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Judge hears an obvious dog fight but didn't see who started it. Which one applies?
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Nothing can be done if the judge did not see the actual fight. 27 12.80%
Nothing can be done if the judge doesn't see who started the fight. 5 2.37%
The judge must, in some reasonable manner, decide who the aggressor is and scratch and report that dog. 6 2.84%
Scratch and report both dogs for fighting. 169 80.09%
Automatic cast vote determines how to score the situation. 4 1.90%
Total: 211 votes 100%
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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

Brother Richard you are right. But in certain circles fighting at the tree and babbling are desirable traits.



Tar

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Old Post 06-23-2018 07:52 PM
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Rip
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4927

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Everyone has their own opinion about what should be done but if it is questioned and taken back to a competent MOH then every dog involved is going to get scratched.


You just gave the key word, INVOLVED. Absolutely if no agressor is known you scratch all involved. No talking out of it, no "withdrawing" scratch them and write them up.

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Old Post 06-23-2018 08:02 PM
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nextcoonhunters
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2015
Location: mo
Posts: 749

judge carry a gun

Have ukc make it were if the aggressive dog is known on the first offence they have to write it on the entry card upon the second offence judge is required to shoot the dog and leave it. Solve a lot of problems that way. If aggressive dog cannot be found give them 3 write-ups then shoot the dog. Yeah just so you know pleasure hunting around here once is one time to many. Dog gone if I ever have one. But some guys have every excuse in the book for it. My favorite she's not mean n any way just won't be pushed around on the tree, as you are pulling her off the other dogs who treed long before she got there lol

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Old Post 06-23-2018 08:45 PM
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micooner
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2006
Location: milan,mi
Posts: 1379

In the other $kc the official who no longer works there always called it "adjusting" on the tree. Lol

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Old Post 06-23-2018 11:01 PM
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AndyMiller
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: sugarcreekohio
Posts: 1347

Both dogs should be put down cuz you dont hunt mean dogs

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Old Post 06-24-2018 01:08 AM
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joey
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Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Everyone has their own opinion about what should be done but if it is questioned and taken back to a competent MOH then every dog involved is going to get scratched.



You do not scratch dogs because you hear a dog fight when you do not know what dogs are involved. Just because they are at the tree does not mean they are fighting. The only way you can scratch dogs for a fight you "hear" is if you know exactly what dogs were involved. That was one of the points of Allen's question. Unless you know where the other dogs are, like you hear 2 running to the left and 2 are treeing. A fight breaks out, you know exactly what dogs were involved and they can be scratched. If 1 dog is at large, you can not hear it to confirm its location and you hear a fight. There is nothing you can do, because you do not know if it was those 2 dogs that were treed in that are fighting. It could be one that was treed and the other dog that you do not know where it is. That's the logic that was given several years ago by UKC.

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Ptmike
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Registered: Feb 2018
Location:
Posts: 36

Don't be a cry baby scratching dogs for adjusting a little bit on the tree. I would never scratch a dog unless it pure mean. Most of the Time I give the handler the chance to withdraw

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ringtail
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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2760

Scratch both dogs and report.

The question is there are 2 dogs on the tree and a fight breaks out. In this scenario there is no 3rd or 4th dog.

We can what if until the cows come home.

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Stan Ferrell
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Registered: Aug 2014
Location:
Posts: 780

You can all say what you want and act righteous, BUT we all know ' just walk slow and they will get it figured out" is what is said most of the time. I would be interested in the total number of dogs scratched for fighting, reported to UKC last week.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 03:46 AM
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Stan Ferrell
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You can all say what you want and act righteous, BUT we all know ' just walk slow and they will get it figured out" is what is said most of the time. I would be interested in the total number of dogs scratched for fighting, reported to UKC last week.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 03:46 AM
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Allen / UKC
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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Michigan
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quote:
Originally posted by ringtail
Scratch both dogs and report.

The question is there are 2 dogs on the tree and a fight breaks out. In this scenario there is no 3rd or 4th dog.

We can what if until the cows come home.



No third or fourth dog in this scenario, correct. Just the two that are heard fighting.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 01:24 PM
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Richard Lambert
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

I thought that surely 99% would know that both dogs get scratched. 18% of the people responding must not even hunt in competition hunts.
So Mr Gingerich, are you saying that you are going to sidestep this and not tell us the Official UKC position on what to do if 3 or 4 dogs are treed and a fight breaks out but you don't see it?

Last edited by Richard Lambert on 06-25-2018 at 03:49 PM

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Allen / UKC
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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Michigan
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quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
I thought that surely 99% would know that both dogs get scratched. 18% of the people responding must not even hunt in competition hunts.
So Mr Gingerich, are you saying that you are going to sidestep this and not tell us the Official UKC position on what to do if 3 or 4 dogs are treed and a fight breaks out but you don't see it?




Not side-stepping. I can give a "how to" along with the answer to this one, when it involves more than two dogs at the tree.

I made this one easy, with just two dogs.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 04:49 PM
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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

You know that one guy........... That guy named the judge ........... He can sneak in with his light out and smell what's cooking. Unless y'all feel its inappropriate and it's going to hurt your feelings when Sombody tells you your dog is an alligator when you already knew it !!



Tar

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:03 PM
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Donnie Stevens
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 2768

Tar unless that judges full name is non hunting judge there might be an issue with the vote that's sure to be coming lol.

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turman
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2007
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 439

Was on a cast the second night of a Friday Saturday hunt. Drew a dog that was the talk of the clubhouse Friday night because it ate up every dog that tried to tree with it. Saturday nights judge had heard the talk and was also the guide so the first turn out he had them cut to a clump of trees in the middle of a field. Sure enough there was a coon in there and since they treed 50 yards away it wasn't hard to catch the dog chasing the others off the tree! All wrote up and only a few minutes used.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:15 PM
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yadkintar
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You ain't gonna let me take care of buiness don't hand me the card and tell me I am the judge we ain't playing the odds I tell you I saw your dog is fighting that's what I mean most of them know they got a mean dog personally I don't think much of a guy that will put a dog like that on you.



Tar

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:17 PM
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Donnie Stevens
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 2768

quote:
Originally posted by yadkintar
You ain't gonna let me take care of buiness don't hand me the card and tell me I am the judge we ain't playing the odds I tell you I saw your dog is fighting that's what I mean most of them know they got a mean dog personally I don't think much of a guy that will put a dog like that on you.



Tar



Me either. I despise rough dogs but if it's questioned it's gonna take more than one vote to make it stick. Just sayin .....

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:24 PM
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Chuck Allen
UKC Forum Member

Registered: May 2012
Location: Amerika land of the free?
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As a judge and if you care about the sport or rules you need to be willing to sacrifice your own dog on a cast in order to prove a point. example if there is a 4 dog cast 2 males and 2 females all 4 are struck and all 4 are declared treed and a fight breaks out before cast arrives odds are it is more than likely the 2 males but I have seen mean females and they are usually the worst. But the point being scratch the entire cast your dog included is the right thing to do. JMHO

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:29 PM
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yadkintar
Banned

Registered: Jan 2013
Location: Marietta
Posts: 10790

What works for us down here your intentionally hunt a mean dog you end up not having any freinds nobody will talk to you at the club.



Works pretty good lol.


Tar

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:31 PM
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Richard Lambert
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

Tarbaby, they get real mad when they walk in the door and you say real loud, "there is old so and so. I hope he isn't hunting his mean ass dog". Or when they draw out and you walk up to their cast and say, "y'all watch out for so and so. He is mean." It usually only takes one time and they will stop bringing their alligator.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:43 PM
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yadkintar
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More than one way to skin a cat huh Richard lol.



Tar

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Old Post 06-25-2018 05:56 PM
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joey
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2012
Location: McRae Ar
Posts: 3701

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Tarbaby, they get real mad when they walk in the door and you say real loud, "there is old so and so. I hope he isn't hunting his mean ass dog". Or when they draw out and you walk up to their cast and say, "y'all watch out for so and so. He is mean." It usually only takes one time and they will stop bringing their alligator.


LOL that will work. I've also seen a dog accused of being mean that didn't have a mean hair on it, but they needed some kind of a excuse for why they couldn't beat the dog! Its dosen't take but a couple of trips and everyone knows what dog is really mean and they are normally accompanied by a mean handler.

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Old Post 06-25-2018 07:14 PM
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yadkintar
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quote:
Originally posted by joey
LOL that will work. I've also seen a dog accused of being mean that didn't have a mean hair on it, but they needed some kind of a excuse for why they couldn't beat the dog! Its dosen't take but a couple of trips and everyone knows what dog is really mean and they are normally accompanied by a mean handler.



Maybe ukc needs to put some special buttons in the hunt packet for the moh to pass out saying :


I am really mean !!!
And my dog is too !!!



Tar

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Old Post 06-25-2018 08:06 PM
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Drummerblue2
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Registered: Jun 2016
Location: Grassy
Posts: 233

Scratch

Both and go to clubhouse and finish up paperwork

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