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4 dog cast 4 dogs treed together,shine tree judge says minus handler asks for vote,2 say minus 2 say circle,what is it? Ive been hearing ALOT of contraversy over this ?,I no the answer I believe but all the diffrent opinions got me wondering

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Jesse nappin
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Circle.........two to two vote gets circled. A hunting judge never declares how to score a tree, it is always a voting situation.

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Brian Teague 252-649-3050

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Thats the total oposite of what rule 18 says

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Jesse nappin
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This is a hunting judge

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Any two to two vote gets circled. It was covered along time ago in the advisor. Three situations require a vote: scoring a tree, declaring a previous scored tree, and calling timeout. All other calls are made by the hunting judge and requires a cast member to ask for a vote to over turn the judges original decision. Still must be a majority of the cast to over turn or place a question on the card and let the MOH or panel decide.

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Last edited by nccoonhunter197 on 10-13-2012 at 09:24 AM

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Rule 18-4 says it takes a majority vote to overturn the judges decicion?

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Jesse nappin
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All cast members are required to vote on scoring a tree. It is not left up to a hunting judge. Read the earlier post and I think you will understand. We are talking about a hunting judge, not a non-hunting judge.

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P.S. If you are a member of the cast and don't vote you are scratched.

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Brian Teague 252-649-3050

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The way I read it says,hunting judge scores all situationa any cast member can call for a vote to overturn the hunting judges decicion but it takes majority of cast to overturn his desicion.Im just tryin to get thus figured out,Ive been hearing people questioning it at hunts

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Jesse nappin
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This rule was changed this year there's a * buy it in the rule book

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A hunting judge has no more weight in voting than any other member within the cast.

A split vote 2-2 is circled.

Coonhound advisor adress this situation -

To Minus or Circle
Dogs A, B, C and D are struck and treed in that order. The hunting Judge is the handler of dog A. The cast votes on how the tree should be scored. The hunting Judge and the handler of dog D vote to minus the tree. The other two cast members vote to circle the tree. How should the tree be scored?
KP/GA

This question came up recently at one of the Breed Events after someone failed the question on the Master of Hounds test. It was discussed amongst some well respected officials and a few of them did not agree on the correct answer; not until they took another look in the rulebook. This question has been covered in the advisor column several times throughout the years but it might help to cover it again. It seems that most would tend to go with the hunting Judge since there was a two to two vote. However, that would be incorrect. The correct answer would be to circle the tree. Rule four plainly states; points will be minus when dogs tree and majority of the cast, when hunting Judge is used, can plainly see no coon is there. In the situation above, the cast did not reach a majority decision so the tree must be circled. Remember, you must have majority of cast vote in order to plus a tree; you must have majority of cast to minus a tree. If you don’t have majority one way or the other, then you must circle the tree. The hunting Judge does not break a two to two vote when it comes to scoring a tree.

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Last edited by MikeR on 10-13-2012 at 12:53 PM

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at one time the correct way to score it would have been to delete it

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quote:

---

Originally posted by max destruction
Rule 18-4 says it takes a majority vote to overturn the judges decicion?

---

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In any tie vote on a tree situation the points are circled. Two say plus and two say minus= circled. Two say circle and two say plus= circled. Two say circle and two say minus= circled. You can actually have a tie with a three dog cast if one says plus, one says minus, and one says circle. That is a tie vote and it gets circled.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by nccoonhunter197
Circle.........two to two vote gets circled. A hunting judge never declares how to score a tree, it is always a voting situation.

---

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Its circled. Just remember a hunting judge is nothing more than a glorified time keeper lol.

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Where in the rules does it say circle on tie vote?

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quote:

---

Originally posted by max destruction
Where in the rules does it say circle on tie vote?

---

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Last edited by jabrown on 10-13-2012 at 04:06 PM

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oh my, no wonder so many people get 'cheated' in the hunts....


3 a.2 and 4 b.2

3. POINTS WILL BE PLUS:
(a) When dogs strike and tree and coon is seen: (1)
by a non-hunting Judge, or (2) by a majority of the
cast when hunting Judge is used.

4. POINTS WILL BE MINUS:

(b) When dogs tree and (1) a non-hunting Judge or
(2) a majority of the cast when hunting Judge is
used, can plainly see no coon is there.

so if you can't plus without a majority and you can't minus without a majority, the only thing you can do is circle.

FROM THE JUNE 2005 COONHOUND ADVISOR (this is nothing new)

To Minus or Circle
Dogs A, B, C and D are struck and treed in that order. The hunting Judge is the handler of dog A. The cast votes on how the tree should be scored. The hunting Judge and the handler of dog D vote to minus the tree. The other two cast members vote to circle the tree. How should the tree be scored?
KP/GA

This question came up recently at one of the Breed Events after someone failed the question on the Master of Hounds test. It was discussed amongst some well respected officials and a few of them did not agree on the correct answer; not until they took another look in the rulebook. This question has been covered in the advisor column several times throughout the years but it might help to cover it again. It seems that most would tend to go with the hunting Judge since there was a two to two vote. However, that would be incorrect. The correct answer would be to circle the tree. Rule four plainly states; points will be minus when dogs tree and majority of the cast, when hunting Judge is used, can plainly see no coon is there. In the situation above, the cast did not reach a majority decision so the tree must be circled. Remember, you must have majority of cast vote in order to plus a tree; you must have majority of cast to minus a tree. If you don’t have majority one way or the other, then you must circle the tree. The hunting Judge does not break a two to two vote when it comes to scoring a tree.

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Rule 18 states The hunting judge has coplete authority and will be responsible for scoring all situations

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I was on a cast just like this last weekend . It was a two to two vote so it got circled and was latter told by the master of hounds the we should have deleted it.

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again, from the June 2005 Advisor

Authority of a Hunting Judge
Some tend to think, the answer to the question described above can be found in the Hunting and Non-Hunting Judge Rule Clarification section in the rulebook, where it states; majority of cast rules and if majority is not reached then leave the call as it was scored by the hunting Judge, place a question on the card and check with the Master of Hounds. The hunting Judge does in fact have the same authority as a non-hunting Judge in all but four rules situations. Those four situations are: plussing a tree; minusing a tree; calling time out, and returning to a previously scored tree without declaring dogs treed. In order to plus a tree; the coon has to be seen by a majority of the cast. Majority of the cast must agree in order to call time out. Points will be deleted when dogs return to tree that had previously been scored. The cast may go to tree without dogs being declared treed, if majority of cast agrees, when hunting Judges are used. If you check your rulebook, you will find these answers plainly written.

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Jesse, That rule is refering to things like minusing a dog for babbling.

Scoring a tree has always been a vote situation where the judge's vote carries no more weight than anyone else.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by LIL-E
I was on a cast just like this last weekend . It was a two to two vote so it got circled and was latter told by the master of hounds the we should have deleted it.

---

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Lone Pine North

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I dont feel a judge should hold any more weight than any other cast member I just wanna no for sure

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