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Rory Cowles
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2009
Location: IN
Posts: 7334

Ukc please read

This topic is ideas on the performance program EVERYONE has a performance sire there is nothing that seprates one from the other have you all ever thought of doing something that will seperate one from the other?Here's an IDEA what if you had a program that once you performance a sire then when his pups are winning performance points and monies then the sire would acheive a degree or title of being a reproducer of some sort most great reproducers are never known til they are gone this way once you enter the program everyone is on the same playing field and let the pups do the talking? Like maybe performance statis then silver then gold then platnum or something like this, this way if someone is choosing a sire or pup and see's that the male is a platnum reproducer then obviously he is a reproducer of night hunt winners this could also work on the females as well?? and could help narrow there choices if that was to there liking and also help promote a reproducing stud and pup market the market is full of performance studs and pups nothing wrong with this just think it might help its pretty sad when someone can't give away a performance pup and people stand in line to give thousands for lap dogs??JMO this is not a grip it is an idea.

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Last edited by Rory Cowles on 10-18-2012 at 09:01 PM

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10-18-2012 08:44 PM

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Rory Cowles
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2009
Location: IN
Posts: 7334

other thoughts

I also often wonder why dogs ukc numbers are not tattooed in the ear of a dog in the cattle busniess all purbreds have to have this to be registered then upon entry at a night hunt the number on the card would have to match the number in the ear or the dog could not be entered in the night hunt each dog would have to be verified upon entry at all hunts even at the local levels?? Also if there was a reproducers degree that could be acheived that would also solve the old dog behind the barn argument as well cause then if the owner of the stud or female didn't choose to night hunt surley some of there pups would make it to town if they was a true reproducer?? Again just a thought.

Last edited by Rory Cowles on 10-18-2012 at 10:04 PM

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10-18-2012 09:57 PM

englishpride
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rory

give me a call ,got something i wanna tell you about but not gonna put it on here..

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10-18-2012 11:22 PM

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Rory Cowles
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Registered: Jun 2009
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In my opinion this would stimulate the registry for those that choose not to night hunt.
Example dog A reg. male or female Platnum reproducer no night hunt title's it's self but it's pups can win.
Dog B Gr. Nt. No reproduces title.Just because a dog can win dose not mean it can reproduce and can only be found out by trial and error lets say dog B has 20 pups with no statis acheived.
Who would you breed to or buy a pup out of? This way it would put all dogs that reproduce in demand titled or not??? And then if title's come's with it all the better then add a few major event wins or maybe even a World title then think of the demand it would put on this dog or dogs or there offspring? Also say a dog has a couple of litters of pups lets say 20 pups 1 makes ch of some sort several others picks up wins here and there but never gets finished to ch for what ever the reason the parents will never get on a reproucers list and never get credit for other pups that have won and maybe some of the wins were at major events no one would ever know the diffrence because these dog's never showed up on a reprouducers list..Jmo just throwing this out there just an idea.

Last edited by Rory Cowles on 10-19-2012 at 02:39 AM

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10-19-2012 02:28 AM

smokin-1-mo
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RORY

I THINK YOU MAY BE ON TO SOMETHING ......

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10-19-2012 02:58 AM

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LIL-E
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Registered: Sep 2012
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I see only English guys on this thread but I like the idea for sure.

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10-19-2012 03:48 AM

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Dirtdevil
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Everything makes more sense in proper context ... like a dog winning KOH or QOH for it's breed and not even being a cast winner or being 10th place overall ... it's not an impressive trophy when you know the context.

Same as producers ... how many titled pups are from the same litter where the gyp carried the load or how many dogs out of a stud are close to being titled but may never be vs. a stud that has more titled dogs but just because the stud owner pushed his through and the rest didn't cut it .

You can never have too much information ... but UKC isn't gonna mess with it unless they can make money on it , and even then some stuff they may just not have the manpower to do even if it would help.

It would be nice to know what UKC has in the works or to have a forum or panel that looks into this stuff and shares it with the customers .

I'm a little surprised that some of these guys that are handy with a computer and coonhunt haven't tried to subcontract their services to UKC and do some number crunching on stuff like this so that we can buy it like with all the stuff the AQHA offers.

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10-19-2012 04:21 AM

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dogtrader9
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i think ukc needs to put the purina winners title in front of dogs name on ukc card

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10-19-2012 05:12 PM

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dperry
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rory, you had me until your post on the tattoos and someone confirming the number in the ear with the number on the easy entry card. I can see the line now at autumn oaks.

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10-19-2012 05:35 PM

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groworg1
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dperry thats a easy one check winners only to make sure tat matches paperwork disqualify and bar any handler or owner caught trying to cheat !

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10-19-2012 07:05 PM

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T.Beyer
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Now that idea I like! Gworg...Reduce the number of dogs you have to look at. They don't all have to pass, but the winner had better. What harm is a dog that loses? None. But the winner will and had better be clean. Not sure how often you'd catch someone, but, you'd catch em for sure!

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10-19-2012 07:56 PM

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Doug A
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Registered: Sep 2003
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I show boer goats as well and that is how they do it. The winners better have tHe right tattoo or they're DQed. Keeping track of points can't be but a mouse click away but what's in it for ukc? Kind of like having their dog data base open for anyone to research. That is prob not going to happen either. Keep pushing Rory!

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10-20-2012 01:03 PM

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englishpride
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Hate to be the barrier of bad news but honestly i dont think ukc cares.

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10-20-2012 07:08 PM

treestroker
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numbers

wouldnt mind seeing a number like how many pups and how many points and how much perf money his pups have won.

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10-21-2012 12:06 AM

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Rory Cowles
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2009
Location: IN
Posts: 7334

quote:
Originally posted by Dirtdevil
Everything makes more sense in proper context ... like a dog winning KOH or QOH for it's breed and not even being a cast winner or being 10th place overall ... it's not an impressive trophy when you know the context.

Same as producers ... how many titled pups are from the same litter where the gyp carried the load or how many dogs out of a stud are close to being titled but may never be vs. a stud that has more titled dogs but just because the stud owner pushed his through and the rest didn't cut it .

You can never have too much information ... but UKC isn't gonna mess with it unless they can make money on it , and even then some stuff they may just not have the manpower to do even if it would help.

It would be nice to know what UKC has in the works or to have a forum or panel that looks into this stuff and shares it with the customers .

I'm a little surprised that some of these guys that are handy with a computer and coonhunt haven't tried to subcontract their services to UKC and do some number crunching on stuff like this so that we can buy it like with all the stuff the AQHA offers.

Aqha does a great job promoting there winners and reproducers there needs to be something that will seprate one from the other in the performance program not all studs are equal and it's real easy for one to get over looked or be to late when people realize it has something to offer of all breeds and ranks titled or untitled..There has to be a way of looking at them and saying this one gets my intrest!!

Last edited by Rory Cowles on 10-21-2012 at 12:01 PM

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10-21-2012 11:37 AM

Rory Cowles
UKC Forum Member

Registered: Jun 2009
Location: IN
Posts: 7334

quote:
Originally posted by dperry
rory, you had me until your post on the tattoos and someone confirming the number in the ear with the number on the easy entry card. I can see the line now at autumn oaks.

Your right but I still think its a must at all hunts you have to stand in line to confirm entry or enter anyway could have someone looking at the dog and conformation at the same time I sure think it would help clean things up!!

Last edited by Rory Cowles on 10-21-2012 at 11:46 AM

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10-21-2012 11:40 AM

Rory Cowles
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Re: numbers

quote:
Originally posted by treestroker
wouldnt mind seeing a number like how many pups and how many points and how much perf money his pups have won.

Yes sir..

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10-21-2012 11:47 AM

BRF
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Agree!!

quote:
Originally posted by Rory Cowles
Aqha does a great job promoting there winners and reproducers there needs to be something that will seprate one from the other in the performance program not all studs are equal and it's real easy for one to get over looked or be to late when people realize it has something to offer of all breeds and ranks titled or untitled..There has to be a way of looking at them and saying this one gets my intrest!!

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10-21-2012 01:25 PM

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dperry
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quote:
Originally posted by T.Beyer
Now that idea I like! Gworg...Reduce the number of dogs you have to look at. They don't all have to pass, but the winner had better. What harm is a dog that loses? None. But the winner will and had better be clean. Not sure how often you'd catch someone, but, you'd catch em for sure!

are you serious? you would have no problem with being in the high scoring cast of the event, finishing 2nd behind a dog that was not eligible to compete? you would have no problem with that? As you say, what harm is a dog that loses? i continue to be amazed.

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10-21-2012 05:07 PM

groworg1
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dperry me too ! lol starts a thread then ignores a common sense idea who cares about losers there 3 losers in 4 dog cast everytime ! but tats would stop a night or grandnight from hunting in registered class under different papers everytime ! the ukc is a honor system and this would keep them honest !

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10-21-2012 05:46 PM

steve pickett
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I KNOW OF SOME PEOPLE THAT WILL NOT BREED A DOG UNTIL THEY TITLE THEM,IN THIS CASE NO ONE TRULEY KNOWS THERE WORTH OF BEING A REPRODUCER,SO THEY SHOULD NOT BE DOWNGRADED FOR NOT HAVING PUPS,THEY MAY HAVE THE BREEDING AND BE A GOOD REPRODUCER IF GIVEN A CHANCE.TITLES ARE ONLY PAPER NOT WHAT CAUSES A DOG TO REPRODUCE.JMO
I THOUGHT UKC ALREADY HAD A REPRODUCERS LIST?

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10-21-2012 09:20 PM

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Rory Cowles
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quote:
Originally posted by steve pickett
I KNOW OF SOME PEOPLE THAT WILL NOT BREED A DOG UNTIL THEY TITLE THEM,IN THIS CASE NO ONE TRULEY KNOWS THERE WORTH OF BEING A REPRODUCER,SO THEY SHOULD NOT BE DOWNGRADED FOR NOT HAVING PUPS,THEY MAY HAVE THE BREEDING AND BE A GOOD REPRODUCER IF GIVEN A CHANCE.TITLES ARE ONLY PAPER NOT WHAT CAUSES A DOG TO REPRODUCE.JMO
I THOUGHT UKC ALREADY HAD A REPRODUCERS LIST?

Steve my point is this most dogs are hunted til they are titled or are older maybe bred only a time or two when young prolly never have enough pups to get on a reproducers list? Then you find out his pups has been winning all along and the dog is a reproducer on a limited amount of pups? At this time he or she is either old or dead in most case's maybe if there was a way to see that he or she did reproduce just fine thru the performance program he would have been utilized more before he or she was gone or dead if your getting a check on him as the owner of the sire or dam how would I know specially if he only did have a limited amount of pups? What if a dog has a couple pups that can't catch a first but is winning alot maybe even in major events dog or dogs gets killed or what ever but still not finished to nt ch you will never get credit on them pups on a reprouducers list for that dogs parents and maybe them two dogs had stacked up a bunch of performance points and before anybody was able to figure out that this or these dogs do reprouduce its to late? So maybe if the parents had achieved some type of statis along with the pups points thru there pups winning earlier then they would have gotten more attention sooner and maybe even utilized sooner??? I am just saying most dogs that are hunted alot prolly aren't bred much and when they are then its to late cause if your dog is 5 before he or she is bred enough to see if he or she will reprouduce you wont know nothing til there pups are at least 2 in most cases ????I don't think you read my intentions correctly not down grading anything..Maybe if there was just a list like stated earlier that listed number of pups born and points earned by pups on every perfomance sire posted each month beside there names that would be enough??Just trying to think up a way to look at the perfomance list and make me choose a stud titled or untitled?