Registered: Oct 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 3709

You should know if that stud had been hunting before you loaded your female. That way no ones time was wasted. Its not arrogance its a choice people make with their own hounds just as you have the right to make with yours.

It about choice. Not about anything else. Its their dog. Period. If you don't like then just keep on looking. Simple really

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BROKEN ROAD KENNEL
Breeding for the future of the Treeing Walker
"God bless the Broken Road"
~A man is only as good as his word~

Proud home to;

'PR' Kentucky River Fly Again (Kentucky River Rowdy frozen semen)
ACHA CHT x3 Broken Roads Little Texas (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
CH Broken Roads Southern Stylish Boom (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
Broken Road's Rowdy Lil Miss (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
Broken Road's Meabie I will (Lipper's Rooster x Missy)
Broken Roads IMA Boomer2 (UKC NATL GRCH GRNTCH Honest Abe x Broken Roads Southern Stylish Boom
~~~~~Watch out!~~~~~
They just might make an IMPACT!

and the girls...Punkin and Tater!

Gone by never forgotten ~ Fly high my beautiful angels
~ GRCH GNTCH PKC SC Toucan Sam
~CH Toucan's Ugly Betty
~ CCH CH Southforks September Rain
~ Martin's Daisy JJ (what a beautiful litter you left behind)
~ Luke, the lab who brought us so many doves and ducks over the years
~ UKC GRCH,ACHA CH 2014 LWCH 2014 2 x's ACHA YOUTH WCH AKC CH AKC CH 'PR' Kentucky River Mundar ~ (Kentucky River Rowdy frozen semen) DNA Profiled ~ Fly high, old friend.

"The WILL of God will never take you where the GRACE of God can not protect you!"

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Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Stanfield N.C
Posts: 206

I have a dog i stud out I call Harry2 I raised him from a pup I put ever win on him won all over with him in ukc and pkc I've bread him to 10 females so fare this year I think more of this dog then I do of a lot of people I would hate to see anything happen to him but I hunt him nightly and will do so until I think his just to old to hunt

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Frank Moore
Stanfield NC
Rafter M kennels
704 219 5118

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Al
Posts: 3070

quote:

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Originally posted by Cleo
You should know if that stud had been hunting before you loaded your female. That way no ones time was wasted. Its not arrogance its a choice people make with their own hounds just as you have the right to make with yours.

It about choice. Not about anything else. Its their dog. Period. If you don't like then just keep on looking. Simple really

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Theve all been Hunted or or so they say but , that dosent mean he will suit me, it dosent mean hes a bad dog if he dont suit me , but he might not suit my program. im not big on word of mouth, thats why i have to see for my self. yeah i can stay home and go some place else if i want ! But im gona call the man talk to him and if he wants to hunt his dog ill come see. thats all hes got to do is say hes retired, if he dont want to show him ill move on

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Well Stanley,this looks like another fine mess you've gotten us into

Ray Hudson

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Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Stanfield N.C
Posts: 206

Mr Ray I agree with what your saying I have people call me asking to see a dog in the woods be for they breed there female and I tell them come on I even had people ask to hunt with him before buying a pup off him and I take them hunting am proud to show my dog to them even if he has a bad night

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Frank Moore
Stanfield NC
Rafter M kennels
704 219 5118

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Registered: Jun 2007
Location: Shelbyville, IN
Posts: 294

I was setting talking to the owner of a popular stud dog at a breed hunt one day when he was approached by a hunter who was interested in breeding his female to this stud. He told him to let him know when she came in heat and they would make arrangements. The guy said that he would like to hunt with the dog first. The stud owner politely explained that they didn't hunt him anymore. The other guy then proceeded to tell him how nice this female was and that he wouldn't breed to anything without hunting with it first. Stud owner ok thats fine, but the guy wouldn't let it go. Finally he had to explain that he didn't come to him and ask him to breed his good female to his stud. If he wanted to breed to him he was available if not ok.

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Mike Gibson

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Al
Posts: 3070

quote:

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Originally posted by Gibbo
I was setting talking to the owner of a popular stud dog at a breed hunt one day when he was approached by a hunter who was interested in breeding his female to this stud. He told him to let him know when she came in heat and they would make arrangements. The guy said that he would like to hunt with the dog first. The stud owner politely explained that they didn't hunt him anymore. The other guy then proceeded to tell him how nice this female was and that he wouldn't breed to anything without hunting with it first. Stud owner ok thats fine, but the guy wouldn't let it go. Finally he had to explain that he didn't come to him and ask him to breed his good female to his stud. If he wanted to breed to him he was available if not ok.

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Well Stanley,this looks like another fine mess you've gotten us into

Ray Hudson

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Registered: Oct 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 3709

Let me just add this ~ my husband hunts all of our hounds. He wouldn't have it any other way. We have frozen semen hounds here that can't be replaced because there isn't any semen left. I don't like it but I understand. He wont hold them to be "shown" as some do.

We love our hounds as much as anyone.....but its our choice. That's my point. Just because someone isn't blowing this board (full of liers and thieves as it is) with dog tales doesn't mean they aren't hunting or would like to hunt. Its just not our place to tell them what to do with their dogs.

I'm done.....y'all continue to beat this horse all you want. Just remember .....you don't know everything there is to know about the dogs you read about on here. Consider the sorce.

__________________
BROKEN ROAD KENNEL
Breeding for the future of the Treeing Walker
"God bless the Broken Road"
~A man is only as good as his word~

Proud home to;

'PR' Kentucky River Fly Again (Kentucky River Rowdy frozen semen)
ACHA CHT x3 Broken Roads Little Texas (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
CH Broken Roads Southern Stylish Boom (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
Broken Road's Rowdy Lil Miss (Kentucky River Rowdy x Houses Lipper's Hope)
Broken Road's Meabie I will (Lipper's Rooster x Missy)
Broken Roads IMA Boomer2 (UKC NATL GRCH GRNTCH Honest Abe x Broken Roads Southern Stylish Boom
~~~~~Watch out!~~~~~
They just might make an IMPACT!

and the girls...Punkin and Tater!

Gone by never forgotten ~ Fly high my beautiful angels
~ GRCH GNTCH PKC SC Toucan Sam
~CH Toucan's Ugly Betty
~ CCH CH Southforks September Rain
~ Martin's Daisy JJ (what a beautiful litter you left behind)
~ Luke, the lab who brought us so many doves and ducks over the years
~ UKC GRCH,ACHA CH 2014 LWCH 2014 2 x's ACHA YOUTH WCH AKC CH AKC CH 'PR' Kentucky River Mundar ~ (Kentucky River Rowdy frozen semen) DNA Profiled ~ Fly high, old friend.

"The WILL of God will never take you where the GRACE of God can not protect you!"

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Registered: Jan 2011
Location: Maryland
Posts: 582

quote:

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Originally posted by Ray&Luie
Theve all been Hunted or or so they say but , that dosent mean he will suit me, it dosent mean hes a bad dog if he dont suit me , but he might not suit my program. im not big on word of mouth, thats why i have to see for my self. yeah i can stay home and go some place else if i want ! But im gona call the man talk to him and if he wants to hunt his dog ill come see. thats all hes got to do is say hes retired, if he dont want to show him ill move on

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When it comes to coonhounds some people are easy to please. I'm Not!

GrNiteCh Ch Oak Branch's Black Bird Star
Wipeout Chesapeake Piper

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Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1839

quote:

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Originally posted by Ron Ashbaugh
If your really interested in a stud and the stud is worth anything you should want to be going hunting with his offspring to see his value.

If that isn't good enough for you then don't breed to the dog...seems simple enough. Don't try to run a man down because of his choice of what to do with his property. Seems everybody has an idea of what what would or wouldn't do til they are standing there holding the leash.

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Al Tarantella

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Registered: Jan 2010
Location: Greene County Ohio
Posts: 1264

I was just about to say the same thing. Once the money started rolling in, and someones life style changed because of it, Im sure they would feel differently. A dog that you always see in the winners circle before it went to stud doesnt have anything else to prove when you are seeing their pups in the winners circle too in my opinion. Mojo is an example, he has won, his are winning, I wouldnt hunt him either. Now a guy thats breeding 2 or 3 females a month is a different story, but when your breeding 10-15 a month at 500 a pop you would have to be half crazy to turn a dog loose in an uncontroled environment. Thats just my opinion.

quote:

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Originally posted by jackbob42
I recall an article about Hillbilly Mac that said after winning the world hunts (UKC and PKC) he was breeding a female a day , every day , for $300 a pop.
That's $2100 per week. $9,000 per month.
Would you really take a chance on loosing that?

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Al
Posts: 3070

Im sorry an no offence to any man or his dog or his opinion but I dont belive everthing i hear or Read ........

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Well Stanley,this looks like another fine mess you've gotten us into

Ray Hudson

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Columbus, Ks
Posts: 5398

To valuable to hunt depends on how your situation is when it comes to deceased presidents.

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Home Of:
Gr Nt Ch, Ch Natural Smokey River Irene a coondog (Mailes Bob X Nt Ch Utchman Blue Two)
Gr Nt Ch Natural Smokey River Flo UKC Top 20 placing 15th UKC World 2011, top 100 2014 (Rebel x Mailes Lil)


The Hounds I Enjoyed Hunting:
Dual Gr Natural Smokey River Rebel, A buddy of mine
Gr. Nt Natural Blue Echo ( Gr Nt Quail Ck Jimmy X Nt Ch Natural Blue Bell)
Gr Nt Smokey River Chief's Joe (JBS Chief X Gr Nt Jeans Ruby)
Gr. Nt. Ch. Natural Smokey River Lucy (Chief's Joe X Muggins)
And Many More

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location: wyandotte,ok
Posts: 2114

blueticker i agree.

i have a friend here where i live and he won't hunt his stud for anybody but this yound dog is a grand nite and a pkc silver champ. before the age of 2 and i don't blame him because this dog is reproducing and is more valuable in the stud pen then in the woods to him right now. he would probable hunt him if you had the money to replace him if he got ran over or killed some way or another and yes the dog is insured.

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shawn stovall
wyandotte, ok
shawnstovall2001@yahoo.com
918-961-2434
Home to:
Pr S&J's Shack's Backwoods Patches (walker)
'PR' Stovall's Black Knight Wild Willy
Past Home to:
dual grand stovall's black knight george (gone but not forgotten)
pr D&S' black little luke (1st and 3rd place wins) (davis black luke x paynes black june) gone but not forgotten
Dual Grand Davis' black hutch (gone but not forgotten)

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Registered: Mar 2007
Location: Muscatine IA
Posts: 136

quote:

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Originally posted by MikeR
Exactly!!!! If I had a portion of the money I spent over the years on cull pups out of hyped up studs I'd be retired by now.

I will never bred a good titled female to a stud without seeing him AND his offspring in the woods. Period end of report!

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Registered: Jan 2011
Location: Maryland
Posts: 582

quote:

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Originally posted by d ryals
I suppose the female of those culls had nothing to do with it it's amazing how they never share the blame or get some of the credit

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When it comes to coonhounds some people are easy to please. I'm Not!

GrNiteCh Ch Oak Branch's Black Bird Star
Wipeout Chesapeake Piper

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Registered: Feb 2010
Location: MO
Posts: 220

i would rather hunt a dogs pups than the dog

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odg

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Registered: Apr 2011
Location: Illinois
Posts: 247

Bill i think your thinking of bad habit

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matt dalton mt.vernon il.

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Registered: Jan 2012
Location: paris mo
Posts: 479

one thing a person might think about is if a dog is realy helping the breed by producing a lot of good pups is it worth taking a chance turning him lose. every time you turn one loose he might not come back and thats a fact.

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Registered: Jul 2004
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1839

quote:

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Originally posted by odg
i would rather hunt a dogs pups than the dog

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Al Tarantella

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Registered: Feb 2011
Location: Commonwealth of VA
Posts: 100

Hunt with pups off of the stud. You don't get "that dog" when you breed to him. You get the offspring he throws. Some legit coondogs don't throw their likeness.

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Registered: Sep 2006
Location: Flowery Branch GA
Posts: 729

Obviously nobody on this thread has a dog that is too valuable to hunt so you simply wont understand.. Keep hunting your non valuables and be happy with them because your the one feeding them.. Dont worry about what somebody else does with what they feed..

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Waynesburg, PA
Posts: 169

Do you think that every stud owner/female owner should take his valuable dog out to hunt with every guy that comes along and wants to see him/her go? 90% of the people that want to see him or her go wouldn't pay the stud fee to breed or buy a pup anyway. It only takes one car on a gravel road.

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Registered: Aug 2010
Location: Troy NC
Posts: 2288

I like Frank Giddings approach. Breed a better dogs for the future and you don't have to go back to dead dogs to get what your looking for. Frank has lost many NICE dogs over the years, BUT he always keeps a nice dog. The reason for this is because he breeds for tomorrow/future. Reproducers producing reproducers. This is how strains of dogs are produced and how true success is measured.

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Danny VunCannon
Home of :
Amazing Grace
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Mossy Pond Amazing Gracie

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Registered: Dec 2011
Location: juniata county pa
Posts: 640

quote:

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Originally posted by BEAVER HUNTER
What exactly does this mean?

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Registered: Aug 2006
Location: munfordville ky.
Posts: 1166

he might not be valuable to anyone else & i could give a big @#@$. grntchgrch.hurrikane creek uglystick. (owned by robert church & me) i got his sire grntchgrch.rough creek thunderstick killed on the road at 3 years old. i got another killed on the road after thunderstick that was as good as they get (glen beck) & i just had another good young dog killed on the road a couple months ago in illinois. (II-X's thunder) had all 3 of these killed in the last 5 years.

last winter i bout got ugly killed on the road 3 times. once he blowed though the country about a mile & tree'd 200 yards from interstate 69 in indiana. once picked a track up in a corn field running right down the side of the road with 2 cars coming at each other down the road just as they crossed by him he crossed the road. once i pulled him off a tree & mistakinly cut him straight to a hwy. we run to the truck & i jumped out in front of traffic & caught him right on the doted line right in front of a car. this fall i cut him in a big woods with a creek through it. all i could do was watch him getting closer & closer to a hwy 3/4 of a mile away. he finaly struck & tree'd right on the side of the high way. this is why he dont get hunted much.

why is he so valuable to us. he is an exceptional reproducer that is doing his part to improve our breed. its not that we are getting rich off him but i am working on my 5th generation of b&t's. i dont believe in frozen seman. so if we get him nocked off on the road or some dumb azz shoots him, he's gone. we are very perticuler what gets bred to him & turn alot of females away. our goal with him is to improve the breed in competition not to breed as many females as we can !!

he will never see another hunt because we'd have no control where he would be cut loose. its not that we are making money off him. if that was the case we'd breed anything that come along & make as much as we could off him. our goal is to improve our breed with quality females only !! i know its hard for some to understand select breeding to improve your breed & i know its hard to understand why someone wont hunt there dog every time someone wants to see him go. if someone is breeding a female to him. we are more than happy to show him in the woods but for the life of me i dont understand why people are intrested in the stud when they should be intrested in what that dog is reproducing.

people that store seman on their dogs, what difference does it make if that dog gets nocked off. they can just keep on going. i'v always been a believer that if you cant reproduce as good or better than you got that blood should just fade out. if you got to go back 10 or 20 years to try to improve useing froze seman somethings wrong.

uglysticks #'s 107 pups, 2 grntch's, 8 ntch's, 1 grch, 10 shch's. 5 more pups with at least a 1st place win & another with a 2nd.
his oldest pups just turned 3 in january. not to shabby for an ol black dog.

he might not be valuable to anybody else but he is to us & our goals for breeding & trying to improve our breed. i'v got alot of years line breeding, planing & studying & wore out a bunch of boots to build this dog. plus i dont want to make that call to robert & he dont want to make that call to me that ugly got killed hunting !!

when you'v had this many good dogs killed on the road in this short amount of time & had this many close calls hunting a dog you get a little gun shy.

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jim kilburn
munfordville ky
270 524 3585

HOME OF
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