Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Western Pa
Posts: 2106

I'm seeing a few dogs dying in the heat and it causes me to ponder. Years back I observed heat prostration in a police working dog. The heat wasn't extreme, but, quite humid at the time. Fortunately, we had a vet on the training grounds and the dog was quickly hydrated through IV. Later examination by the vet it was discovered that the dog at some point had heat prostrated prior. The vet explained to us that when a dog heat prostrates it experiences some degree of kidney and/or liver damage....depending on how bad the dog prostrated as to how much damage the dog experienced. Damage to these organs is irreversible. The old belief is that black dogs don't shed heat like a lighter colored dog. I don't know if there is truth to this or not, but, I know that I can feel heat coming from the truck box when dogs come out of it often when it isn't really hot out. We take these dogs out in extreme conditions and I don't think we actually know what type of damage we are causing these dogs when we hunt them in these conditions. I have heard guys brag "those dogs have to hunt in this heat or they don't stay here" What kind of long term damage is being done when a dog is hunted hard in heat and humidity? We are being told now that grain based feeds can also cause this type of damage. Mix these two and and I think I can see why some of our hounds are dying at early ages of "unknown" causes..or kidney and liver failure...there is lots of it out there, folks.

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Registered: Feb 2007
Location:
Posts: 5863

IVE READ ABOUT EVERYTHING YOU POSTED ,LOTS OF GUYS THINK YOU CAN CONDITION YOUR HOUNDS TO THE HEAT ,IVE HEARD SOME SAY JUST HUNTEM HARD THEY WILL GET USE TO IT ,,,,WELL TO SOME DEGREE I THINK THEY DO GET USE TO IT,BUT GOOD COMMON SENCE TELLS ME ON SOME NIGHTS NOT TO HUNT MY DOG HIGH HEAT,HIGH HEAT INDEX AND HIGH HUMIDITY CAN EQUAL A DEAD DOG ,,SO I DONT HUNT WHEN ITS LIKE THAT...THIS WAS VERY GOOD INFO TO PASS ON MR RANDY,,,YOU HAVE A BLESSED ONE ,,AND KEEP OLE SNIPER COOL ,,IL BET HE RIDES IN THE CAB OF YOUR TRUCK IN THE AIRCONDITONING IN THIS TYPE OF WEATHER ,,,,RON

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RON MAGGART FIELDON ILLINOIS
{TEAM BIBLE THUMPER}
ALWAYS REMEMBER GOD GAVE US FRIENDS AND COONHOUNDS, " I AM A GREATLY BLESSED",HIGHLY FAVORED" " IMPERFECT BUT FORGIVEN CHILD OF GOD "KEEP YOUR {FAITH IN GOD } FAITH SEES THE INVISIBLE,BELIEVES THE INCREDIBLE,AND RECIEVES THE IMPOSSIBLE. WERE BLESSED !!

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Registered: Dec 2008
Location: tn
Posts: 3735

Im hunting everynight almost and it is awfull.hot. I been turning the dogs loose in places that are just full of creeks.Gotta keep.emin water and around it.Even with all the water im hunting in and around I still carry a 5 gallon bucket of water in the truck.

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location: wyandotte,ok
Posts: 2114

randy during the summer months i place kiddie pools in my dog pens so that they can get in them and i also take two litter pop bottles and freeze them and place them in the dog box when i go hunting this does two things it helps get the dog cool on hot nights and it also provides drinking water for my dogs as well as me. this seems to help a bunch i also have put rear vents in my dog box to help with air flow.

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shawn stovall
wyandotte, ok
shawnstovall2001@yahoo.com
918-961-2434
Home to:
Pr S&J's Shack's Backwoods Patches (walker)
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Past Home to:
dual grand stovall's black knight george (gone but not forgotten)
pr D&S' black little luke (1st and 3rd place wins) (davis black luke x paynes black june) gone but not forgotten
Dual Grand Davis' black hutch (gone but not forgotten)

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location:
Posts: 2785

Bulldoggers are the guys to look to when it comes to bridging the gap between science and reality ... and coming up with something that works.


Muscle density effects water retention , weather fronts , etc ... they say all dogs get hot .. it's getting them cooled down fast that is the trick.

Some of it is rough living , conditioning to the elements ... old timers ran foxhounds during the night AND day in the heat .

Same for men , dogs and roosters ... working out in the sun makes you tough and before long it aint so bad if you watch yourself and stay hydrated .

It would make for a great interview for the Association ...

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Western Pa
Posts: 2106

I would be interested to see what a dog's core body temperature is after treeing (hard) for just 20 minutes on an 85 degree night with 85% humidity. That's what it was at dark here last nite. I don't care what kind of conditioning you do if a dog's temp reaches a certain core temperature and is maintained for a certain period of time it will cause long term damage...even when you cool it down shortly after. You don't see the damage overnight. Could this be why some of these dogs live 6-8 years and some dogs live 10-12? Another question that arises would be: Do the owners that have dogs pass at an earlier age see decline in the dog in the year or two before passing?

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UKC GrNtCh PKC Ch Pa HTX Sniper (Deceased) Four time qualified for World Championship
Duane and Seth Jones/Jarret Davis partners
Beaver River Kennels/Team Pa
USAF proud!!! 6 Years active 19 Reserves MSgt (ret) Raven 457
Carpe Nocturnum-Seize the night!

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location:
Posts: 2785

Joey and I were talking about this on our last hunt ... Achilla came on treeing on her own right when it got hot .. and I pushed her hard in the daytime and night and she had such will to finish a track when other dogs gave up or sat at the tree panting while she barked .. that I couldn't pull her off and not let her finish.

I've pushed her hard like that her whole life and she just turned six and it's starting to show .. in small ways , but it's there.

They say heat , wormer and stress damages chromosomes ... and they are what determine the quality of the dna passed on to pups and other daily functions ... so yeah , it's something to think about.

Next young dog I get , if ever .. that has that kind of will ... I might not be so hard on .... but probably i will , lol.

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Registered: Jan 2008
Location: COONDOG COUNTRY,WELCOME TO OUR JUNGLE
Posts: 5906

THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST THREADS IVE SEEN ON ANY BOARD IN SOMETIME LOTS OF GOOD INFORMATION.

THANKS !!!!!!

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Registered: Sep 2009
Location: springfield
Posts: 488

I blame the fast growing strains of corn farmers grow today for it I quit feeding grain based feed a few years back and it helped but some individuals heat up worse than others but I have seen dogs of all colors that got heat up but I hunted a black dog not too long ago that performed better in the heat than anything I have ever followed behind in fact she earned more open event money than any other dog in pkc in the extreme heat of July last year.my pup trainer Waldo is coma and clover bred walker and he heats up worse than any I have seen.

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Registered: Jan 2008
Location: COONDOG COUNTRY,WELCOME TO OUR JUNGLE
Posts: 5906

I'VE BEEN FEEDING DOG CHOW FOR SEVERAL YRS. NOW I FEED IT ALL YR ROUND.

SEEMS IF I TRYED TO FEED A DOG THAT IM HUNTING HARD ON PRO PLAN OR PURNIA ONE THEY GET HEATED UP ON WARM NIGHTS.

WHAT DO Y'ALL THINK IS A GOOD FEED TO FEED A DOG ?

I FORGOT I HAVE FED SOME DOG FOOD FROM SAMS CLUB CALLED EXCEED PUTS WEIGHT ON A DOG BETTER THAN ANYTHING I'VE EVER FED IN 45+ YRS. BUT I'VE ONLY FED IT IN THE WINTER WHILE HUNTING A DOG.

JUST WONDER WHAT SOME OF Y'ALL ARE FEEDING I GOT ME A NICE YOUNG BLACK DOG @ THE END OF LASTYEAR OR HES NICE FOR HIS AGE.

THANKS FOR ANY REPLYS !

ED TERRY

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EDDIE TERRY & NETTA 1-765-774-3301


***WE HAVE STARTED DOGS TIME TO TIME FORSALE. THANKS FOR LOOKING***

***HOME OF WHERE COONDOGS & TREEDOGS ARE BORN NOT MAN MADE***

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********(((One More Little Dump Kennel = Daylight)))********

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!********* I THANK GOD FOR EVERYDAY I'M LIVING & MY 2nd CHANCE ON LIFE *********!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Registered: Feb 2007
Location:
Posts: 5863

THERES A LOT OF GOOD FEEDS OUT THERE ,SOME DOGS DO BETTER ON SOME BRANDS THAN OTHERS ,,A LOT OF HOW THE DOGS USE IT IS THE INDIVIDUAL DOGS MOTABILIZUM AND HOW THERE SYSTEM PROCESSES IT .....IM GLAD TOO THAT YA HAVE JESUS CHRIST IN YOUR LIFE GODS A GOD OF MANY SECOND CHANCES !!!! HAVE A BLESSED ONE ED FROM THE RIVERBOTTOM,,,RON

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RON MAGGART FIELDON ILLINOIS
{TEAM BIBLE THUMPER}
ALWAYS REMEMBER GOD GAVE US FRIENDS AND COONHOUNDS, " I AM A GREATLY BLESSED",HIGHLY FAVORED" " IMPERFECT BUT FORGIVEN CHILD OF GOD "KEEP YOUR {FAITH IN GOD } FAITH SEES THE INVISIBLE,BELIEVES THE INCREDIBLE,AND RECIEVES THE IMPOSSIBLE. WERE BLESSED !!

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Registered: Oct 2006
Location: Pleasant Plain OHIO
Posts: 1291

July and August are two months I personally don't care to hunt in ,
I build fence all day long and cant stand the heat , also my dogs tree real poorly in the heat , and the mesquites are crazy for me , and Ive seen it and heard of it dogs will fall over dead or get heat stroke , I cut my dogs food in half during the hot weather , I try and take every dog I own swimming on the weekends and they love it as much as running a coon , Thinking about it I know of 6 dogs that has went down because of the heat ,


BTW , my dogs will fetch and retrieve better than a retriever , lots of practice

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Registered: Jan 2008
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BEEN SEVERAL YRS. AGO WE WERE HUNTING IN IOWA & I SEEN A DOG JUST FALL OVER WHILE HE WAS TREEING MAN IT WAS HOT THAT NIGHT IM SURE THE HEAT HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT.

THIS SAME NIGHT A HAWK FLYS DOWN ON THIS GUYS HEAD WHILE HE WAS USEING HIS COON SQUALLER, NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE IT HE COULD'NT GET IT TO GO AWAY IT WAS ON THE ATTACK HIS NAME WAS JOHN FOUST HE WAS A BIG TIME WALKER MAN BACK IN HIS DAY.

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EDDIE TERRY & NETTA 1-765-774-3301


***WE HAVE STARTED DOGS TIME TO TIME FORSALE. THANKS FOR LOOKING***

***HOME OF WHERE COONDOGS & TREEDOGS ARE BORN NOT MAN MADE***

***A PROVEN LINE OF DOGS THAT IS WORKING GREAT ON BEAR & COON & MT. LION HAVE PLENTY OF REFS. ON THEM YOU CAN CALL.***


********(((One More Little Dump Kennel = Daylight)))********

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!********* I THANK GOD FOR EVERYDAY I'M LIVING & MY 2nd CHANCE ON LIFE *********!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Lockridge Iowa
Posts: 2848

quote:

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Originally posted by In Redman Hound

I FORGOT I HAVE FED SOME DOG FOOD FROM SAMS CLUB CALLED EXCEED PUTS WEIGHT ON A DOG BETTER THAN ANYTHING I'VE EVER FED IN 45+ YRS. BUT I'VE ONLY FED IT IN THE WINTER WHILE HUNTING A DOG.


ED TERRY

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Registered: Oct 2012
Location: Noble,IL
Posts: 246

Been hunting hard here every single night since may. Been hunting 2 younger dogs we watch when they got hot we take em to get water. We did 6 drops tonite in 96 degrees. They seem to take the heat pretty well to other dogs I have hunted with. Gotta watch my young dog nute he trees exstremilly hard we don't let em tree to long. Then head to get water.

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Registered: Jan 2008
Location: COONDOG COUNTRY,WELCOME TO OUR JUNGLE
Posts: 5906

quote:

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Originally posted by berger
What size bags do they have and how much per bag. Walmart had it a few years back every once in awhile and I liked it.

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EDDIE TERRY & NETTA 1-765-774-3301


***WE HAVE STARTED DOGS TIME TO TIME FORSALE. THANKS FOR LOOKING***

***HOME OF WHERE COONDOGS & TREEDOGS ARE BORN NOT MAN MADE***

***A PROVEN LINE OF DOGS THAT IS WORKING GREAT ON BEAR & COON & MT. LION HAVE PLENTY OF REFS. ON THEM YOU CAN CALL.***


********(((One More Little Dump Kennel = Daylight)))********

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!********* I THANK GOD FOR EVERYDAY I'M LIVING & MY 2nd CHANCE ON LIFE *********!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Last edited by In Redman Hound on 07-18-2013 at 03:20 PM

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Registered: Mar 2010
Location: Montana
Posts: 17

good topic Randy. And good info. Thanks.

I too, have wondered about this heat problem in my black dogs and have talked to a lot of guys to get their ideas. There doesn't seem to be a real solid answer. But I know for sure, if anyone cares much for their dogs, they will keep a close eye on the weather conditions and hunt or not hunt accordingly.

I definitely cut their food rations in the summer and don't feed before hunting. I feed Costco's lamb and rice. I don't think it has that much corn in it.

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Western Pa
Posts: 2106

Google this - Heat Stroke in Dogs - VetInfo
Pay particualr interest to the part that mentions working retrievers in water. Conditioned dogs have experienced heat issues when water temperatures exceed 75 degrees. I think a keynote is when they mention....long term damage done. They mention when water temperatures exceed 75 degrees it isn't enough to bring a dog's core temperature down as quickly as needed. You can bet that pulling a dog off a tree and letting him drink or lay down in a creek that the water temperature isn't enough to bring that core temperature down long term damage has occurred. You aren't going to see immediate issues with your dog, but, I'm betting this is part of the issue when we see dogs pass at a fairly young age.
I had a Grand Nite that I hammered year round. He hunted as hard in heat as he did in single digits. He was the type of dog that you had to hunt down. He passed away in the kennel a couple days before his 9th birthday. I saw decline in him in the last year to a year and a half. His line of dogs generally lived beyond the age that he passed away. I wonder now if hard hunting in summer heat had something to do with his early demise.

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UKC GrNtCh PKC Ch Pa HTX Sniper (Deceased) Four time qualified for World Championship
Duane and Seth Jones/Jarret Davis partners
Beaver River Kennels/Team Pa
USAF proud!!! 6 Years active 19 Reserves MSgt (ret) Raven 457
Carpe Nocturnum-Seize the night!

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Registered: Oct 2006
Location: Pleasant Plain OHIO
Posts: 1291

Randy you cant rule that out , I was hunting one night 2 years ago with a friend Chris Saunders , BP and his dog was running in a bean field she shut up and looked at the garmin she was showing treed in the middle of the field BP was treed on the edge by now we went to her she was laying there in a convulsion , his daughter my son me and him all had water bottles pored it in her and on her got her back around , That dog never got treed again , it was like it caused brain damage in her ,, but she was over weight and out of shape ,, so if you don't hunt smart Its easy to lose a dog in the heat ,,, conditioning conditioning , and yes I'm a good computer hunter this time of year

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Registered: Sep 2003
Location: wyandotte,ok
Posts: 2114

Randy that is why i carry those frozen water bottles for. Just like in humans if you put a cool rag on either wrist or ankles, the groin area, under the arm pit area and even the back of your neck your core temp will drop quickly the reason for this that is where your some of the major arteries are located and it will cool down your blood quicker thus lowering your core temp. learned that trick while serving this great nation of ours as a medic.

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shawn stovall
wyandotte, ok
shawnstovall2001@yahoo.com
918-961-2434
Home to:
Pr S&J's Shack's Backwoods Patches (walker)
'PR' Stovall's Black Knight Wild Willy
Past Home to:
dual grand stovall's black knight george (gone but not forgotten)
pr D&S' black little luke (1st and 3rd place wins) (davis black luke x paynes black june) gone but not forgotten
Dual Grand Davis' black hutch (gone but not forgotten)

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Registered: Jun 2007
Location:
Posts: 1176

I too keep frozen bottles in the box for the dogs. I also carry ice packs to put under the arm pits and bellys. They sell small battery fans at walmart that work great in front of the dog box, plus you can put one at the back vents blowing out the hot air. I keep pure honey in the dog box to put on a dogs toung if they seem woozy. There blood pressure drops real fast and makes them weak. The honey works because it goes right to the blood stream. I put pedilite in there water also. I hunt my dogs hard leading up to hot weather and never hunt a dog in the heat that isen't already in hunt shape. I too like to swim them when it's just too humid to hunt. Plus I just built new kennels and installed mister's to keep them cool in the heat of the day. It's set on a timer and will run as long as I want it to, and shuts off on it's own if it starts raining and will start again when it stops. I run it on 6 kennels for under $75.

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