Registered: Jul 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 44

I was wondering what you all think is the true test of a coonhound’s ability???

Being able to consistently true coons a lone.

Winning 50% or more of hunts entered.

Receiving a title (no matter how many hunts it takes).

Other (If you choose other please explain.)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Beaver Springs, Pennsylvania
Posts: 3316

because to me a coonhound is not only a dog that can tree a coon, it is comformationally correct, meaning win on the bench, run a field trial & win & swim a water race & win. Any dog can tree a coon, not just a 'coonhound' but to me, it has to LOOK like a coonhound is spose to look. What about the ppl that have their dogs just to pleasure hunt? Is their dog any less of a dog, just because they don't comp. hunt it? Some ppl don't want to comp. hunt because of the cheating, lying & brow beating they get in the hunts, their dog can & does tree a coon, just not in a timed nite hunt. To me, that dog is just as good as the next WLD CH. (JMO)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Central,Kansas
Posts: 423

I had to vote"Being able to consistently true coons a lone.",because the question was the true test of a coonhounds ability.This would have to mean in all weather conditons,and all the different terrains.I wouldn't feed the hound though unless it also had good confirmation,and brains enough to be quite in the pen.

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: TN
Posts: 76

i voted other..........i think a real coondog should be able to do all of these things and more..........in addition to the things mentened above he should also be able to tree coons with or without company..........there are some dogs that tree coons good by themselves but won't tree at all even if they have a coon with other dogs............he also in my opinion shouldn't go a mile before he ever puts his nose on the ground and should tree coons at least 85-90% of the time.............

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Seymour, Missouri
Posts: 250

In my opinion to be classified as a coondog they need to do the first two option on the poll consistently.

As for the third option I assume you are kidding, right?

To me a dog that has made nite champion and it took two years competing every weekend is not a coondog! JMO

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2967

I think the true test of a coondog here in Illinois is to be able to consistantly tree coons in January. I have seen some Grand Nite Champions and Nite Champions that can't get the job done, ( a couple I have owned, several that others have owned).

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: East Texas
Posts: 828

I agree the true coonhound should be a total package, not just the best dog in the woods, but a good looking animal that meets the breed standard and can hold its own in a bench show. If you are concerned only with hunting ability and don't care about the breed standard might as well hunt a treeing german shepherd - who cares what he looks like, he can tree a coon right? WRONG.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Sylva, North Carolina (the far Western Tip of the State)
Posts: 10272

I agree 100%.

We hunt our dogs in competition hunts not to win, but to support all the clubs that support our club. We are a small club, and we need all the help that we can get. We figure that if no one from our club shows up at their hunts, eventually the favor will be returned. So we try to go and at least show, if we don't hunt.

If clubs don't stick together and help each other out, what's the point of being in a clubto begin with? I mean after all, we're all out to support our great sport of hunting, right?

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: East Texas
Posts: 828

Now let me say up front I'm not knocking nite hunt winners - i've only been on two hunts and to even get my first cast win will be the THRILL of a lifetime, but in some ways, a competition doesn't always show which dog is actually the best COONDOG, but only the best at performing in that particularly scripted scenario. I look at it the same as the children who ace achievement tests and SAT's but "don't have the sense got gave a cabbage". They trained hard to apply themselves to achieving in that very controlled situation, a multiple choice test, but when put in a position to actually APPLY that knowledge, such as a debate or an essay test, they are at a loss. Again I'm not knocking hunting titled dogs, if I had one I'd be shouting it to the heavens ;0) - but I think the true coondog should also be able to get out and tree coons consistently in a variety of situations, not just those that fall within nite hunt rules.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: minnesota
Posts: 1799

just my opinion but a coonhound is what the owner wants in a hound a coonhound that suits the person that owns it. now a dog that suits one man/woman might not live in another. i've culled dogs most average people would be happy with. i want a daul purpose dog my self but more importantly it could be the best worl show champion in the world and if it don't tree me a coon when i cut it loose it not going to live long at my house. people don't get me wrong i'm not a coondog killing machine but i do feel if a dog does not have it we shouldn't be giving them away as pets so other people can breed them. and another subject people saying good females are hard to come by, well quit messing with the poor ones and breeding them and wait for the good one to come along the money you spend feeding all the bad ones you could buy a great one, again this is just my opinion

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
Posts: 389

I 've had German sheperds tree coon on a regular bases.Treeing coons are'nt as tough as some make it .A dog with talent can tree coon more often and are more enjoyment watching a dog drift a track acrossed a frozen field and come down treed .or pick a lay up coon acrossed a field and come down treed.Yes treeing coon consistantly is great but in all kind of conditions it takes talent. Don't get me wrong but alot of good coondogs are just track & tree dogs and are consistant in the right condition .But in the wrong conditions there percentages go down. That why a person looking to improve dogs must evaluate the dogs talents plus & minuse to improve your breeding program or dogs you hunt. that why I picked other

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: East Texas
Posts: 828

quote:

---

Originally posted by wade lucking but more importantly it could be the best worl show champion in the world and if it don't tree me a coon when i cut it loose it not going to live long at my house. people don't get me wrong i'm not a coondog killing machine but i do feel if a dog does not have it we shouldn't be giving them away as pets so other people can breed them. [/B]

---

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Dellwood Fl.
Posts: 585

Wade, I don't see anything wrong w/ giving away dogs that don't suit you. I have given several away to deer hunters (legal to run dogs here) that have gone on to suit their owners and even breed them(unregistered). THE KEY IS TO NOT GIVE THEM THE PAPERS, and then only give them to folks you trust. If they have no talent or any defects they get lead poisioning ( .22)

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Marion,NC
Posts: 10

I had to vote other because to me a coondog should run and tree coons and have a coon 90 % of the time, if not more. But, most of all a coondog should make the owner happy. If your not feeding the other mans dog it doesn't matter what you think of it.

Wade Lucking--A wise old man once told me you don't get what you breed you get what is thrown from the sire and dam--a dog that seems like it ain't worth killing may just throw some of the best pups in the world. Just because the dog didn't make the type of coondog you be wanting don't mean its offspring wouldn't make great coon dogs...in short you might have done killed the best coondog you have ever had...thought I'd share his opinion seems we all got them.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: columbus,ny
Posts: 276

I vote tree coons by theirselves. If they can do this, and not take all night doing it, they will win their fair share of nite hunts.

As for treeing in a controlled situation, what are you talking about? A dog can either run and tree, or it can't. I have nothing at all against pleasure hunters. I have and still see some awful nice dogs that will never see a competition hunt for various reasons.

Most of the people that can't win a nite hunt just plain don't have any dog power. Their dogs tree for a few minutes and then come wandering off the tree 30 yards to greet you and get minused. Then it shows up on the message board how they got cheated Saturday night. Or their dog just stands around because it is around strange dogs and people. This is something that all trainers come across and take care of.

Sometimes there is a big difference between a pleasure dog and a competition dog. Feed what you want, but don't come back from a nite hunt and say you got cheated if your dog doesn't do it by the rules. To me the rules are plenty lenient for the dogs any way.

If you honestly have cheating going on, report it. Don't worry about rocking the boat. Get rid of them. Your club will gain numbers in the long run.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Los Angeles, MN
Posts: 4236

Poor Wade sure stepped in it!!

Any hound that dosent make the grade wont leave my place either....I have had a couple of bad experiences with giving away culls.....

Excellent post Mike......If you get cheated at a nite hunt, in most cases it is your own fault.....There are rules in place that cover most situations....But, someone has to say/do somthing in order to make the rules work.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: The Great State of Tennessee
Posts: 2555

Had to go with other. I've seen dogs that would tree a coon 90% of the time that was'nt what I'd consider a "coondog". I tend to look at the total package. Treeing/track ability, the way they are made up, and especially their temperment and behavior. If you ever get a hold a hound that is the "total package", you'll know it. Those are the ones that can't be bought.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: columbus,ny
Posts: 276

Rocking the boat is a tough thing to do. You have to know you are right, and not back down. The biggest problems in the hunts are judges that won't make the right call because they don't want to argue.

If you are right, it doesn't matter. Put a question on the card. If this doesn't solve it, file a complaint. You might be out an entry fee or two, but in the long run you will have more enjoyable hunts for everybody.

There are always a few that think they have to win every time in any organization. You have the right to refuse any entry. Just tell the win at all cost handlers that they are not welcome there until they can act like ladies or gentlemen. Spread the word to other clubs in the area that your club has been having trouble with these handlers, and to ask other handlers how they have acted in the casts. If they shape up, contact them personally and tell them you have followed up on them and they are welcome to come to the next hunt. People can change with a little prodding. We have a few up here that really put the screws to people until clubs cracked down on them. Now, they are the people you want to draw out with. And the funny thing is that they win just as much now as when they had when they were bitchers. Their casts come back now with everybody raising cain and staying for breakfast and shooting the bull.

These hunts can be some of the best fun out there. People from all walks of life compete in these events. You can get as much or as little as you want from people at these clubs.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: WILMER ALABAMA
Posts: 159

I AGREE WITH LYNN A COONHOUND SHOULD LOOK LIKE A COONHOUND. ALSO BE ABLE TO TREE A COON ANYWHERE IT IS TURN LOOSE. WITH OR WITHOUT COMPANY. HERE IN LOWER AL. WE HAVE SOME OF THE TOUGHEST HUNTING TERRAIN ANYWHERE. LOTS OF WATER AND THE UNDER GROWTH SO THICK YOU WALK A WHILE AND THEN YOU CRAWL. BUT WE DO HAVE A FEW COON. PROBABLY NOT LIKE THE CORN BELT.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Columbus, Ks
Posts: 5398

A true coondog will tree a coon in all conditions. Some nights are not suited for man or hounds and the best hound may not get one treed. If I go hunting with a top coon dog I expect to see a coon . I expect a top hound to go as deep as need be, get treed, stay until I get there and have a coon. No excuses!

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: embattled usa
Posts: 70

If you really want to test what your dog is made of go down south in the swamp country and cutovers when its 90 degrees out at night. Then for fun head north into the corn belt and see if yours can keep up with the rest treeing 6 or 8 singles in 2 hrs. Then after the leaves are off lets roll down toward east TN or Northwest NC and see what Ol' Rover can do in them Hills. For the last part of our test we'll take a run up to MN or MI about December.

Now, if you had dog enough to tree coons consistantly alone or in the best company the area had to offer, I would think you could safely say you could pass anyones test of a real hound.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Kalamazoo, MI
Posts: 568

That sounds like the Purina Race to me....lol

and it also sounds like I better get back to the drawing board.

By the way, I choose OTHER as well.

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Iron Station, North Carolina
Posts: 893

I choose other because I feel like accuracy is most important. I get very angry if I walk a long ways through briars, thickets, and over steep ridges to a slick tree. I won't tolerate it much.

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: spraggs,pa
Posts: 76

i chose other because a coonhounds abilty to me is his heart and whaT he puts in to every thing u ask him to do

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Newfreeport, PA
Posts: 71

I've seen good coondogs tree coon every night,but still have faults.if you like the dog then that's all that matters.trophes,and tittles don't tree coon,coonhounds do about every dog has a fault.god knows mine do.mike

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