Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Comer, Georgia
Posts: 4724

quote:

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Originally posted by John D
Yep, all kinds of things can go wrong in that last minute. All of them I can think of are related to the dog screwing up or not being trained right.

That last minute is an opportunity for minus and thats why its critical to the other casts that you have the full time to get to whatever score you and your dog rightfully deserve.

But you never answered the question. Neither of the 19 or so other people that said they'd walk off a minute did, either.

If burning 1 minute off the clock is acceptable, how much is unacceptable?

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Puzzle Gully
Posts: 4506

quote:

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Originally posted by coon dawg
..........1 minute left in the hunt..............you turn loose, there is a good chance the cast will not make the deadline by the time you get the hounds back............do you turn loose or walk out the minute?????????...I walk the minute out and don't cause somebody a cast win at an RQE..........

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Registered: Feb 2008
Location: SOUTHEASTERN ILLINOIS
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if i got a hot spot sure i would cut em loose if i thought we could make the deadline. when the kittens get down and mulberry's get ripe, i will definitely take a shot.

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Registered: Jun 2005
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With a min left I would walk it out, "our next drop can be a min back towards the truck". If i'm beat i'm sure not turning my dog loose for a min.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: North GA
Posts: 14388

If you got 800 already in north GA..Your hunting one heck of a spot..IF I'm WITHIN 225 of the leader in hunting like that..You can bet your bottom dollar I'm cutting em loose!! And I can catch my dog...So the deadline thing more than likely aint gonna be my problem.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

quote:

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Originally posted by John D


If burning 1 minute off the clock is acceptable, how much is unacceptable?

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4927

John, I'll tell you how I do it.

If I have another drop close by I will walk to that drop. If there is time left at the drop we cut loose, if not the hunts over.

I have cut back loose with 5 minutes left, and I have walked out 10 minutes walking to the next drop (legitimate drop).

Just depends on where I am when the situation arises (do I have another drop without driving that I can walk to and if I do we will walk to that drop and if it walks out the time so be it).

1 minute, well I usually walk at least 30 sec or a minute dependin on how thick it is, that's what I coonsider turnin back loose on the same drop (cause many people have dogs that go back to the tree and in UKC all that does is waste time going back to get somebody elses dog). I would tell the cast "I usually don't make but one drop in these woods, I got place X over here we can call time out and go there or we can turn back out but the time will likely be up before we get far enough away from the tree."

That's how I have always handled it when it came up. Everybody has always been happy with that and I feel that everything was above board and within the rules because if we walked I did have another drop we were going to (as is evidenced by the fact that I have turned out with 5 minutes left LOL).

BTW, one night I turned out with 5 minutes left the guy leading the cast begged me not to "make" him turn loose. I wasn't guiding, just the assigned judge. The guy leading the cast was handling a dog for someone and a first place win paid him quite well(maybe why they assigned me to judge, don't know) and he thought he had it already. I asked the guide if he had a drop close enough to walk to and he said "nope, got nothin here but I do have a place down the road".

Long story short we turned out, him griping all the way, and got a coon treed on that last drop right before hunt time expired. When we got back to the clubhouse he won by somehing like 50 points or so. He wouldn't have got that win if he hadn't turned out again. He felt bad and apologized to us for griping LOL.

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Last edited by Rip on 05-28-2009 at 09:39 PM

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 4321

quote:

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Originally posted by rance56
how far can a dog met you off a tree?
just how you can be for sure its babbling?
just how quickly should you apply the 8?
whats a circle tree?

its called sportsmanship and common sense-which is quickly becoming uncommon sense. if you make me turn loss with one minute left, im going to be difficult to hunt everytime you draw me.

WHAT COMES AROUND, GOES AROUND!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

quote:

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Originally posted by John D
Those are all judgment calls. How many minutes is left on the clock has no judgement associated with it.

As far as your threat of payback if I hold you to the rules, go right ahead. You can't hold me too close to the rules so I suspect you have other ways you typically get people back? Then you complain about common sense and sportsmanship. Wow.

If you won't burn that minute off the clock in the first part of the hunt then you shouldn't burn it off at the end, either. The only difference is it benefits someone more at the end and the chances of someone objecting is less.

But remember if you say its alright to burn 1 minute, then someone will say its alright to burn time at the end of the hunt and next thing you know there's alot more than 1 minute getting walked off. Whoever gets a 1st and 1st on a coon in the first 15 minutes will want to "walk" to the tavern for the rest of the hunt. After all, its common sense they can't do any better than that and they'll prove what good sports they are by buying shots for everyone, lol.

Actually Rip has the only sensible answer to my question. You can walk 15 minutes before cutting loose, with time running. If you got less than that in the hunt, time runs out before you get there, hunts over. I can't think of any scenario where you can "walk" more than 15 minutes off the clock?

But you come into the clubhouse and say you walked off the last 1 minute or the last 30 minutes or sat in a tavern for the last 100 minutes of the hunt, any MOH worth a squat will throw your card out. GUARANTEED.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 4321

Who said anything about calling timeout? Regardless, you can call timeout to hunt new ground. Its in the rules, make some attempt to know them, Scooter.

The only thing that matters is time is left: 1 minute. All these other what if's and conditions and whether its good for me or good for you is all beside the point.

I was on a cast a few years ago where me and another guy had around 350+, after about an hour of hunting. We had driven a nearly an hour to hunt and the guide's dog got out of pocket. Time was called and it took over an hour to round him up. I was judge, not because I wanted to, but because they handed me the card. I looked at the time left, the time it would take to drive the the clubhouse, and the deadline and realized we couldn't get our hunt time in. I told the cast we wouldn't make the deadline. Nobody suggested we cheat and walk or drive the time off but there's no doubt in my mind that someone that burns a minute would have burned that time and produced a cast winner.

The whole cast withdrew and we went back to the clubhouse. Nearly everyone there thought we were idiots, that we should have run the clock while we were driving or done this, or done that and got a 1st place win out of it. I don't do that crap. All I could do was give the club an earful for having a deadline that was too early.

After the trophies were handed out, the man that won 1st place with around 300+ came over to me and shook my hand and told me he appreciated me judging it right, knowing he might not have got that win if we had pencil whipped the time. Thats MY definition of sportsmanship. You can keep yours.

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Registered: May 2006
Location: Wiscoonsin
Posts: 1941

This is an easy one.
If it's a northern hunt, I recast.
If it's a southern hunt, I walk it out.





Scott

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4927

quote:

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Originally posted by 1deadeye
This is an easy one.
If it's a northern hunt, I recast.
If it's a southern hunt, I walk it out.





Scott

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Western Pa
Posts: 2106

John D hit the nail on the head. If after scoring a tree a judge sees that 1 minute is left in the hunt why would he call time out? It is judge/cast descretion to call time out. If time out isn't called is it walking off the the minute or just letting time expire? I would compare it to taking a knee at the end of the game......

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 4044

you are some hero john d. you had half the hunt time left but choose not to just head to the club house. i cant even believe anyone would use that example as the epitamy of thier display of sportsmanship.

per the rules, you only call time out and move IF NEW HUNTING GROUND IS NEEDED, not because you need a fast coon.

in your logic, we should turn loose the dogs if 5 seconds is left in the hunt. heck a dog can run 50 yards in 5 seconds and ive treed coons before w/i 50 yards of the turn loose.

and you never did answer my question abotu wether you would help me get my dog or head to the clubhouse after you made me turn loose with 1 minute left on your hunting territory

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Registered: Sep 2006
Location: Dinwiddie, VA
Posts: 295

It's a shame he missed the deadline. Nobody in the cast gains anything in that situation.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Missouri
Posts: 4321

Its not just the one cast. The other casts are also affected. If you play fast and loose on your cast and do whatever benefits you and what the rest of the cast will allow, thats one thing.

Put yourself in the position of a cast winner on another cast. You've done everything right by the rules and are back at the clubhouse with a good score. The last cast comes in with a little better score talking how they walked off X minutes of the hunt. I bet every single person that would walk time off when it benefits themselves would now have other thoughts about it...

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Registered: Aug 2008
Location: Norfolk Naval Base, Norfolk, VA
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if you think about it...... you probably aint gonna draw minus in 1 minute. you dont have to strike in the first minute..... the stationary cannot be run to force you to tree... no reason to have to make a call. and if nobody could beat the cast winner with 1 coon would you still make him cut loose? i wouldnt. not even if i was down by 25.

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