Registered: Jun 2005
Location: Wahoo, Nebraska
Posts: 45

Fellas, just would like to see your opinion on this issue of treed in hole and how you could bend this rule. I tree many coon in beaver den in Nebraska. This is not unusual. I personally like my hounds to finish any track and stay. So I don't try and break them off holes.
Had an issue the other day, where 3 hounds were treed, and my hound was treed 1/2 mile + down the creek. After searching the first tree for the 10, we went to my hound, probably a good 20+ minutes to get to him, thus was barking treed for 30+ minutes. Upon getting to him , he was found to be in a hole. We were asked to handle our hound, ( please I'm not sore about this at all it was scored right ) the judge didn't think necessary to get down in the mud and we didn't care either, the coon was seen, by the handler and when pulled our hound out he brought the coon out. We were scored the 100+ for the track and no tree points and that is correct according to the rules. Could this rule be possibly looked at. The other three hunters agreed there was no doubt the hound was definitely treed, barking every breath . In a case as obvious as this, Why can't tree points be awarded? If my hound had not have pulled the coon out he would have, assuming the judge saw the coon in the hole, been awarded tree points , but beings he pulled it out before the judge saw it in the hole he lost tree points.
Was wondering if anyone else has seen this and feel this rule could be looked at in perhaps a different way.

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Registered: Aug 2009
Location: Hayden, AL
Posts: 152

The dog could not have pulled the coon out of the hole if it weren't in the hole......plus strike.....plus tree

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4927

It's not the hole rule that got you. It's the "caught coon" that got you. Coons that are caught are not eligible for having tree points scored.

As for holes, all dogs declared treed in a hole are eligible to have those tree points scored.

If dogs are not declared treed then all they have eligible for scoring is strike points.

If you want treee points for a hole, then declare the dog treed and you will get them plus/minus/or circle depending on how the hole is scored.

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Registered: Jul 2009
Location:
Posts: 330

Is it possible your dog had the coon in its mouth a couple times before you got there? Thus it would be a caught coon. If the coon was actually in a hole (AKA not being able to see it or grab it) your dog would have never been able to put it out.

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Both Allen and Todd have stated on here before that if the dog can touch the coon it is caught and tree points are deleted.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: North GA
Posts: 14388

quote:

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Originally posted by JiM
Both Allen and Todd have stated on here before that if the dog can touch the coon it is caught and tree points are deleted.

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What? I aint ever saw them say that..I've seen em be able to touch one and would not consider it caught..Now if it comes dragging one out of a hole like in the first post..Thats a caught coon but I'd make mine let it go and we could tree it again

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Do a search, they've said it several times.

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Registered: Jun 2005
Location: Wahoo, Nebraska
Posts: 45

Jim as I said , really not questioning the rule as it is, just wanting to know if you fellas think it is a bit absurd to not believe a hound ran a coon in a hole and barked loudly , clearly, and consistently as it would on a tree , had the coon , but doesn't get tree points, because when you handled him he pulled the coon out. You and I both know on a pleasure hunt what really took place , so sometimes at a hunt the same thing take place, just think this rule could stand some change consideration. Again if the dog does the same thing and the coon is not pulled out, but when dog is handled and pulled from the hole and the coon is seen he is awarded the tree points.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
Posts: 4927

Yes, but a caught coon is a caught coon. If the dog can touch it it's caught and you can't get tree points because the rules specifically say no tree points for coon caught on the ground.

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Registered: Aug 2009
Location: Hayden, AL
Posts: 152

I may be mistaken, but I do believe a "caught coon" is if you get to your dog and your dog has the coon in his mouth or fighting the coon. In this particular instance, the dog was called treed..showed treed in a hole....so you have to score that.....now when the coon was brought out of the hole...then it's obvious the coon was seen.

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Adam, how do you think that dog brought that coon out of there? On a leash? In a wheelbarrel? When you pull your dog out of hole and he comes out with a coon, that coon is caught. Tree points are deleted and strike points are plussed.
Why would you try to make this simple situation so hard to score?

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Registered: Apr 2006
Location:
Posts: 6548

so the hole wasnt very deep.lol i dont look in very many
holes.he who gambles the most has the most to lose.

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Registered: Aug 2009
Location: Hayden, AL
Posts: 152

So if your dog trees a coon in a tree and say it is on the first limb of the tree... coon bailss out of the tree and your dog catches it....what are gonna score that, Jim?

I am not making anything difficult....I read the question and give the answer that applies according to the rules.

The coon is either treed or caught....which is it.....first the coon was treed...then caught...give the dog his points....he treed the coon, just happened to be in a hole.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Los Angeles, MN
Posts: 4236

quote:

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Originally posted by Adam Whitehead


The coon is either treed or caught....which is it.....first the coon was treed...then caught...give the dog his points....he treed the coon, just happened to be in a hole.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Weyers Cave Va
Posts: 13416

quote:

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Originally posted by Adam Whitehead
So if your dog trees a coon in a tree and say it is on the first limb of the tree... coon bailss out of the tree and your dog catches it....what are gonna score that, Jim?

I am not making anything difficult....I read the question and give the answer that applies according to the rules.

The coon is either treed or caught....which is it.....first the coon was treed...then caught...give the dog his points....he treed the coon, just happened to be in a hole.

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Hobo nailed it.
Adam, it is great that you want to follow the rules. I'm sure you know that a tree cannot be scored until the dogs are handled and the shinetime has started. So if the coon is in the dogs mouth BEFORE the dog is handled and/or the shinetime starts, the tree cannot be scored and the strike points are plussed.

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: bronaugh,MO
Posts: 2595

They just need to post jims phone # on the back of the scorecards and add 1 rule..........any questions call this number.

lol, how ya been jim ol buddy......good to see your still keepin the carbite burning.

Im sure Elvis is still in the building too, so hey to you too bud when you read this.

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Warren, In
Posts: 150

I know what the rules say buy in my opinion, if the dog is running a track and then gets treed with a coon he should get his plus points even if he does end up pulling out of a hole when you pull him out. I know what the rule says about a caught coon and personally I don't like that rule anyway. I think if the dog is hunting and catches the coon he should get points for catching it. I don't know that it happens that often that they get caught, I know we don't catch them but every once in a while. IMO if my dog catches a coon on the ground or in a hole then he deserves a pat on the head for catchin the thing.

Nickie

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: North GA
Posts: 14388

Mine treed one in a old metal trap looking thing one night up in the north country..She could reach it as was evident from all the blood on her head..She could not get far enough in thwe little opening to catch the coon..To me that IS NOT a caught coon..Trapped maybe but not caught..

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