Registered: Oct 2006
Location: Blue Ridge Mtns.
Posts: 433

To me Russell hit the nail on the head. A man that has a silent hound knows that if he goes to a hunt there is a chance at nights end he can be scratched for have a silent dog. Im not asking that the first rule been changed so I can compete, just allow me to compete.
I think alot of other cur hunters feel the same. Bring that quick, forsure 1st strike hound. I'll take 3rd strike every time, as long as I can have 1st tree.

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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Superstition Mtns., AZ
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I'm in favor of hunting all coondogs together. With that being said, I would like to inform the great number of you that do not know about the American Leopard Cur. It is the only breed of cur that since it's inception, has required each and every dog to be open on trail in order to be perminantly registered. That may or may not be a requirement for the six breeds of UKC hounds, I don't know but read on...The American Leopard Cur also has something else neccesary for perminant registration. It is required that three witnesses sign an affidavit (one of them being a current ALCBA member) that each indiviual witnessed the dog being concidered to, strike open a track, openly move that track and tree real live treegame. Of course, this is the requirements of the American Leopard Cur Breeders Registration office; however, in order to register a Lep. with the UKC, you must first have the dog registered with the ALCBA (this does not apply to Leps. born of parents that are UKC registered).

According to UKC Night Hunt Rules I believe that any dog that is determined by the judge to be running it's track silent is to be scratched. That rule alone should take care of most of the bellyaching.

As for a couple of folks not wanting to hear cur-like mouths... what do you do when you draw out with a chop mouthed hound? Do you scratch your dog and write a letter to the UKC admonishing them for letting an unpleasant sounding dog into the hunt? (Obviously a retoricle question!)

The cur breeds should absolutely never be looked at or talked about as one group of dogs. I am not making any statement for any other breed of cur besides the Leopards when I say this, but it does not make sense for the American Leopard Curs to be hunting anywhere else than with the rest of the hounds.

Consider this...if you were to rename the American Leopard Cur yourself based on the type of dog and the style of hunt and the history of the breed, you couldn't honestly call them a cur. Now if anyone comes on here with a story about one dog somewhere that someone slipped under the radar and cheated and got registered even though it was silent, I'm goin to call you a fool! Don't even try.

As for the other breeds of curs, there are a couple of others that are regularly open on track; but like I said, only one breed requires, as a prerequisite of perminant registration, that each and every dog be open on track and that is the AMERICAN LEOPARD CUR.

Thank you and God bless!
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Registered: Dec 2005
Location: central illinois
Posts: 453

Boy there sure is a big difference in the results of this poll from the same poll taken in the cur section. Wonder why that is? I own Hounds and curs. The most important thing to me is it a coondog!I guess there are a lot of people out there scared of a little competition. Hell I like walker dogs. Aint been that many years back all the old timers reffered to them as old spotted dogs and claimed they were nothing but running dogs! I beleive they have now proven themselves to be coondogs. Although I have seen a lot of varmints treed by all the breeds. Seen some hounds make darn good squirrel dogs. Many a good possum dog also! Maybe we ought to just divide all the breeds and hunt em all seperate. They all have a little different characterisics as a general rule, although there are always exceptions to this rule. I say you throw em all in together and see who owns the best coondog, period! Not the best tree dog or the best track dog or the best handling dog or the loudest.........etc. But the best coondog! Although I sure would hate to have some of them ole cur dogs tap into that money pot them big name fellars are dipping into with there big name, high powered pure bred registered hounds! Heck they might get their feelins hurt when they realize most true coonhunters want a coondog not a long set of papers. Never have seen them tree any coon but they do come in handy when your in the woods and have to go and aint got no other paper!

Last edited by john r. kincaid on 08-04-2007 at 06:45 AM

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Registered: Jul 2006
Location: va
Posts: 92

do you think ukc needs to put all dogs together?
You do not have permission to vote on this poll.
yes, put all the dogs together 16 72.73%
no,keep is how it is 6 27.27%
Total: 22 votes 100


thats what it is i the cur section.
And just to let you kno a LEOPARD CUR go's back to being breed out of plotts...... just to let you kno.and as far as mr.kincaid was saying yes they do have to be able to strike,run,and tree there on game. if you all dont think thats right. i will get my papoers of my leopaed cur and scan the back to show you.

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: bronaugh,MO
Posts: 2595

As long as the rules stay the same, I dont have a problem with it. Heck I draw hounds some weekends who arent much different than curs. Silent on track, house dog mouths on tree.


In all these years I have yet to see the first dog scratched for being silent on track. Its just impossable to prove. The curs shouldnt have a problem staying around for the night.

Off game is minused in open casts, scratched in Ch casts, so IF they tree something off I dont see a problem.


Ive hunted with some Leopard curs and Lep/hound crosses that could compete with the best of hounds. Strait on coon, open on track, lightning quick on tree, accurate, the get deep/get treed with a coon type.

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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Superstition Mtns., AZ
Posts: 1166

When Elijah Crow got together with Mont Plott for the well known cross between the two breeds the resulting dogs were infused back into both breeds. The Leopards and the Plotts existed separately long before that meeting. The Plotts did not come out of the Leopards and the Leopards did not come out of the Plotts.

Since that time both the Leopards and the Plotts have been crossed with different hounds to make the dogs we see today.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: North GA
Posts: 14395

I guess I'm in the wrong place in the country... I've heard of none nor seen any high powered cur dogs around here..

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I mentioned before, I would not oppose the idea of hunting curs with hounds, I just don't see the point in doing it. Even if it were allowed I doubt that you'd see many show up to hunt.

I do own a cur and she goes with me almost every night that I hunt a hound. She is absolutely worthless and if my wife didn't like her so much I would have culled her years ago. My cur is the smart as a whip, fast and athletic and can really move through the woods but she has absolutely no desire. I take her along so she can get some excercise and she keeps me company while the hound is out working.

I am a supporter of the Cur events and I would love to see more of them BUT I still have not hunted with a cur that can even measure up with a below average hound. I'm sure they're out there but I haven't had the opportunity to hunt with one and No, I'm not gonna drive over 100 miles to hunt with one just for someone to prove to me they exist, thanks for the offer.. I believe you.

What about the 30 minute no hunting rule? A dog is not to be walked to be encourged to go hunting. Most curs I've hunted with a "walk" type dogs. This is a rule that would probably be tweaked to hunt them with hounds. I spectated on 1 Cur/Fiest NH event and we walked more trying to get those dogs on a track than what I generally walk to get to a hard hunting Walker dog treed in deep.

I do enjoy listening to a good hound mouth run a track but most of the Walkers these days don't have much better mouths than a cur ( including the one I'm hunting).

If there was more interest from the Cur fanciers in my area to hold cur NHs and and interest to run with the hounds, I would support it.

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Registered: Dec 2003
Location: Sheridan, WY
Posts: 1163

I don't know, but isn't this allowed in PKC, and isn't there hardly any participation from cur dogs in their night hunts? If that's true, and I don't know for sure if it is..., then this is really a non-issue anyway.

dk

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2410

PKC will let curs compete .. if Curs were showing up in numbers then other registries would take notice and cur hunters might have a leg to stand on .

Until cur hunters start showing up at their own cur hunts in numbers ( $$ ) and show up to hunt against hounds in the other registries .... then it's all hot air.

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Registered: Oct 2005
Location: Vernon, Alabama
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quote:

---

Originally posted by Justin Smith
Until cur hunters start showing up at their own cur hunts in numbers ( $$ ) and show up to hunt against hounds in the other registries .... then it's all hot air.

---

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: West Point, MS
Posts: 436

SOME PEOPLE DONT WANT CURS OR BIRDDOGS IN THE HUNTS BUT EVERYTIME YOU DRAW A WALKER OR B&T YOU ARE DRAWING A PART CUR, AND IF THE BLUETICK HAS SOME OF THE MORE FAMOUS BLOOD IN IT YOU CAN BET YOUR LAST DOLLAR TO A BUCKET OF MANURE THAT YOU ARE DRAWING A BIRDDOG! ROFL

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2410

People drive all across the country to go to B&T Days , Plott Days , Autumn Oaks and so on ..... if there is only one cur hunt every six months and it's hours away ... how is that different than those other hunts for houndsmen ????

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Location: Vernon, Alabama
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quote:

---

Originally posted by Justin Smith
People drive all across the country to go to B&T Days , Plott Days , Autumn Oaks and so on ..... if there is only one cur hunt every six months and it's hours away ... how is that different than those other hunts for houndsmen ????

---

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Registered: Jul 2006
Location: va
Posts: 92

but like here in VA there are NO cur hunting. i would have to drive like 5 hr to get to one. and if you hunted them with the hounds then you may see more. anmd the breed wont just go away. i mean how would you houndsmen feel if there where no hunting in your state???? you would want to be able to hunt with the curs are? its the same way with the people who hunt curs now.

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Registered: Apr 2004
Location: central illinois
Posts: 69

im not sure but ive hunted with some great curs from dan edwards and the only reason i think its a bad idea is if the curs are in who says grandmas poodle that can tree a truck load of coon shouldnt be allowed to hunt i dont mind losin to a cur but a poodle? i think my 8 yr old would even laugh at me! ....rofl jm 2 cents

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Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 50

Face it man, Curs are NOT coon hounds. If you want a dog that you can hunt competitively buy a **** coon hound quit your crying. This post is pathetic

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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Superstition Mtns., AZ
Posts: 1166

Please tell me your kidding.

Dan

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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2760

quote:

---

Originally posted by get um redtick
i just want to kno what all you houndsmen think about hunting curs with hounds?

---

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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2760

If you like Curs, stick to cur v cur and stay out of the competition coon hunting. Don't get me wrong I have nothing against Curs. I have owned a few that could beat the best of 'em on squirrels (never tried 'em on coon).

Now set up and take notes......
#1) If U hunt cur v hound and do well, LOOK OUT! The Curs will be in mass production, breeding anything to anything and before you know it 75% of the traits that drew you to the breed will be breed out of them.

#2) If they don't do so well, LOOK OUT! cur breeders will start fixing the problem and before you know it, pure bred Curs will be covered w/ little blue ticks (spots), tri-colored curs AMAZING. You will notice they run track w/ a long deep bawl & blow the tops out w/ their steady ringing chop mouths on tree.

You nut cakes need to step back & look at the competition hounds. They are not bred to be the best coon dog. They are bred to be the best competition dog. They are bred for SPEED & TREE. Looks don't matter, mouth don't matter, accurracy don't matter. Its all about speed and tree. Is that how you want your Curs to end up....

My best coon dogs were plain old pleasure hunting country coondogs and were twice the dogs that my old GRNITECH was. but they weren't competition material. but when you went to them they had MEAT! the kind of dogs that take a cold track and finish it. My competition dog would "drift" the tracks (no he switched off the 1 he started when he came across a hotter track).


Now brother cooners go ahead, fire away, let me have it....

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quote:

---

Originally posted by ItsOlMander
i personally think hounds with hounds and curs with curs. nothing agaisnt the curs but most curs dont open on track, and just have a different style of hunting. theyre nice dogs on a range of game, but theyre not hounds. different types hunting, different breeds of dogs.

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Registered: Oct 2006
Location: Blue Ridge Mtns.
Posts: 433

Well as this post has evolved, its starting to show just how STUPID some people can be....
I would like to see any of the six coonhound breeds(plotts included), start mandating the same rule for perment registration as the Leopards do. Im not talking about single registering a 3 year old, Im talking about before those little green puppy papers can be turned into pretty 'PR' papers. The dog must ALONE strike run with open mouth and tree a coon(thats seen).
I know this will never happen, no money in doing such a thing, but if it did one thing is forsure. There would be a whole hell of a lot more grade coonhounds running around!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
get um redtick.... After you scan in your papers let me know, and I'll do the same. Wouldnt want any of these dumbazz hound boys thinking you made the things up.

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Registered: Jul 2006
Location: va
Posts: 92

ok man i will scan it this weekend.they dont know how some curs work man. i know i have curs that have colder nosies then a lot of walkers and stuff so.

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Registered: Jul 2006
Location: va
Posts: 92

and guys i just looked at my pm's and this is what todd sent me

"Re: About puting curs with hounds.
Thanks for the input. That's a touchy subject for sure. We are looking at some options."


And thank you to every body for posting on this but if you look at the poll hunting cur withy hounds is winning!!!!

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Last edited by Todd K / UKC on 08-08-2007 at 01:38 PM

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Registered: May 2006
Location: Chesapeake, Va.
Posts: 206

I dont see the big deal, I hunt about 4 nights a week with my buddy who has a Night Champion English dog with 2 wins towards Grand Night. He doesnt look at my dog as an inferior dog but as a young dog in training, this is her second season.
In 2 months of hunting I have got 1st strike one time and never a first tree, I know most Curs will not do what a Hound will do but my dog is still young yet,lol. We both know this and still hunt every night and have a good time. Soon enough she is going to be a good dog and I would like to hunt her in some hunts but the nearest cur hunt is 5 hours away. I would gladly donate an entree fee just to see what she can do against some other dogs. Win or lose, I dont care as long as We have a good hunt.
By the way, she is a Kemmer Cur who is fully open on the track with a short bawl and chop and a nice change over at the tree(if you shut your eyes she sounded just a Little Walker dog I had in the mid 80s), shes not the hardest tree dog in the world but she will be there when you get to her.
To me a coon dog is a coon dog, no matter what the breed. Ive hunted tree dogs for close to 25 years and the best I have ever seen were 2 Leoperd Curs, they might have been flukes but they were good.
Sorry for the long post but I felt I had to comment on this.
Scott Huss

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