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Hoosier Outlaw
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

Popsicle pups

Is it a coincidence that there have been three redbone days hunts so far this year UKC, PKC, and CHKC and all three were won by Pups produced by decades old frozen semen?
Is it a coincidence that a frozen semen pup won National Redbone days in 2011 and another won PKC Redbone Days in 2015 and several others have won hi opp sex at other redbone days and placed in the top twenty of world championships....all tracing back to the same Outlaw Foundation Female?
Is it a coincidence that these latest three redbone days overall champions were sired by semen that came from two well known Outlaw Redbone studs (Dual Grand Ch. Outlaw Billy The Kid and Dual Grand Ch. Outlaw Jesse James Jr.)...who both trace back to this same Outlaw Foundation Female?
Didnt a wise old hippie once post on this forum the question..."Why go backwards and breed to 20 year old frozen semen?"
Maybe coincidence is the wrong word...maybe a pattern emerging would be a more accurate term.
Whatever it is...popsicle pups have earned their keep and the future looks bright for the redbone breed

__________________
Shane Maxey
Proud lifetime member of the NRA
Banshee Wildlife Products
Hoosier Outlaw / Moonlight Redbones
1994 American Redbone Coonhound Association Hunter of the Year
My first 3 redbones raised from pup's were:
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Billy the Kid
Dual Gr.Ch.- PKC Ch. Outlaw Timber Girl
Dual Gr.Ch. Outlaw Scarlett Fever
(((( Current Favorites ))))
2013 AKC Ladies World Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch.- PKC Ch- AKC Ladies World Ch Ky Moonlight Breanna
Gr.Nt.Ch. - PKC Ch. Ky Moonlight Woody
Dual Grand Moonlight Deana
Dual Grand Ch.- PKC Ch. Moonlight AfterShock
Dual Grand Nighty Night Amber
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Big Time Britt
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Billy Jean
Gr.Nt.Ch-PKC Ch.-2015 PKC Red Days Champ Outlaw Cherry Bomb
Gr.Nt.Ch Outlaw Breeze
Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man (over $20.000 won in PKC & CHKC) 2019 Southern Redbone Days Overall Champion
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Mac
Gr.Nt.Ch. Classy Cali (Heavy Outlaw bred)
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Cat Scratch Fever
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Addiction
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Overdose
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Jinx
Gr.Nt.Ch. Moonlight Banshee
"Always outnumbered...Never outgunned!"
To enjoy lots of pics and videos of out redbones, find me on Facebook
as Shenandoah Maxey

Last edited by Hoosier Outlaw on 03-12-2016 at 09:45 PM

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03-12-2016 06:40 PM

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Richard Lambert
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Aug 2004
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 22586

Oh my goodness.... I see a "pattern emerging".

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03-12-2016 06:42 PM

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ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1867

Is it a coincidence that my handler can't get back to the club in time to make deadline?

Is it a coincidence that every Redbone winner of every major hunt in the last year goes back to a foundation stud named Timber Jack? Yep every single one!

Oh ya that is so far back though it is gone now. haha

Love those Popsicle babies though bud. What a difference it will make on this breed!

__________________
Dr. Allen Hallada (Doc Halladay)

Current:

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Cat Scratch Fever
(Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Aftershock x Gr.Nt.Ch. PKC Ch. Moonlight Outlaw Breanna)
2016 Finished to PKC Ch. in one week!

Dual Grand Champion CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. All Grand Outlaw G-Man
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Glissens JJ Jr. x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Billy Jean)
4 Generations of All Grand Nite Champions!
Timber Jack 3X and Timber Chopper over 30X
2019 Southern National Redbone Days Champion
2016 National Grand Nite Champion Redbone
2016 CHKC Redbone Days Champion
2016 PKC Super Stakes Reserve Champion
2016 CHKC Elite Shootout Winner - Texas
CHKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

Bodacious
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Gr.Ch.PKC. Gold Ch.CHKC CH. Outlaw G-Man x Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. CHKC Ch., PKC Gold Ch. Classy Cali)

Past:
Gr.Nt.Ch.Ch. Dawns Timber Jack
1988 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner
1989 UKC World Champion Redbone
1989 Purina Outstanding Redbone Coonhound
#2 Historic Redbone Sire/ Top 20 All Breeds
American Redbone Coonhound Assoc. Hall of Fame

Gr.Nt.Ch. Bussrow Bottom Brandy II
1991 American Redbone Days Champion
1992 AKC World Champion Redbone
1992 ACHA World Champion Redbone
1992 Wisconsin State Champion
1994 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex
Produced 2 Nt. Ch. , 1 Gr.Nt.Ch. out of 2 litters and two Redbone Days Winners

Gr.Nt.Ch.Gr.Ch. PKC Gold Ch. Layton's Classy Cali
2012 UKC World Champion Redbone and 7th Place Overall
2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 UKC World Champion Redbone Female
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - Goodsprings, AL
2015 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Series Race - 3rd Place Overall
2016 PKC Blue Ribbon Pro Hunt Winner - New Albany, MS
2016 PKC Texas State Race Winner
2016 PKC Redbone Breed Race Winner
PKC All Time Money Winning Redbone

PKC Ch. Gr.Nt.Ch. Coffman's Smokin Red Buck
2016 UKC World Hunt 5th Place and World Champion Redbone
2016 National Redbone Days Overall Winner

Gr.Nt.Ch. Reinhart's Central Page
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Brandy II)

Gr.Nt.Ch. Too the Maxx
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Jenkins Crying Katie)
1992 National Redbone Days Champion

Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Ambraw River Rock
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack x Gr.Ch.Nt.Ch. Hersh's Huntin Red Kate)
1992 US Redbone Days Opposite Sex

Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle
1986 American Redbone Days All Red Hunt Winner

Nt.Ch. Timber Mace
(Gr.Nt.Ch. Timber Jack X Nt.Ch. Tree Bustin Annabelle)
Mother of Gr.Nt.Ch. Babb's Hazel

Nt. Ch. Timber Shock
(Gr.Nt.Ch.Timber Jack x Gr.Nt.Ch. Outlaw Jessie)

Gr. Ch. Nt. Ch. Squaw Mountain Goldie
(Direct Daughter of Gr.Nt.Ch.Smokey Mountain Brandy)
1990 Autumn Oaks Best of Show Winner
1988 Indiana State Champion

Last edited by ahallada on 03-12-2016 at 07:10 PM

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03-12-2016 07:06 PM

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kasey dooly
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: minden, la
Posts: 622

Congrats guys on yalls accomplishments, yall have a long list of wins and that is great. Im not here to bash people, I wish I could've been there this weekend but circumstances wouldn't allow it. But since yall have brought it to everyones attention, the missing the deadline thing just seemed like a business move in my book! I wasn't there, just looking from the outside in. No disrespect intended, just giving my opinion. Again, congrats, yall have done your homework and it seems to be paying off.

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03-12-2016 09:26 PM

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Hoosier Outlaw
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

Thanks Kasey.
Trust me...I was on the phone with Tony and Allen last night when Tony was trying to get back....him not making the deadline was not what they wanted. Cali has some age on her and it would have been better for her not to get worn down possibly hunting all week at the world hunt. They would have much rather had her in for friday and hunted the young gun all week. Tony helped Billy round up crow after the hunt and it made him miss the deadline...thats all there was to it.

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03-12-2016 09:36 PM

Hoosier Outlaw
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

quote:
Originally posted by Richard Lambert
Oh my goodness.... I see a "pattern emerging".

Is it a coincidence that none of these winners were cage trained?
Hmmm...I see another pattern emerging here also....

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03-12-2016 09:41 PM

Tony Dominguez
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2010
Location: Jefferson,Tx
Posts: 1108

quote:
Originally posted by kasey dooly
Congrats guys on yalls accomplishments, yall have a long list of wins and that is great. Im not here to bash people, I wish I could've been there this weekend but circumstances wouldn't allow it. But since yall have brought it to everyones attention, the missing the deadline thing just seemed like a business move in my book! I wasn't there, just looking from the outside in. No disrespect intended, just giving my opinion. Again, congrats, yall have done your homework and it seems to be paying off.

Honest to god truth, we wanted Cali to rest all week & not have to hunt. I got a ear full from Allen on the way back to the club... I felt it was right staying out with Billy Stark to get crow, deadline never crossed my mind. I'd much rather have 1 in the semi finals that I have tuned up then 1 that's been breeding the last month.

__________________
Tony Dominguez
407 E. Clarksville st
Jefferson, Tx 75657
903-650-4495 call/txt anytime
Banshee Coon Squaller
Eukanuba Dog food

Redbone:
All Grand Outlaw G-Man
GRNITECH
GRAND SHOW CH
CHKC GRCH (all time $ leader)
PKC PLATINUM CH (all time $ leader)
2016 RESERVE FALL SUPER STAKE CH (only redbone to ever make the final 4)

Grnitech PKC CH Night Stalkin roxie
2018 top 16 PKC redbone breed
2018 Top 16 PA state race
2019 National Redbone days Champion

Walker:
UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Frost Bite Zoey

UKC Dual Grand, PKC Silver Ch, CHKC Champion
Dirty Little Tramp
Russ Myer hunt winner $20,000
Final 4 PKC super stakes

Past:
GOLD CH GRCH GRNITECH Classy Cali
GRCH GRNITECH 'PR' Outlaw Jack
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Apache Man
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Famous Outlaw Ann
CH GRNITECH 'PR' Tree Burning Moses

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03-12-2016 10:03 PM

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kasey dooly
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Nov 2011
Location: minden, la
Posts: 622

I talked to Randy Clark earlier and he said it was all legit. I was just saying how it looked to everyone that wasn't there. No disrespect intended. I should have been there and I could of seen for myself. Congrats again. But don't get used to it! I got a few things coming for yall! BOOK EM DANNO!

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03-12-2016 10:41 PM

Hoosier Outlaw
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

quote:
Originally posted by kasey dooly
I talked to Randy Clark earlier and he said it was all legit. I was just saying how it looked to everyone that wasn't there. No disrespect intended. I should have been there and I could of seen for myself. Congrats again. But don't get used to it! I got a few things coming for yall! BOOK EM DANNO!

Competition is good!
We need all the good redbones we can get out there winning. Hope to see you there next year buddy.

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03-12-2016 10:51 PM

ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1867

The story I got was that Crow smoked some good dogs on a coon so bad that Tony's tongue was hanging out and he wet his pants. Billy had to pry Tony's hands off Crows leash after the hunt was over. I think he just forgot about the deadline. Lol

This whole week we were focused on getting Cali in the semi finals. G-Man hasn't been hunted much and not where he needs to be for a big hunt. I've hunted with him when he's been semi tuned and he definitely has the capability. If everything goes as planned he's going to get the hair hunted off him in the next two months and be back in big hunt shape. He's never really been pushed that hard because of his age , but I have a good feeling there is a lot under that hood from what I've seen so far. Really looking forward to seeing what he's got in the next 2-3 years.

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03-13-2016 12:22 AM

Barnyard
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Goshen In.
Posts: 693

I was witness to all of it!

On behalf of Billy & I, I got out of a mtg in Ill. Fri afternoon & drove as fast as I could to make it there! Crow was "MIA"! at the end of the hunt & Tony hoofed in with him to get the dog! I never heard a word about the deadline from anyone! Win, loose, or draw, Tony showed "Class" going with Billy! Billy is afraid of the dark you know! Thanks for the help! Cali spanked us fair & square! Good Luck!

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Cell- 574-538-9431

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03-13-2016 12:43 AM

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Tony Dominguez
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Sep 2010
Location: Jefferson,Tx
Posts: 1108

Mr John I'll say it again, it was a pleasure to actually meet you & hunt with Billy & Crow, ya'll have a very nice redbone! Looking forward to the next hunt, we had a good time

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03-13-2016 12:59 AM

elvis
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dog House
Posts: 4112

Delcamp why didnt you hoof it in there with Billy?
Wait dont tell me. Someone had to stay at the truck and gaurd the donuts?

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03-14-2016 05:23 PM

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Royce Taylor
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Mar 2007
Location: Dumas, Mississippi
Posts: 194

Frozen Semen

I do agree with collecting/freezing semen. Not naturally breeding a young dog does help keep his head straight which helps them stay competitive. It also helps by getting the stud dog available to some that can't travel for live breedings. I do believe the crosses that you have made have helped the breed. As most that understand the use of frozen semen will know, it is no different than a live breeding that happened 20 + years ago to the same stud dog. So, that makes one wonder what is your change point between now and 20+ years ago? The change points that I see are; the quality of the females you are breeding AND there is some dogs in the current pedigrees that was not in the 20 + year old foundation stock. I totally agree that the quality of the females that have been bred in the past have hurt the breed however, I do believe the outcrosses that have been added in over the past 20 years is the major difference. To much focus on line breeding any particular foundation stock will cause any breed to implode.

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1997 ARCHA Hunter of the Year
Taylor�s Redbone Kennel
662-538-4763

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03-20-2016 06:04 PM

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Hoosier Outlaw
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2010
Location: Marion, Indiana
Posts: 4280

I would agree that the quality of females has improved since then.
5 of the 6 females that have been bred to BTK semen in the past 4-5 years do actually go back to BTK so they are technically line bred...but several generations separate them and there are several good reproducers added in during that separation from out crosses that were not possible to add back when Billy The Kid was alive.
Frozen semen just adds a lot of possibilities for a breeder because time is not working against you like it is with live breeding window of a stud dog.

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03-20-2016 06:21 PM

mmarshall
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Oct 2012
Location: east ohio
Posts: 1277

A top walker stud has 1000 pups off good females in his life time to make his impact on the breed a red dog is lucky to have a 100 off good females in his life time we need to breed ares for 25 30 years to get the same impact lol

__________________
mark marshall

favorits ive hunted and or owned
grnt nighty nite moonlight kate rip
grnt moonlight pepper ann
Grnt jackpot Jackie rip
grnt rocky top jet
ntch moonlight katie rip
ntch moonlight madona
ntch beaver creek blaze rip
ntch moonlights dirty danny b.rip (ntch moonlight kink x ntch sawblade reckon)
Current
Grnt moonlight ky Kate (grnt ranger x grnt moonlight Kate
Ntch Pr beaver creeks easy peezy three 1st place wins (jet x moonlight Bree)
Pr beaver creeks moonlight coon buster ( moonlight shock x moonlight Bree)

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03-20-2016 06:53 PM

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ahallada
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Dec 2006
Location: California
Posts: 1867

Many of the top reproducing females today are the result of heavy line breeding in the past and I agree with Royce, there are a lot of really well bred females today compared to what we had 20 years ago. Some of these females are like genetic popcorn poppers. Kate was a good example of that having Timber Chopper over 22x in her pedigree. No female was ever bred that concentrated from a dominant stud dog before. Now we have females that are 3x and 4x Kate and over 100x Timber Chopper. You are going to consistently get a higher percentage of pups turning out from these females. They may not all make big time hunt winners, but they will make tree dogs and they will help any stud dog on that reproducers list.

What I'm more concerned with is who is going to consistently produce big hunt winners. BTK popsicles are doing a pretty good job of that lately.

Mark you are right. I was looking at the PAD of some of the big time Walker dogs and dogs like Nailor had over 3000 pups registered. That is 10 x the number of pups Timber Jack reproduced. I can only imagine where that would have put him. I can think of a few Redbones that had over 1000 pups on the ground but I can't tell you very many big time winners they produced. This breed is on the right track now.

Last edited by ahallada on 03-21-2016 at 04:19 PM

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03-21-2016 04:14 PM

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