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quote:

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Originally posted by Bill(Chew)
Haven't ya'll ever heard of Hollering?

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Everybody's cell phone number is on the scorecard anymore!

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a good judge will ask you to keep em barking so we can find our way back a majority of the cast can score a tree

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mike smith

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I agree with Jim on the 2 minutes. It can not be ran on a handled dog. My question for the cast, how is a handled dog become lost, or start working another trail? YES, Garmins that track hounds must be turned off in the woods and should be. The E-trax can be left on all the time, as can the backtracker. A compass has never been illegal.Hollowering sounds like a reasonable way to find another handler, but i don't think the dog is going to hollower back. Now here is the million dollar question to this all. What idiot would tie a dog back in the woods and leave the spot un-marked for return by a legal tracking device? Come on guys. this one is common sense and it seems some lack it.

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Registered: Sep 2007
Location: Western Pa
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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
You know bud I don't find it amusing when your calling me a poor sport for wanting to go handle my dog when its 75 to 80 degrees at night. The rule clearly allows split treed dogs to be handled. To hell with waiting 10, 15, 20 minutes. It says dogs to be treed 5 minutes and be at the tree if at all possible. If 6 eyes can't find the coon then there's a very small chance I will. Sportsmanship in this situation tells me to say hey bud go handle that dog and come back into help us score the tree. And if the dogs far away split I will say handle your dog and wait for us to come score your tree. That my friend is following the rules exactly. Trying to tell someone they can't handle their dog that is lit treed is poor sportsmanship all around.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
I don't think its very common truly. Like I said if a guy can't get his dog. to bark here and there once its handled then somethings seriously wrong. My Mouse female often hushes when I handle her split but you can bet I make sure she barks once I hear the others hush. Then I know they are done scoring the tree and will be headed my way.

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Registered: Oct 2010
Location: Ohio
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quote:

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Originally posted by jculler8
Sounds to me like only part of your casts are shining trees. In my book, that is a BIG NO NO!

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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
Part? How is 1 handler going to his split dog part? In my estimation that still leaves 3 people to score the tree which is all you need.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
Part? How is 1 handler going to his split dog part? In my estimation that still leaves 3 people to score the tree which is all you need.

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Registered: Oct 2010
Location: Ohio
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quote:

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Originally posted by jculler8
Not necessarily. Now Trevor, you need to think what makes up a "MAJORITY" of the cast...

Is a majority of the CAST 2 out of the 3 shining while yay hoo is looking for fido???

Or is a majority of the CAST 3 out of the 4???

That right there is the real question. I'll let anyone go out and look for their dog ALL nite long while mine is hunting as long as the 2 out of the 3 I am hunting with are a majority...

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Registered: Jun 2003
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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
ill tell you a story from a hunt last year. 3 dog cast. We cut loose mine strikes for 100 other 2 are standing at out feet. They stood for 4 or 5 minutes and I said judge are you going to put the non working time on these dogs. They got all ticked off. So they were mad at me. Mine trees for 125 we proceed to tree and other dog strikes and trees about 200 yards away. We start shining my tree and i knew they were going to minus it. Other guy says can I go handle my dog judge says i dont know. I said he has the right to handle his dog. I wanted to get him away from my tree. Needless to say a guy cant give a vote if he walks away with time remaining on a tree. Judge said its minused and i said no sir its not. Its a 1 to 1 vote. I said you can? It if you want. So trust me I know all about majority on scoring a tree.

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Location: Ohio
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quote:

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Originally posted by josh
Yup, I can see why you are so in favor of the countdown also....Nothing like outhandling the other guys by removing the accountability of your dog making a slick.

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hoserman1 is a poorsport ! just read the unsportsman like comments he makes !

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quote:

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Originally posted by groworg1
hoserman1 is a poorsport ! just read the unsportsman like comments he makes !

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Registered: Nov 2005
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In our situation the dogs were close enough that wandering around looking for the rest of the cast and hollering worked.
However,
cell phones can not be used during hunt,
garmins can not be used during the hunt,
very few folks have other devices [like backtracker] that would do any good finding a dog that is deep in the country and not barking,
while a compass is helpful in giving general direction, often you can not walk in a straight line towards where a dog was- swamps, lakes, rivers, bluffs, dense thickets, make finding a dog that is deep in the country but not barking nearly impossible.
hollering often can not be heard as far as one thinks.

So for those who say that a 2 can not be run, or that an hour can not be run:
what do you do if you can not find the dog that has been handled at the tree? dogs these days like to get deep. it is easy to think you know the general whereabouts of a dog. often when you get to one that is barking you find that you are in a very different part of the woods than you thought.
A smart handler will let his dog keep barking to guide the rest of the cast there. But UKC rules don't require handlers to be smart. Or do they? If a handler goes deep and ties his dog and hushes it to save it's voice/energy, how long do you search for it? I definitely understand that there are times that a dog is deep that you can hear it and other when you can not. I am not for putting the two on a dog just because it is temporarily out of hearing. I am talking about a situation where the dog has gone totally silent and you have no clue where it is.
It is easy to say you are going to go find it, but in reality who is going to spend over an hour searching?

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Los Angeles, MN
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quote:

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Originally posted by Hoosier Man1
You even suggesting that tells me all I need to know. Its about the best dog winning josh.

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Yea, Im sure it is always about the best dog winning......As long as its yours.

Ben, We had a cast at zones once where 2 dogs split at the end of the hunt. We tied both and scored one tree, in the interum the other tied dog completely hushed. We spent at least 30 minnutes looking...

I remember seeing Todd comment on a similar situation here, If I remember correctly you pretty much look for the dog till you find it.

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Location: minnesota
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quote:

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Originally posted by josh
Yea, Im sure it is always about the best dog winning......As long as its yours.

Ben, We had a cast at zones once where 2 dogs split at the end of the hunt. We tied both and scored one tree, in the interum the other tied dog completely hushed. We spent at least 30 minnutes looking...

I remember seeing Todd comment on a similar situation here, If I remember correctly you pretty much look for the dog till you find it.

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Registered: Sep 2010
Location: New Paris, Indiana
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Truly, the reason you cannot apply the hour rule is because that rule only applies to timeout situations.
You look till you the find the dog because the tree must be scored and there is no other rule to apply. If that is until deadline, then you go back with a dead cast.
You cannot makeup rules because you need one for some unique situation. You are stuck with the ones that are on the back of the card.

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I always train my dog to hush when tied, I don't like loosing my hearing while I shine...save the dog's energy... nuisance to the homeowner sleeping... whatever.

Now I got an independant dog and when I tie him and I return to shine the others tree I have no Idea where he is.

Sorry guys come on and lets look for my dog while we burn the hunt time and miss deadline.

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why can you not use a cell phone... the rule says you cant use them pertaining to scores but can use them if oked by the judge for something like this i would think

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quote:

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Originally posted by patches9452
why can you not use a cell phone... the rule says you cant use them pertaining to scores but can use them if oked by the judge for something like this i would think

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Location: ackerman,ms
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quote:

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Originally posted by john Duemmer
I havent seen UKC say that a cell phone cant be used between cast members. I have done it in the past to round up a guy that had to retrive his dog during timeout to pick him up on the other side of a block. Just told him to call when he hit the road and we would drive around to get him.

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quote:

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Originally posted by patches9452
why can you not use a cell phone... the rule says you cant use them pertaining to scores but can use them if oked by the judge for something like this i would think

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Registered: May 2008
Location: Gillett, Pa
Posts: 1876

dead cast thats what ! if guy's keep breeding and training these independent dogs that will not pack or back they get what they got comming ! live by the sword die by the sword

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Registered: Nov 2005
Location: minnesota
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4. Points will be minus:
[f] After a dog is declared treed, at least one of the dogs declared treed must bark at least once every two minutes UNTIL CAST ARRIVES AT THE TREE, or be minused. If no dog barks in two minutes, tree declared open.

The cast has not arrived at the tree until the whole cast has arrived. It does not say "until handler arrives" or "until dog is handled at tree".

6. Dogs will be scratched:
[j] For delaying completion of cast for one hour after time out is called in accordance with Rule 8.
8. Timeouts:
[i]Time out may be called to go from one split to another if all dogs are declared treed and more than fifteen minutes is required to travel between trees....

Sorry gang, unless I see otherwise from UKC, if I am judging and only a cast member, not the whole cast or enough of it to score the tree, has arrived at the tree, I will run a two.
And unless UKC states otherwise, if we are on timeout between scoring trees, and we can not hear a dog that we should be able to hear, I will ask for the hour to be started after the two is up.

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