I guess not !

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quote:

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Originally posted by berger
What is that strike rule??????

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Last edited by ov_blues on 02-23-2019 at 03:38 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by ov_blues
AKC's strike rule is that any strike within the first minute has to be immediately followed by a tree call or you can't strike in at all during the first minute.

At the end of the first minute if multiple dogs are opening they all go on the card at 50 strike points. If all dogs in the cast are not opening to go in for 50, any dogs not struck in at the end of the minute will go on the card for 25 after the first minute.

They also have a tree count down which has the ability to widen scores as the hunt progresses so the emphasis is on which dog is treeing coon the fastest. They also don't have a leash lock rule so there again the emphasis is on who's dog can tree the most coon in the fastest manner and not geared toward which dog can open it's mouth the fastest.

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quote:

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Originally posted by ov_blues
AKC's strike rule is that any strike within the first minute has to be immediately followed by a tree call or you can't strike in at all during the first minute.

At the end of the first minute if only one dog is opening the dogs are recorded as struck in at 100, 75, 50 & 25. At the end of the first minute if multiple dogs are opening they all go on the card at 50 strike points. If all dogs in the cast are not opening to go in for 50, any dogs not struck in at the end of the minute will go on the card for 25 after the first minute.

They also have a tree count down which has the ability to widen scores as the hunt progresses so the emphasis is on which dog is treeing coon the fastest. They also don't have a leash lock rule so there again the emphasis is on who's dog can tree the most coon in the fastest manner and not geared toward which dog can open it's mouth the fastest.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Stan Ferrell
Now all you need is a couple extra stop watches, a secretary and a handler to call your dog.

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Last edited by ov_blues on 02-23-2019 at 08:36 PM

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quote:

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Originally posted by ov_blues
AKC's strike rule is that any strike within the first minute has to be immediately followed by a tree call or you can't strike in at all during the first minute.

At the end of the first minute if only one dog is opening the dogs are recorded as struck in at 100, 75, 50 & 25. At the end of the first minute if multiple dogs are opening they all go on the card at 50 strike points. If all dogs in the cast are not opening to go in for 50, any dogs not struck in at the end of the minute will go on the card for 25 after the first minute.

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Just my opinion, but the biggest issue here is with judges not using their authority as they should. I know it can be uncomfortable but sometimes you need to accept that somebody might be confrontational and make the right call regardless. I’ve been on plenty of casts where a dog should’ve been minused or scratched and the good ol’ boy system takes over and the right (rule) call is ignored. I bet if more casts members who have the card would make calls by the rule, not just including babbling, you’d see some of this stuff straightened out. It may not be as big of an issue with the bigger hunts, but it happens more than it should at the local level. As far as the $KC rules... you’ve already lost me when you can win a hunt without treeing a real live raccoon.

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Ryan Morris

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Who's the black and tan representative

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mack

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Who's the black and tan representative

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mack

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quote:

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Originally posted by ov_blues
AKC's strike rule is that any strike within the first minute has to be immediately followed by a tree call or you can't strike in at all during the first minute.

At the end of the first minute if only one dog is opening the dogs are recorded as struck in at 100, 75, 50 & 25. At the end of the first minute if multiple dogs are opening they all go on the card at 50 strike points. If all dogs in the cast are not opening to go in for 50, any dogs not struck in at the end of the minute will go on the card for 25 after the first minute.

They also have a tree count down which has the ability to widen scores as the hunt progresses so the emphasis is on which dog is treeing coon the fastest. They also don't have a leash lock rule so there again the emphasis is on who's dog can tree the most coon in the fastest manner and not geared toward which dog can open it's mouth the fastest.

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Tone it down guys, or they will delete another good topic...

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kenneth Tavares
Unless they have changed it, you are not completely correct.

Any dog(even if only one) barking at the end of the minute will be struck for 50. All others for 25. If nothing is opening at the end of the minute the strike is open and starts at 100.

It’s the best solution I’ve heard besides just minus the sorry sucks!

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quote:

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Originally posted by houseofquality
Who's the black and tan representative

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Judge to acknowledge Handler’s call by repeating the dog’s name and number of points for which dog is called. Points will be split when called positions cannot be clearly determined by Judge.
A. Strike Points
1. One set of strike points as follows: 100 points
for dog declared struck first; 75 points second; 50 points third and 25 points fourth. All dogs must be loose and competing in order for first strike of 100 points to be awarded. If dog(s) are re-struck after being scored plus, minus, circle or deleted they may only be struck back in for 25 points unless all dogs are competing for 100 strike points.
2. One (1) minute time to be kept each time dog(s) are released. No dog to receive strike points dur- ing that minute unless immediately followed by a tree call. Fifty (50) strike points will be recorded for dog(s) barking within the last five seconds of the minute. Remaining dogs, when struck receive 25 points. This rule will only be in effect when all dogs are loose and competing for 100 strike points. The judge will count aloud the last five seconds of the minute and announce, “minute is up,” and will indicate which dogs are struck and recorded for 50 strike points if any.

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