Registered: Jun 2007
Location: N.C.
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My thoughts are that dog a is minusd 125 for leaving tree when he arrived at tree b it was already closed so wouldnt his strike points be deleted? And dog a only minused 125?

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B-C---tree is dead ===all dogs treed --you can't give next tree points --you can't tree on a dead tree

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Doug and Tarlton

So, your saying.. that rule 4(g) never applies anywhere then? Cause if dog B C is treed in and dog A comes in and starts treeing but noone trees it in. The tree is dead after the 5 minutes and then we arrive at tree. Then what your saying is this dog A can't be given next available and minused this way either cause the tree was closed and dead when the five was up before we arrived. Same situation. The dog was there before we got there.
Might as well delete rule 4G if it can never be applied...

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Registered: Dec 2006
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What if in my cast dog C started treeing after the 5minutes and handler calls him treed but when you get in there he is on the same tree? Same difference??

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YEAP ----AS PER MR. GINGRICH --in BLOODLINES A FEW MONTHS BACK --if you know the dog is on the same tree after the five is up the judge isn't going to take your call

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Doug, the original question here doesn't involve a tree call. The question involved finding a dog treed but not declared treed when the judge arrived at a tree that was scored minus for being slick. The dog that was there when the judge arrived but not declared treed is assigned next available positin on the tree and and minused tree and strike points. Rule 4(g). Those minus points added to the 125- the dog took for leaving his other tree add up to a total of 275-.

The fact that the tree was closed before the dog covered it is irrelevant. 4(g) doesn't make any mention of a tree being open or closed when the dog got there, it only states that if the dog is there when the judge arrives, it falls under 4(g).

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 9282

quote:

---

Originally posted by machslammer
Three dog cast A, B, C

All dogs struck in A- 100 B-75 C-50

A trees for 125 to the left

B and C tree to the right B-125 C-75

Walking towards the dogs, dog A moves and joins Dogs B and C. Before we get there.

Dog A is minused 125 correct?

Here the question.... Get to the dogs all three on same tree. We obviously needed a COON hound cause the tree was SLICK!

So, B is minused 125 on tree and 75 on strike for 200 minus.
C is minused 75 on tree and 50 on strike for 125 minus.
A was minused on tree to left for 125 minus, and what does
it get here?

Here is what rule 4(g) says: Dogs treeing, but not declared treed, when Judge arrives, will be minused on tree points on “off” game or slick tree. Points will be determined by next available position in the case of one dog, or split available tree points in the case of two or more dogs. Dogs shut out on strike on slick tree or “off” game will receive minus tree points only.

In that case, would Dog A not go back in for 50 on their tree and minused strike 100 and tree for 50 on that tree? For a total of 275 minus?(125 on it's own tree as well)

Thanks for answers.

---

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 1652

I guess it's another situation where "if you can't receive plus, you can't recieve minus" doesn't apply...

I would have said "a dead tree is a dead tree" as far as scoring goes. It was OBVIOUS the dog was not there, and he can NOT be declared treed, even if you know he is there. The rule is intended for people not calling their dogs treed, not for covering a closed tree before the cast arrives. Sorry, but I don't get it.

But then again, my opinion obviously doesn't matter...

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I think this is a good rule. It compesates for the fact that we can't just minus a dog for getting there after the five which I believe is the same thing as quitting a track. If the dog shows up before the 5 is expired, the dog can be treed and get points. If the dog shows up after the 5, that dog deserves all the minus you can stick it with. 4(g) sticks them with plenty.

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Registered: Apr 2004
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like you said, 4 g, sticks it to a dog, & 5 g, lets them off of the hook. OH, what a difference 10-15 seconds makes on whether the dog beats the cast to the tree or comes in 5 seconds after the cast arrives. Either way, the dog came into a closed tree, & started treeing. I guess TIMING is everything????

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You got that right!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 1652

After some thought, I would imagine the tree would always be closed before 4g could be applied...LOL!

At any rate, I can't see any difference with the guy wanting to tree his dog but can't because the 5 is up and he can't receive any points, and his dog obviously coming in after the 5 and applying 4g just because he's there when you get there(which you already knew). I agree with the reasoning, just seems kinda cheezy that you wait until you see what the dogs have, then stick it to him. I guess I kinda straddle the fence on this opinion-wise...

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DEAD no longer in force.
4g was put in to keep guys from setting on the magic #
if you dont know how many dogs or treeing you have
a bigger problem than a dog.

ukc dont honor dogs that pull up short thats the other boys

Last edited by Lee Currens Jr. on 03-05-2008 at 02:06 AM

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JIM & ALLEN ---I agree with you 100%[ IF] the tree wasn't dead [5 is up or all dogs treed ]--when you hear the dog treeing and the handler didn't tree--and than when you get to the tree he would get the pencil --
but will you agree once a tree is dead that you can't tree on it anyway ------------I'm thinking right----------------

ALL DOGS WERE TREED WHEN GOING TO THE DOGS--- DOG-A LEFT HIS TREE ---WHEN GOING TO DOGS -- --BY THE TIME CAST GOT TO B- C TREE -- DOG A GOT THERE BEFORE HANDLERS DID SO I WOULD SAY THAT THE TREE WAS ----DEAD

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ALWAYS GO BY THE RULES AND NEVER A PROBLEM

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Registered: Jun 2003
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thanks DAN --you are right

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