Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Roosevelt, Utah
Posts: 586

http://westinstenv.org/wibio/2010/0...ientific-fraud/

Page 3, paragraphs

"The Kaibab was established as a Forest Reserve in 1893 and in 1906 was designated as the Grand Canyon National Game Preserve by President Theodore Roosevelt. Today, the southern end of the plateau is in Grand Canyon National Park, while the rest of the area is managed by the U.S. Forest Service. When the Kaibab was declared a game preserve in 1906, hunting was prohibited and the federal government began an extensive predator control program. Between 1907 and 1923, an average of 40 mountain lions, 176 coyotes, 7 bobcats, and 1 wolf were killed each year. In all, only 30 wolves were ever killed by government agents on the Kaibab. Instead, the main predators were mountain lions and coyotes. The Forest Service also reduced the number of livestock permitted to graze the plateau.

In response to those measures, the mule deer herd irrupted from around 4,000 animals in 1906 to an estimated 100,000 head in 1924. As might be expected, the growing deer population severely overgrazed both the summer and winter ranges. This lead to a number of studies and reports, as well as a dispute between the federal government and the state of Arizona. In short, the Forest Service said that the deer herd needed to be reduced to prevent further range damage but the state refused to open the area to hunting. In response, the federal government claimed that it could kill deer on the Kaibab to protect habitat without a state permit. Needless to say, Arizona objected and the ensuing legal battle made it all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court. four and five."


I do have to redirect you to one sentence about the impact of an agressvie predator management program: "In response to those measures, the mule deer herd irrupted from around 4,000 animals in 1906 to an estimated 100,000 head in 1924." In my time as a wildlife activist I've had big game managers tell me that predators do not have a meaningful impact on the prey base and I just chuckle!

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Last edited by RunninBear(Ike) on 03-11-2011 at 04:21 PM

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Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Roosevelt, Utah
Posts: 586

As most of you know, my interests are in chasing mountain lions and bears. For the most part, my concerns regarding the deer herds are seeing that they remain healthy and provide a prey base for the game I love to chase. But to deny the impact predators have on the prey base is not living in the real world. After tons of questions, tons of public wildlife meetings, and tons of years, I view the coyote as the animal to target to help recover the mule deer and mountain lion populations in the West.

The coyote stands alone as the only predator in Utah that beefs up it's production when more game is available or if their numbers are down by having up to nine pups. If Predator management on coyotes is reduced for only a year or two their population numbers can turn around like the management effort did not happen; the same things can be said about a wolf population.

Throughout the early days the state and cattlemen poisoned coyotes, wolves and black bear and the mule deer population thrived. To me that proved the mountain lion did not have as great an impact on the prey base as did the other animals combined. But like it or not, predators do have an impact on their prey and we are in that system and have been a major predator since the beginning of time........

Ike

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Last edited by RunninBear(Ike) on 03-12-2011 at 06:52 PM

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Registered: Oct 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 10

I'm sure it does work to a certain degree. I just watched a story on nat. geo. on the coyotes killing that girl in Canada last year. There was a prof. from Univ. of Ohio that studies coyotes and he was talking how they adapt very well to their surrondings and changes in the enviroment. I would have to agree with that. I hunt them in Wis here whenever we have snow. You can kill 6 out of one block and give it time more will move in and take their spot. Just last week we had 5 yotes in one block that we had shot 3 out of earlier in the month. A farmer south of me had a trail cam set up over a den this past summer and he counted 28 deer fawns being taken back to the den. That is crazy, now add that and our deer season being open for almost a month(which is a different story). People wonder why our deer population is down. We try to put a dent in the coyote population but they come back just as strong the next year.

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Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Roosevelt, Utah
Posts: 586

Thanks for the input bz dog80, cause the coyote does have the ability to replace lost population numbers at an alarming rate. The eastern coyote is just coming into it's own, and whitetail deer populations will decrease as he inhabits their land....

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Registered: Oct 2003
Location: Montana
Posts: 95

Mange seems to be the most effective thing for coyote mangement.

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: s.c.
Posts: 6961

I really like the Zane Grey story about hunting mountain lion around the Grand Canyon. Wish I could remember the dogs name the story was about. It seems to provide a vivid description of the area-if not a fantasy.

Last edited by l.lyle on 03-14-2011 at 04:50 PM

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