Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Alabama
Posts: 691

I've got a 5 year old that's almost silent on track!
Most of the time you want hear him until he located! Is this a traits that's common in redbone hounds?

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Registered: May 2005
Location: oklahoma
Posts: 5035

I DONT KNOW WHY BUT IT IS POPING UP MORE AND MORE IN REDS, NORMALY I WOULD SAY IYS NOT A TRAIT

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4TH PLACE R.Q.E 2010
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WENT TO 2010 WORLD HUNT
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Registered: Sep 2014
Location: Moline Illinois
Posts: 407

I have seen that trait more in redbones than in most breeds, although I have seen plenty of tight mouthed blueticks too.

Best redbone I had was semi silent... and should caught lots on the ground. She would also tree them up little 10 foot saplings. The coon didnt know she was coming until she was on their tail, and the grabbed the closest tree!

I didnt mind it that she was tight mouthed because that was the only "fault". She was a 1st tree dog no matter who she hunted against

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Dave Miller
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NtCh Miller's Alone Again Hannah

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Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

I would say of the 10 best redbones I have hunted with over the past 3-4 years...about 50% were what I would call tight mouth. It didn't hurt them as much in competition because they were independent, accurate, and always first tree dogs....but I prefer an open mouth dog that strikes honestly. We ought to be mindful of how prevalent it's becoming and try to breed for more balance in our dogs. In competition....if your not getting a good strike...it's going to cost you some cast wins...

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Shane Maxey
Proud lifetime member of the NRA
Banshee Wildlife Products
Hoosier Outlaw / Moonlight Redbones
1994 American Redbone Coonhound Association Hunter of the Year
My first 3 redbones raised from pup's were:
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Billy the Kid
Dual Gr.Ch.- PKC Ch. Outlaw Timber Girl
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Scarlett Fever
(((( Current Favorites ))))
2013 AKC Ladies World Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch.- PKC Ch- AKC Ladies World Ch Ky Moonlight Breanna
Gr.Nt.Ch. - PKC Ch. Ky Moonlight Woody
Dual Grand Moonlight Deana
Dual Grand Ch.- PKC Ch. Moonlight AfterShock
Dual Grand Nighty Night Amber
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Big Time Britt
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Billy Jean
Gr.Nt.Ch-PKC Ch.-2015 PKC Red Days Champ Outlaw Cherry Bomb
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Breeze
Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man (over $20.000 won in PKC & CHKC) 2019 Southern Redbone Days Overall Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Mac
Gr.Nt.Ch. Classy Cali (Heavy Outlaw bred)
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Cat Scratch Fever
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Addiction
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Overdose
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Jinx
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Banshee
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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: East central Illinois.
Posts: 1701

It seems pretty common to me and has been for a long time. Some lines open up better than the dog you describe, but Reds seem tighter than the more popular breeds. I've tried to breed or buy balance. I'm tired of 3rd and fourth strike.

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Darrin Gher
Elbridge Redbones
Home of
GRNTCH PR' Steve-O and Chili's Red Flow
NTCH PR' Twisters Musical Red Huey DNA-VIP Perf Sire 06'07 Deceased 11/07
Former Home of
NTCH 'PR' Swann's Lonesome Red Music/ Kitty
NTCH. CH PR' SawBlade Red Reckon
NTCH. CH PR' Gher's Timber Mt. Brandy
Breeder of
GRNTCH PR' Daugherty's Red BUBBA
NTCH CH PR' BA'S Tree Top Rockin Griddle
NTCH PR' Lickcreek Backwoods Lil Red Annie

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

I wonder where all of those tight mouth Redbones are coming from?

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Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Alabama
Posts: 691

The sire of my male is the red rocker, thay say he gives good mouth on track!?

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Jesus saves!

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

Who is your dog's mother out of?

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Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Alabama
Posts: 691

quote:

---

Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Who is your dog's mother out of?

---

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Jesus saves!

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

When you are wondering where a certain trait came from you can't just look at the sires. You have to look at the whole pedigree.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: East central Illinois.
Posts: 1701

Some breeders way back most likely bred bird dog in them. Irish setter maybe? I've seen it show up out of several lines over the years.
Some folks like it, some don't. Some that don't like it, have line bred the trait and didn't know it was there. It's been around a long time and won't go away any time soon.
I had a real good female back in the 80's, she opened good until she was 2 years old, then she just got tight. She was line bred on a popular dog (Great dog from the 70's). In talking to the breeder and people very familiar with that cross, found out her litter mates were tight too. The females Sire and Dam were good open mouth dogs. The breeder and people close to this line were very surprised that this cross produced tight mouth dogs.
Tight mouth dogs stay out of trouble and tree a lot of coon, so I expect the trait to hang around for many years to come.
Again I don't like it.

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Darrin Gher
Elbridge Redbones
Home of
GRNTCH PR' Steve-O and Chili's Red Flow
NTCH PR' Twisters Musical Red Huey DNA-VIP Perf Sire 06'07 Deceased 11/07
Former Home of
NTCH 'PR' Swann's Lonesome Red Music/ Kitty
NTCH. CH PR' SawBlade Red Reckon
NTCH. CH PR' Gher's Timber Mt. Brandy
Breeder of
GRNTCH PR' Daugherty's Red BUBBA
NTCH CH PR' BA'S Tree Top Rockin Griddle
NTCH PR' Lickcreek Backwoods Lil Red Annie

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2971

I HAVE HUNTED SOME TIGHT MOUTH DOGS IN THE PAST AND I WAS PLAYING CATCH UP FROM THE START,AND WHEN YOU ARE IN THIN COON COUNTRY IT IS HARD TO WIN WITH THEM CONSISTANTLY,1ST STRIKE WILL HAVE YOU IN THE LEAD FROM THE START,I TRY TO BREED FOR A QUICK STRIKE OPEN MOUTH TRACK DOG,THIS IS SOMETHING WE ARE GOING TO HAVE BREED FOR TO GET UP WITH THE WALKERS.

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Registered: Sep 2010
Location: Jefferson,Tx
Posts: 1108

A tight mouth loaner normally wins it's fair share, I don't really care to know every step the coon has made, I want to know where it's at 😉

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Tony Dominguez
407 E. Clarksville st
Jefferson, Tx 75657
903-650-4495 call/txt anytime
Banshee Coon Squaller
Eukanuba Dog food



Redbone:
All Grand Outlaw G-Man
GRNITECH
GRAND SHOW CH
CHKC GRCH (all time $ leader)
PKC PLATINUM CH (all time $ leader)
2016 RESERVE FALL SUPER STAKE CH (only redbone to ever make the final 4)


Grnitech PKC CH Night Stalkin roxie
2018 top 16 PKC redbone breed
2018 Top 16 PA state race
2019 National Redbone days Champion


Walker:
UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Frost Bite Zoey

UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Dirty Little Tramp
Russ Myer hunt winner $20,000
Final 4 PKC super stakes


Past:
GOLD CH GRCH GRNITECH Classy Cali
GRCH GRNITECH 'PR' Outlaw Jack
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Apache Man
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Famous Outlaw Ann
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Tree Burning Moses

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Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Western NC
Posts: 1529

Not sure how tight mouth equates to low end strike, IF you're in a pack of honest strike dogs. I've seen dogs open at first scent that only give another notice 100 yards in.

If I know the dog is tight but honest, I strike em, despite if I'm within a minute or 30 seconds or whatever. Or, I'll strike when they stump a toe and squeal, whichever comes first 😉.

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Registered: Dec 2016
Location: Darkside
Posts: 42

I went 2 red bone days in Michigan last year and they was not any tight mouth red dogs in the 2 cast I was in, lol the walker dogs was getting last strike all night, babbling off the chain and rip and run till you come a cross a coon or something that put track down and tree about a mile from turn loose,,

My ? Is , are they all chop soundtrack dogs ?

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Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

Don't you know that is the new style of Redbone comp dogs, first strike and first tree.

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Registered: Dec 2016
Location: Darkside
Posts: 42

That is exactly what I was told that night also, lol

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Dogs will be dogs

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Registered: Jul 2008
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2971

A LOT OF DOGS ARE MADE TIGHT MOUTH WITH SHOCK COLLARS,THE DOG FIGURES OUT IF HE DON'T OPEN HE WANT GET SHOCKED,I HAVE SEEN DOGS THAT WANT OPEN ON THE GROUND RUN JUNK WITH DOGS THAT OPEN,THEY WASN'T BROKE FROM RUNNING JUNK,JUST BROKE FROM OPENING ON IT,THE GARMIN WILL SHOW HIM RUNNING THE TRACK WITH THE DOG OPENING,BEFORE GARMINS CAME ALONG I THOUGHT THESE DOGS WERE BROKE OFF JUNK.

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Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1867

I just like a winner. Ole Timber Chopper was tight mouthed but he treed a pile of coon in short time and managed to win a bunch of hunts and place in the top 10 of the ACHA World Hunt. Cali is tight mouthed and she's done her share of winning against the Holstein world. She is a fast hunter and ambushes coon. G-Man''s not a first strike dog neither and he's one of the top money earners in the last year. He's independent and doesn't draw much minus. My Brandy beat more big name dogs in the 90s than any dog I know and she was not a first strike dog neither. She was a fast hunter and sneaky with good accuracy. She could tree a pile of coon in short time or get you that one coon on a tough night. Timber Jack was fast on both ends, but he didn't open up much once he struck the track and got it moving. He ran to catch. The hotter the track got the quieter he got. The key is speed, brains/accuracy, and staying put/ not drawing minus points. Even in the big money hunts dogs are leaving trees and slick treeing. Tight mouthed dogs will generally tree more coon on the outside. They also tend to be better pressure tree dogs as a rule and get into less trouble.

My Cat female that is winning right now is the exact opposite. I think she's got Moonlight Kate 4x up close so she tells you exactly where she's at all the time from the dog box to the tree. She will commonly come in with nothing but 1sr and 1st on everything which can either be really good or really bad. Tonight she had 200 on a den , 200 on a coon and 200 on a slick where the coon was one tree over. Never a dull moment with her. I like them all , but I'd really like to have another one that opened fast and honest and then ran to catch. Those are hard to find.

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Dr. Allen Hallada (Doc Halladay)

Current:

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Cat Scratch Fever
(Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Aftershock x Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Breanna)
2016 Finished to PKC Ch. in one week!

Dual Grand Champion CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Glissens JJ Jr. x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Billy Jean)
4 Generations of All Grand Nite Champions!
Timber Jack 3X and Timber Chopper over 30X
2019 Southern National Redbone Days Champion
2016 National Grand Nite Champion Redbone
2016 CHKC Redbone Days Champion
2016 PKC Super Stakes Reserve Champion
2016 CHKC Elite Shootout Winner - Texas
CHKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

Bodacious
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch.PKC. Gold Ch.CHKC CH. Outlaw G-Man x Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. Classy Cali)


Past:
Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch. Dawns Timber Jack
1988 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner
1989 UKC World Champion Redbone
1989 Purina Outstanding Redbone Coonhound
#2 Historic Redbone Sire/ Top 20 All Breeds
American Redbone Coonhound Assoc. Hall of Fame

Gr.Nt.Ch. Bussrow Bottom Brandy II
1991 American Redbone Days Champion
1992 AKC World Champion Redbone
1992 ACHA World Champion Redbone
1992 Wisconsin State Champion
1994 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex
Produced 2 Nt. Ch. , 1 Gr.Nt.Ch. out of 2 litters and two Redbone Days Winners

Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. PKC Gold Ch. Layton's Classy Cali
2012 UKC World Champion Redbone and 7th Place Overall
2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 UKC World Champion Redbone Female
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - Goodsprings, AL
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Series Race - 3rd Place Overall
2016 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - New Albany, MS
2016 PKC Texas State Race Winner
2016 PKC Redbone Breed Race Winner
PKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Coffman's Smokin Red Buck
2016 UKC World Hunt 5th Place and World Champion Redbone
2016 National Redbone Days Overall Winner

Gr.Nt.Ch. Reinhart's Central Page
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Brandy II)

Gr.Nt.Ch. Too the Maxx
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Jenkins Crying Katie)
1992 National Redbone Days Champion

Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Ambraw River Rock
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Hersh's Huntin Red Kate)
1992 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex

Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle
1986 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner

Nt.Ch. Timber Mace
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack X Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle)
Mother of Gr.Nt.Ch. Babb's Hazel

Nt. Ch. Timber Shock
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Jessie)

Gr. Ch. Nt. Ch. Squaw Mountain Goldie
(Direct Daughter of Gr.Nt.Ch.Smokey Mountain Brandy)
1990 Autumn Oaks Best of Show Winner
1988 Indiana State Champion

Last edited by ahallada on 01-06-2017 at 03:52 PM

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Radford, Virginia
Posts: 2748

I've seen a few that were tight mouthed. Most I've seen were open on track. My old haze dog was a 3rd or 4 th strike dog not because he was tight but he wouldn't open until the track was moving. So even though he stuck later, when he did strike he was typically ahead of the other dogs and got a lot of first trees. But once he was struck, he was very open on the track. Even on a cold track the eight minutes would not get him. I think some reds that don't strike fast may be like this and not open til they get the track moving in the right direction, then they open just fine. Jmo

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GRNTCH GRCH 'PR' Soggy Bottom The Frog Dawg (current reproducers list)
NTCH CH Soggy Bottom The Bull Dawg
Soggy Bottom T-Top Miss Dottie
RIP
GRNTCH GRCH Soggy Bottom T-Top Haze HTX (Former#1 Reproducer)
CH Soggy Bottom T-Top Stella
GRNTCH GRCH Soggy Bottom T-Top Shadow
NTCH CH Soggy Bottom Bomber's Red Wire (Pigeon- former #1 Reproducer)
NTCH GRCH Red Cedar T-Top Lexus
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Registered: Nov 2011
Location: Alabama
Posts: 691

My redbone male is 95% silent on track! He will not make a sound, until he locates at the tree!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1589

it's pretty darn hard to beat an honest first strike dog that can move a track and stay treed. Silent dogs win only one way, because their owners pitch them in and argue that they struck. Otherwise they should be scratched for being silent. You can't win if your scratched. "not my rule but UKC's"

I wish they would just change it so if a dog strikes in the same place it trees than there is a line thru the strike points. You get tree only. This would change many a breeders mind on what traits to breed to.

If you have put a title on a dog that is truly silent ,you are a cheat.

Babblers should take their minus and have to follow the rules accordingly also.

__________________
Sawblade Kennels/owner Kelly Hyde

Proud Breeder of the following dogs
GrNiteCh Sawblade Fiddle "no.5 historical female
QuadGrCh Yellow River Red Blaze
GrNiteCh Copeland's Red Hot Clyde
GrNiteCh Stone's Midnight Red Jake
NiteCh Brights Choctaw Night Time Sissy
NiteCh Sawblade Red Reckon
NiteCh Brasee Red Penny
NiteCh Nacalus Mandolin
Yellow River Fiddle II " good reproducer"
NiteCh Krasa Sawblade Quikstuf Bone
GrNiteCh Krasa Hair Trigger Hope
GrNiteCH Locked and Loaded Jake
GrNiteCh Moonlight Woody
NiteCh Sawblade Mac Truck " Jake and Hopes' brother"
NiteCh After Dark Spark " brother to Fiddle"
NiteCh Morgan's Boone " sister to Fiddle"
NiteCh High Water June " out of Reckon"
NiteCh Sawblade Timberline Rusty
Sawblade Ribbon,


They are bred with heart and drive included.

From a small kennel with Big results.

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Registered: Sep 2010
Location: Jefferson,Tx
Posts: 1108

That's incorrect, about having to pitch a tight mouth dog to win, but I agree with a honest 1st strike dog that stays treed is hard to beat, but there is very few of them. I don't agree with a dog striking a track, another dog falling trees with a lay up deep through the country, the dog that struck for 100 drop its track, covers 4 minutes late, & gets to tree for 75...

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Tony Dominguez
407 E. Clarksville st
Jefferson, Tx 75657
903-650-4495 call/txt anytime
Banshee Coon Squaller
Eukanuba Dog food



Redbone:
All Grand Outlaw G-Man
GRNITECH
GRAND SHOW CH
CHKC GRCH (all time $ leader)
PKC PLATINUM CH (all time $ leader)
2016 RESERVE FALL SUPER STAKE CH (only redbone to ever make the final 4)


Grnitech PKC CH Night Stalkin roxie
2018 top 16 PKC redbone breed
2018 Top 16 PA state race
2019 National Redbone days Champion


Walker:
UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Frost Bite Zoey

UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Dirty Little Tramp
Russ Myer hunt winner $20,000
Final 4 PKC super stakes


Past:
GOLD CH GRCH GRNITECH Classy Cali
GRCH GRNITECH 'PR' Outlaw Jack
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Apache Man
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Famous Outlaw Ann
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Tree Burning Moses

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Registered: Nov 2015
Location: st. augustine Fl
Posts: 311

Never had a problem with a tight mouth dog until she caught one on the ground then it seemed she always tried to catch it on the ground . Was a hard tree dog chop on tree and use to use plenty of mouth every breath she was 3 before i ever started her but a sure nuff kill dog and the only thing i could think of that caused it . Win or lose I'm in it for the sound of the race pleasure or comp .

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1589

Tony, I said silent dogs get pitched. Is silent the same as tight mouthed. If so than I stand by my statement. If not than we are talking about to different things. You tell me is it the same.

__________________
Sawblade Kennels/owner Kelly Hyde

Proud Breeder of the following dogs
GrNiteCh Sawblade Fiddle "no.5 historical female
QuadGrCh Yellow River Red Blaze
GrNiteCh Copeland's Red Hot Clyde
GrNiteCh Stone's Midnight Red Jake
NiteCh Brights Choctaw Night Time Sissy
NiteCh Sawblade Red Reckon
NiteCh Brasee Red Penny
NiteCh Nacalus Mandolin
Yellow River Fiddle II " good reproducer"
NiteCh Krasa Sawblade Quikstuf Bone
GrNiteCh Krasa Hair Trigger Hope
GrNiteCH Locked and Loaded Jake
GrNiteCh Moonlight Woody
NiteCh Sawblade Mac Truck " Jake and Hopes' brother"
NiteCh After Dark Spark " brother to Fiddle"
NiteCh Morgan's Boone " sister to Fiddle"
NiteCh High Water June " out of Reckon"
NiteCh Sawblade Timberline Rusty
Sawblade Ribbon,


They are bred with heart and drive included.

From a small kennel with Big results.

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