Registered: Sep 2014
Location: Rocky Mount, NC
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Have your owm reasons but Reproducers over Plus Point All Grands seem to be what alot like.

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Robbie Brown
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quote:

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Originally posted by Robbie Brown
Have your owm reasons but Reproducers over Plus Point All Grands seem to be what alot like.

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quote:

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Originally posted by wildbill
that's what sells puppys not makes real coondogs.

when people want real natural coonhounds they will breed coondog to coondog not title to title...

when you take a 6-15month old pup to the woods the first time and they are starting tracks for the old dogs 3rd night in the woods then, u might know what I'm talking about..

when you take a 8 yr old dog to the woods that's never been off the chain and it runs a coon like its been doing it all its life, you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take and breed that 8 yr old dog when she is 10 yrs old and keep a pup out that and don't take that pup to the woods till its 3 yrs old and it hunts like its been bred to do,,then you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take a 6 month old dog to the woods and at 13 months old be using it as a check dog,then you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take a female out of that 13 month old and wait till its 5 yrs old and take it to the woods and it runs and trees its own coon first night in the woods ,you might know what I'm talking about..

when you breed natural coondog to natural coondog you don't need a trainer,, if you know what I'm talking about.

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No matter how natural they are I haven't had one yet that made it setting in the dog pen !!

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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: North MO
Posts: 2353

quote:

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Originally posted by wildbill
that's what sells puppys not makes real coondogs.

when people want real natural coonhounds they will breed coondog to coondog not title to title...

when you take a 6-15month old pup to the woods the first time and they are starting tracks for the old dogs 3rd night in the woods then, u might know what I'm talking about..

when you take a 8 yr old dog to the woods that's never been off the chain and it runs a coon like its been doing it all its life, you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take and breed that 8 yr old dog when she is 10 yrs old and keep a pup out that and don't take that pup to the woods till its 3 yrs old and it hunts like its been bred to do,,then you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take a 6 month old dog to the woods and at 13 months old be using it as a check dog,then you might know what I'm talking about.

when you take a female out of that 13 month old and wait till its 5 yrs old and take it to the woods and it runs and trees its own coon first night in the woods ,you might know what I'm talking about..

when you breed natural coondog to natural coondog you don't need a trainer,, if you know what I'm talking about.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Josh Michaelis
You lost me at 8 year old never off the chain

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Last edited by msinc on 04-08-2015 at 03:45 PM

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Guys and gals if there was one formula that worked every time, we would have a lot more coon dogs suiting more people.

There are things breeders can do to increase their odds, but many don't want to do them because it is too much work. Listed in order of importance:

#1 Know as much as possible about as many dogs as possible in a 3 generation pedigree.
#2 Offspring testing
#3 Performance testing
#4 Selection index- formal rating system

Then use all those tools to select your breeding stock. Three must important words selection, selection, selection. Oh ya, it helps to have a realistic goal.

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Larry Atherton

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quote:

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Originally posted by msinc
based on what most guys are doing and calling training, if just about all dogs would be better off if they were simply carried to the woods and left to do it on their own.

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quote:

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Originally posted by msinc
I think what he is trying to say is that there are dogs out there that have the breeding {genes} that causes them to be natural coon dogs. This type dog doesn't need to be shown anything other than the woods and they do it right from that point on. I have only seen a few and for certain, they are rare.
Another way of saying the same thing might be that if all the best, big name dogs were kept in a kennel their entire life and never saw a coon, never ran a track, never barked "treed" but they were still bred as we know they have been we would still get all the exact same pups with whatever abilities they have now and the same percentage of dogs turning out.
What gets confusing is that as above, all those big name dogs might not have been big name dogs had they been owned by a different handler that wasn't as good at his job...same dog, same capabilities as a stud or dam but now you don't have most of the dogs being bred to him or her for obvious reasons. Even that cannot change the dogs ability to reproduce whatever it is that he or she reproduces.
To me this is what the old adage "titles don't tree coons or papers don't make him a coon dog" really means...I do believe that most people use those kind of terms out of jealousy and contempt just because they don't own a high caliber or well bred dog.

Edit: I have to wonder, based on what most guys are doing and calling training, if just about all dogs would be better off if they were simply carried to the woods and left to do it on their own. I realize at some point they would have to be broke off of unwanted game, but I don't see much besides that that we are really "training." Either the dog has it or he does not.

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quote:

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Originally posted by yadkintar
No matter how natural they are I haven't had one yet that made it setting in the dog pen !!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Baldwin
Where are all these "natural " coondogs at ?

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Wow! I think my intelligence has been reduced after reading through this thread..lol
And come to the conclusion that I must have something better to do...

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JAMES RIVER HOUND KENNEL
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quote:

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Originally posted by jay brademeyer
Wow! I think my intelligence has been reduced after reading through this thread..lol
And come to the conclusion that I must have something better to do...

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Registered: Jul 2008
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I have owned pups out of most of the big name magazine stud dogs since 1980 had one dog that was making a good one that got killed on a rail road bridge outside of that all failures.

Best luck buying pup from two coon dogs out from behind the neighbors barn.

Robbie i do know you have owned some of the best reproducing females in the past and would consider you one of the more knowledgable breeders out there.

I don't know very little about breeding but one thing i do know is how some of these so called gr.nt.ch .are made they take (3)and(4) dogs owned by the same person plus a buddy or two's dogs to a small little club and maybe only eight or nine dogs entered total some times the guy with all the nt.ch. owns all four of the dog mabe a couple in his buddies name so it want look so suspicious in the only cast and easy puts those five wins on his now all grand stud dog.
I now look at the stud dog forum and see those family made all grand stud dogs being matched up with all grand females and i bet the owners of those females has no ideal how ole so and so made all grand nite champion and now is on the front page and sometimes in the magazines pups $500.00 to $800.00 go get you one.lol.
Sometimes i want to jump in and tell the female owners to don't do that but its not my business and i am a pleasure hunter that just like to go out and have a friendly little hunt and laugh all night long instead of arguing all night long and have more enemies than friends when you return to the club house.
IMO Most kc hunts are a joke a one hour hunt i can't believe never hunted in one and never plan on it but thats not enough time to get your feet wet and you get paid for winning something like this with circle points thats a joke imo.

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OF HUNTING FOR YOUR KIDS!!!

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Registered: Sep 2014
Location: Rocky Mount, NC
Posts: 83

Thanks for all voting. It really seem to go many ways. But one thing Plus Points All Grand really found its place.

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Robbie Brown
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Location: Rocky Mount, NC
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Thanks for all voting. It really seem to go many ways. But one thing Plus Points All Grand really found its place.

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Robbie Brown
252-904-1691

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Location: Rocky Mount, NC
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Thanks for all voting. It really seem to go many ways. But one thing Plus Points All Grand really found its place.

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Robbie Brown
252-904-1691

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quote:

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Originally posted by Carl Fox
I have owned pups out of most of the big name magazine stud dogs since 1980 had one dog that was making a good one that got killed on a rail road bridge outside of that all failures.

Best luck buying pup from two coon dogs out from behind the neighbors barn.

Robbie i do know you have owned some of the best reproducing females in the past and would consider you one of the more knowledgable breeders out there.

I don't know very little about breeding but one thing i do know is how some of these so called gr.nt.ch .are made they take (3)and(4) dogs owned by the same person plus a buddy or two's dogs to a small little club and maybe only eight or nine dogs entered total some times the guy with all the nt.ch. owns all four of the dog mabe a couple in his buddies name so it want look so suspicious in the only cast and easy puts those five wins on his now all grand stud dog.
I now look at the stud dog forum and see those family made all grand stud dogs being matched up with all grand females and i bet the owners of those females has no ideal how ole so and so made all grand nite champion and now is on the front page and sometimes in the magazines pups $500.00 to $800.00 go get you one.lol.
Sometimes i want to jump in and tell the female owners to don't do that but its not my business and i am a pleasure hunter that just like to go out and have a friendly little hunt and laugh all night long instead of arguing all night long and have more enemies than friends when you return to the club house.
IMO Most kc hunts are a joke a one hour hunt i can't believe never hunted in one and never plan on it but thats not enough time to get your feet wet and you get paid for winning something like this with circle points thats a joke imo.

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