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longshot
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 2057

Bayer tree and shrub for fleas and ticks??

Ok I have read the post on here about how well the Bayer product is great for controlling fleas and is very cheap and I finally bought some. They say the correct amount for a 70 lbs hound would be about 15 to 20 milliliters. My question is; Is the milliliter measurement the same as cc"s on a sringe?? This product seems to be working well by all those that have tryed it and is the same as some of the drop on products sold, but Bayer is much cheaper... Anyone have experiance with it and the best way to measure??????

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06-18-2007 01:11 AM

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skyblu
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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 4324

IT WORKS!

I have a 30 CC syringe & put 12-15 CCs on my adult hounds (depending on their size)
For my Rat Terrier, I put it on her belly & smear it around - use about 4 CCs

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06-18-2007 01:19 AM

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longshot
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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 2057

Thanks Sky.....

For those that do not know, Bayer is supposed to work much like Bio spot or frontline, but is a fraction of the cost. The label does not say it is for dogs , but it has the same active ingrediants as some of the drop on products. All I can say is do a search on this forum for Bayer tree , and read all the reviews from people that have used it.. If it works as they say, then it is a very cheap and effective way to control bugs on your dogs... I will know soon because I bought some today.......

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06-18-2007 03:05 AM

earthgirl1975
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2005
Location: Pilot Mtn, NC
Posts: 2205

here is my experience recently

I used it on 2 adult coonhounds and a Jack Russell Terrier.
Used 15ml each on coonhounds and 5 on JRT. Both the coonhounds threw up everything they had on there stomachs after giving it. I did see my Jack lick her belly right after her dose and i could tell she didnt like that one bit, dont know if she threw up but seen her eating grass afterwards. Have seen 2 ticks on my jack since using it and ive seen her scratching, havent seen any fleas though. What do you guys think about why my dogs threw up?

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06-18-2007 03:36 AM

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BRYAN J
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Registered: Jan 2005
Location: BLOOMFIELD IOWA
Posts: 2439

Re: here is my experience recently

quote:
Originally posted by earthgirl1975
I used it on 2 adult coonhounds and a Jack Russell Terrier.
Used 15ml each on coonhounds and 5 on JRT. Both the coonhounds threw up everything they had on there stomachs after giving it. I did see my Jack lick her belly right after her dose and i could tell she didnt like that one bit, dont know if she threw up but seen her eating grass afterwards. Have seen 2 ticks on my jack since using it and ive seen her scratching, havent seen any fleas though. What do you guys think about why my dogs threw up?

it may work but i would be very carefull with it. i also wonder why your dog was sick afterwards.

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06-18-2007 03:41 AM

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Ron Ashbaugh
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Registered: Dec 2003
Location: Mercer PA
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I have used it for 2 years now with no ill effects. I just make sure I rub it in really well. I have had no fleas or ticks since I have used it.

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06-18-2007 03:44 AM

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bamablues
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Registered: Jan 2005
Location: Alabama
Posts: 456

I have been using the product for over a year now. I love it. I put the product on my dogs back and rub it in real good. I try not to put it on their face or where they can lick it and get sick. Yes cc's are the same thing as mL. I put about 15 mL on my dogs and they are pushing 50-55 pounds. I recently found it just as effective to put it in a spray bottle and lightly spray all up and down their backs and rub it in real good. The product works well b/c it keeps on the hair follicles. Also, I found this information out from people on here and doing my own researh. The active ingredient in Bayer Tree and Shrub is Imidacloprid. It is the same product in K-9 Advantix. The only thing is that Imidacloprid is very effective against fleas but not against ticks. That is why there are other secondary ingredients in K-9 Adavantix and Frontline that kill ticks, such as permethrin or fipronil to kill ticks. Just some helpful info. that people have handed down to me and that I have looked up. But I recommend the product to anyone especially people with alot of dogs so they can save money, especially as high as gas is.

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06-18-2007 03:56 AM

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longshot
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btt

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06-18-2007 01:16 PM

earthgirl1975
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Registered: Mar 2005
Location: Pilot Mtn, NC
Posts: 2205

quote:
Originally posted by bamablues
I have been using the product for over a year now. I love it. I put the product on my dogs back and rub it in real good. I try not to put it on their face or where they can lick it and get sick. Yes cc's are the same thing as mL. I put about 15 mL on my dogs and they are pushing 50-55 pounds. I recently found it just as effective to put it in a spray bottle and lightly spray all up and down their backs and rub it in real good. The product works well b/c it keeps on the hair follicles. Also, I found this information out from people on here and doing my own researh. The active ingredient in Bayer Tree and Shrub is Imidacloprid. It is the same product in K-9 Advantix. The only thing is that Imidacloprid is very effective against fleas but not against ticks. That is why there are other secondary ingredients in K-9 Adavantix and Frontline that kill ticks, such as permethrin or fipronil to kill fleas. Just some helpful info. that people have handed down to me and that I have looked up. But I recommend the product to anyone especially people with alot of dogs so they can save money, especially as high as gas is.

I do feel they threw up because they got some in their mouth by licking their bellys, but dont understand why my Jack had 2 ticks on her and is still scratching. One of the ticks was attached but dead and all dried up and that was on her back. The other tick was in her ear and very much alive. I did fill a water bottle and sprayed edges of kennel and inside her barrel on the shavings. Question, if you wash the dog will it stay effective?

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06-18-2007 05:29 PM

ItsOlMander
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Registered: Jun 2005
Location: North of Panama City Florida
Posts: 1014

quote:
Originally posted by longshot
For those that do not know, Bayer is supposed to work much like Bio spot or frontline, but is a fraction of the cost. The label does not say it is for dogs , but it has the same active ingrediants as some of the drop on products. All I can say is do a search on this forum for Bayer tree , and read all the reviews from people that have used it.. If it works as they say, then it is a very cheap and effective way to control bugs on your dogs... I will know soon because I bought some today.......

look on advantage and see who makes the product- bayer. same company, pretty much the same stuff (same active ingredients) just deluted so it dosnt kill the plants.

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wayne f
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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: bainbridge ny
Posts: 2589

i have used it 2 years on i5 dogs and it works and never made them sick

drug stores carry ml syringes my druggest gave me a handful

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06-18-2007 07:04 PM

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earthgirl1975
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Location: Pilot Mtn, NC
Posts: 2205

havent had any problems with any fleas or ticks since i found the last 2 ticks. May have just taken couple of days to be effective.

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06-20-2007 09:23 PM

ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1867

quote:
Originally posted by earthgirl1975
I do feel they threw up because they got some in their mouth by licking their bellys, but dont understand why my Jack had 2 ticks on her and is still scratching. One of the ticks was attached but dead and all dried up and that was on her back. The other tick was in her ear and very much alive. I did fill a water bottle and sprayed edges of kennel and inside her barrel on the shavings. Question, if you wash the dog will it stay effective?

Amy,
The only research with Frontline and Advantage after bathing was done with non-soap shampoos. If you use a soap shampoo that strips the oil layer from the skin it will remove most of the product and it should be reapplied. This is true with Frontline despite what the company has told us about the product hiding out in the apocrine glands and reapplying itself. You could just use the spray and apply a small amount across the back after the dog is dried to keep the levels high. We have clients that use both the Frontline Topspot monthly and then apply the spray weekly for better tick control and in areas where the fleas seem to show resistance. It is working great so far.

Allen

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06-20-2007 10:43 PM

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Melanie H.
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Location: Southern Oregon
Posts: 1344

Isn't there a "secret" ingredient in this stuff? And if so, it doesn't worry anyone on long term effects on the dogs? Unless I am mistaking.. and that is a possibility .. this stuff has a secret ingredient that they don't want to mention for competitors sake... What if in 5 or 6 years this is found to effect kidneys or liver or something like that? Just a wild suggestion... I would love to use it, but that has me a bit hesitant...

Please if I am wrong about this let me know..
Thanks

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06-20-2007 11:31 PM

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longshot
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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 2057

Update on the Bayer product. I put it on 2 days ago and seems to be working. I put it on 1 adult hound and two 3 month olds and they had no side effects that I could see. They seem to be doing fine. I put 4 ml on the pups and 12 ml on the adult.
The only thing I noticed is, it is kinda thick, like paint or milk and rather hard to work into the skin. Some have applied it to the belly where there is less hair, but I put it on the back to avoid them licking it. It does have to be rubbed in but it left no trace after dryed. It does seem to work but we will see how long it last.
I figure if it works, I can treat my 3 dogs once a month for 2 years for about 18 bucks.

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06-20-2007 11:43 PM

Lance Johnson
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What is the actual name on the containor and what does the containor look like???

I may give it a try around the kennel!

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06-20-2007 11:46 PM

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longshot
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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Southwest Missouri
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quote:
Originally posted by ladycathunter
Isn't there a "secret" ingredient in this stuff? And if so, it doesn't worry anyone on long term effects on the dogs? Unless I am mistaking.. and that is a possibility .. this stuff has a secret ingredient that they don't want to mention for competitors sake... What if in 5 or 6 years this is found to effect kidneys or liver or something like that? Just a wild suggestion... I would love to use it, but that has me a bit hesitant...

Please if I am wrong about this let me know..
Thanks

I was thinking the same thing , but the ingrediants just show the 1 active ingrediant mentioned above that I cant even spell and it is used on dogs. The ratio is differant. Bayer tree, is more diluted , so thats why you need the correct dosage. I wasnt gonna try it either but decided it must be safe, but dont go on what I say. LOL

I would think if there is a (secret ingrediant) it would have to be listed by law on the bottle...

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06-20-2007 11:50 PM

Buckshot
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Here is the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet):

http://www.bayeradvanced.com/media/...sectControl.pdf

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06-21-2007 12:16 AM

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Melanie H.
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Registered: May 2006
Location: Southern Oregon
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Okay it was the "ingredient withheld, trade secret" that has me worried....

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06-21-2007 12:30 AM

Chiggers
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quote:
Originally posted by earthgirl1975
havent had any problems with any fleas or ticks since i found the last 2 ticks. May have just taken couple of days to be effective.

You have to use something else for ticks. It does not have anything in it for ticks.

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06-21-2007 12:55 AM

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ahallada
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Location: California
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quote:
Originally posted by Chiggers
You have to use something else for ticks. It does not have anything in it for ticks.

One of the active ingredients in this Bayer Shrub and Tree spray is Imidicloprid which is the same ingredient in Advantage, NOT Advantix. Advantix has both Imidicloprid and Permethrin combined for tick prevention where Advantage is only labeled for fleas. Advantage (Imidicloprid) has shown very poor tick prevention and did not have enough efficacy to make the label. I'm not sure why people are not seeing ticks on their dogs after using the Bayer Shrub and Tree spray unless it does have another ingredient that repels or kills ticks and the active ingredient is witheld or if the concentration of Imidicloprid that is actually getting on the skin is just alot higher with this method.
Would be good to get some current reports from anyone using this Bayer Shrub and Tree spray and effectiveness against ticks in areas with known problems.

Also, Advantage has the same MSDS sheet as the Bayer Shrub and Tree Spray with two witheld active ingredients for trade secret reasons so I'm thinking that it probably is the same active ingredients. The difference would be in the carrier used. I posted a question on the veterinary information network and the Bayer technical support person said that he didn't recommend using this spray because it had a different carrier than Advantage that was not researched in dogs. Might just be their way of protecting themselves from liability or loss of Advantage sales. Either way it is good to get more numbers here in our own research and any reports of side effects posted here. I'm a big believer in clinical studies on live dogs in real situations.

Please continue to post your experiences with this product and any side effects you may have noticed. Let us know of the effectiveness also against both fleas and ticks and any cases where ticks have still been found. I'm particularly interested in any cases where people were seeing alot of ticks and now after using the Bayer Shrub and Tree spray are no longer seeing any.

As far as application goes, I'd recommend spraying the product into a syringe to see how much product comes out with each full spray. Then figure out based on the dogs weight how many "pumps" to apply. I'd work the dogs hair backwards while spraying onto the skin and reapplying after bathing or monthly. You can also apply a light application weekly if needed in bad flea infestations. The other route is to use a syringe and place the product in about 4 different areas on the back by parting the hair and applying it to the skin. For a big dog that would be about 4 cc to each area, back of neck, top of shoulder, middle back, and just ahead of the base of the tail. The base of the tail is one of the most important areas for fleas and the head area is one of the most important for ticks.

Look forward to hearing more reports here. Especially the effectiveness against ticks.

Allen

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06-22-2007 04:22 PM

rowdyhound
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Posts: 1600

Does this work good as a kennel and yard spray?

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06-25-2007 05:30 PM

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longshot
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I have had it on my dogs for 8 days now and have no fleas or ticks. I have been hunting 3 times since i used it and would think they would have picked up some ticks but dont see any so far. I dont know how long it will last, but will keep you posted. I cannot see any side effects in my dogs. I will not go as far as reccomending it to people because it is not labeld for dogs, but it does seem to be working.
As for the kennel and yard spay, i suppose it would work there also, but I have not tryed that yet. There may be better products for that purpose. One thing about kennels and yards is,, if you can control the flea / tick problem on dogs themselves, you will notice very few around the kennel because of nothing to feed on.
I am curious also about how well this product will keep repeling ticks, but so far so good.......

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06-25-2007 07:02 PM

bandithunter
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Been using the Bayer stuff all summer, no fleas or ticks on the hounds. Did find two or three ticks on my wifes lab but she runs loose 24/7.

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06-25-2007 08:09 PM

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rowdyhound
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Posts: 1600

I got some of the Bayer Complete Insect Killer yesterday to spray my yard and kennels. Fleas probably wouldn't be such a problem BUT my neighbor has a whole herd of cats and doesn't spray for fleas at all. Will let ya'll know if this Insect Killer works good. Jessica

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06-25-2007 08:51 PM