Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Northeast Kansas
Posts: 1121

What are the characteristics of Hammer Bred hounds? More specifically the Hammer III hounds. Thanks, Scott

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Oakdale, Pennsylvania
Posts: 3753

Hammer III has been dead since the 70's Hard to find any hounds with him up close in a pedigree today... The ones I saw from him and his 1/2 brother Doc's Hussler were Cold nosed, open trailers, bawl on track chop on tree, hard tree dogs that stayed put. Good looking but not bench show dogs. Some were trashy. They put alot of hunt in their pups, regardless of how they hunted close or wide they were always busy looking for a coon....

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Northeast Kansas
Posts: 1121

Wayne,
Thanks for the info, I knew he was a hound from days gone by. I was just curious if anyone knew how he hunted. I had a conversation with a fellow one time and he said to steer clear of the Hammer line. I know the Hammer blood has been a hot topic on here in the past. Thanks again, Scott

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Newfreeport, PA
Posts: 71

anyone who would tell you to stay away from the hammer line needs to come,and hunt with my abby.she's STRAIGHT cold nosed bawl on track,and 90 chops a min on the tree.she's out of northern blue levi .mike

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 1411

True, Levi goes back to the Hammer blood, but I consider him a Jet Bred dog.

I'm sure that John Vaught on here can answer your question. He loves his Hammer blood.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Northeast Kansas
Posts: 1121

I have read some of John's post, he is for sure a true Hammer man. I am fairly new to the coon hound and bluetick world and am just trying to get as much info as possible on the different blood lines.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Bolivia,NC
Posts: 605

Hey Hamermanfromwayback...................................give him a lesson in "hammertime"!!!TCB

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1076

Scott S.
>a fellow one time and he said to steer clear of the Hammer line<
Did he say why? Seems like a pretty radical statement.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that most blueticks have a little Hammer somewhere in their pedigree. Steering clear may be kinda' tough to do. And why bother? I used to see some Hammer dogs around here that I thought were pretty nice.

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bruce ordway

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Northeast Kansas
Posts: 1121

TCB,
I have seen all of those arguments from the old board. Bruce, I have talked to a lot of different people and I have forgotten who shared that info with me. It was a long time ago and the gentlemen just plain did not like them. If my memory serves me right, he said they liked the off game a little too much for his taste. I realize that the hammer blood goes way back. Hammer man from way back has made that perfectly clear.

Last edited by Scott S. on 08-30-2003 at 06:36 PM

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1076

>he said they liked the off game a little too much for his taste<
Hmmm... maybe he had hunted with my dog?
Check out http://www.bordway.org/coonhounds/galen.htm

He was one trashy son of a gun, and with a lot of Hammer blood up close. I guess I remember a lot of them being described as combination dogs now that you mention it.

Now that I have a little more experience with breaking, I wouldn't mind going back in time and training Deadeye as a pup again. Man, he had some nice qualities... at least that's the way I remember him.

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bruce ordway

Last edited by Bruce Ordway on 09-01-2003 at 04:30 PM

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Bolivia,NC
Posts: 605

Scott,,,,,,I thought you hadn't my bad!!!!!!! I was basically just trying to get Vaught on the thread!!!!!!!TCB

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: cambridge,ohio
Posts: 4143

quote:

---

Originally posted by poolecw
True, Levi goes back to the Hammer blood, but I consider him a Jet Bred dog.

I'm sure that John Vaught on here can answer your question. He loves his Hammer blood.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Gosport Indiana
Posts: 800

Hey Wildbill, was great to meet you at the Oaks! Nice to put a face to the name.

Now as for this topic:

I own a Hammer and Jet bred dog that made Nt. Ch. last month. She is a straight blue dog, cold nosed, quick strike, head up bawl tracking, hard fast chop tree dog, not ill or trashy. My husband has had Hammer hounds for years. I am not saying that ALL Hammer dogs are as good as mine( or as good as I feel that she is). There are dogs in ALL lines that are not as good as their littermates. Don't ask me why, but I have seen pups from the same litter that some can flat out get the job done and do it in style, while one or two should be culled. But then again there have been litters that they all turned out to be coon dogs. Just luck? Or is it in what that particular dog was bred to? Was it line bred or was it bred out of is particular line?

All I know is that my female will be ready to be bred next week. Her sire is Hammer 18, her dame is Timm's Blue Sue which is a daughter of Jet 5. I am breeding my gyp to Jet 6. Should make for a good cross, as the Jet line is out of Hammer blood.
Too tight of line breeding? Hope not. Will keep you posted.

And don't forget, all dogs have an off night sometimes. Please do not judge any one dog after seeing them hunt just one night. To honestley judge a dog you really need to see them hunt 3 or 4 nights before you can make a statement on their true ability.


Well this is just my 2 cents worth, may not be worth much, but this is just how I feel about my hounds heritage.

Debbie (mrs. bludawg)

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

I have hunted this line of dogs for some time now, and owned a lot of the other lines that had very little Hammer in them, and to be just perfectly homest this line of dog runs no more trash than any other line.........I like a young dog to be out there in the dark doing something, and if she/he is trashy while in training so be it I

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
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I can work with a young hound that will run, and tree a coon let she/he run some trash at a young age, but I do want them out from under my feet. I can take a hard headed Hammer dog that will run, and tree, can be trashy, and mold she/he into a coon dog.........They have to have the desire to hunt a track, run that track, and if it will climb tree when it goes up. I don't see a lot of straight natural cooners in any breed, and the most of the trash problems are developed through a dogs training from a pup.......So to say a hammer dog is worse after trash than any other line is be ( NOT THE TRUTH ) however to say they are any easier to break from trash that the other lines would also be a lie.

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

Jet V. and Sioux Valley Sue ........Sue is out of Sioux Valley Fly, and Hammer XI. You have some good blood there......How old is your hound.

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Longview Texas
Posts: 801

I have bumped heads with John Vaught on hear a couple of times, and he does love the Hammer line for a reason. Hammer dogs are proven winners and anybody with a little sence could raise a nice hound from this blood. The only thing I have ever argued is they are not the only "game in town" ! I feel like I can own a coondog no matter what breed or strain I hunt, it is not that hard if you know what you are looking for and are quick to cull! What I mean by "quick to cull" is dont hang on to a dog for 2 years to make a 'coondog" when there are other good young prospects out there. I have seen many men training a 4 year old dog and I just dont get it. I can take a dog at 7 months old and hunt him ten times and know if he is what I want. He could still very well make a nice dog after I get rid of him. I am always looking for the pup that after about 4 hunts he just "gets it" and there are plenty of those pups out there but you can miss out on them messing around with a 2 or 3 year old dog that "might come around one day" Man, I got WAY OFF TRACK, anyway, Hammer dogs are fine, I have a little Hammer blood on back in my Rock dog and it hasnt hurt him too bad!

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: cambridge,ohio
Posts: 4143

quote:

---

Originally posted by bludawg
Hey Wildbill, was great to meet you at the Oaks! Nice to put a face to the name.

Now as for this topic:

I own a Hammer and Jet bred dog that made Nt. Ch. last month. She is a straight blue dog, cold nosed, quick strike, head up bawl tracking, hard fast chop tree dog, not ill or trashy. My husband has had Hammer hounds for years. I am not saying that ALL Hammer dogs are as good as mine( or as good as I feel that she is). There are dogs in ALL lines that are not as good as their littermates. Don't ask me why, but I have seen pups from the same litter that some can flat out get the job done and do it in style, while one or two should be culled. But then again there have been litters that they all turned out to be coon dogs. Just luck? Or is it in what that particular dog was bred to? Was it line bred or was it bred out of is particular line?

All I know is that my female will be ready to be bred next week. Her sire is Hammer 18, her dame is Timm's Blue Sue which is a daughter of Jet 5. I am breeding my gyp to Jet 6. Should make for a good cross, as the Jet line is out of Hammer blood.
Too tight of line breeding? Hope not. Will keep you posted.

And don't forget, all dogs have an off night sometimes. Please do not judge any one dog after seeing them hunt just one night. To honestley judge a dog you really need to see them hunt 3 or 4 nights before you can make a statement on their true ability.


Well this is just my 2 cents worth, may not be worth much, but this is just how I feel about my hounds heritage.

Debbie (mrs. bludawg)

---

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

I never have said that the Hammer line is the only line of Blue Dog that is successful.........Just as you stated about your Rock dog having Hammer blood in him so does Arkie.........The thing that does get to me is the people that deny having the Hammer Blood, and not really wanting to give credit where credit is due.......Even with all the good blood around of today the jealousy that was started way back when still exist amoung breeders, as far as the person that told Bludawg to stay away from the Hammer line she/he was probaly someone with a problem other than the line of dogs jeaously or whatever it might have been. I have never owned any thing from your line of hounds, but have seen a few show up on the traders block here in Kentucky as well as from the other strains, and we both know what that means. I do have Hammer blood here as well as an older female that has Ranger III. in her through Mid Ohio C.B. and if she is any indication as to what the Uthcman line produces then I can say we all need some of it. I was glad to see a black dog win the A.O. but to be honest I WISH IT HAD BEEN A BLUE DOG......I hope the win was of great sportsmanship, and that the Black Dog was drawn out with a good bunch of Grand Nites ( BIG NAME DOGS ) to make the win look even better.

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jul 2003
Location: Sugar Valley, GA
Posts: 19

You know there must not be much to do at all in Berea, Kentucky. Sure looked that way when I got off the interstate to get gas there this weekend. So I guess thats why you have so much time to beat the same dead horse you've been on for a year. Every one here knows that your Hammer dogs walk on water and that you are the greatest witness to their uncanny ability to tree coons anytime, any place or anywhere. So let it go. And the credit where credit is due crap is a bunch of just that, crap. I suppose if I have a hound with a Hammer dog showing in the fifth generation that means I am supposed to come on here and tell every **** body on this board that the reason my dog will tree a coon is because of that. I guess I should probably give Dave a call and tell him thanks too huh? Gimmie a freakin break and live by what you preach. Give some of the folks credit that have accomplished things outside of that line of hound or with a little portion of it. I have nothing against a hammer bred dog or the man that made them, they used to be a nice hound, but you are like a **** vulture hunting someones mis-phrased sentence to point out they should have recognized Hammer blood in their dog 7 generations back and set the world straight as to that being the reason the dog will even hunt. Its time for a new topic.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1076

>Sioux Valley Fly<
Larry Stark was a local boy so I got a chance to see a lot of Sioux Valley dogs. I thought they were pretty nice. A local farmboy had a male out of Larry's stuff called Bodacious Brutus. He was one of the nicest blue males I can remember. He only went to a few nite hunts but made NT CH easy. If the kid had been interested, he might have gone on and won national hunts. I know I didn't want to draw him in a hunt.

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bruce ordway

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: michigan
Posts: 24

i can't help but put this in. My ormiston bred male got loose this morning and i pulled him off the tree at 11:45 with a nice coon sunning himself in a wild cherry tree.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

I

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

As far as what I do is not any of your concern.....Nor do I have to report to anyone as to what I want to think or say......I didn't start the post so talk to someone else this time all I added is what you read...........As far as what goes on in Berea what does that have to do with anything ????????WOW WHAT A NUT

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John M. Vaught

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Richmond, Kentucky
Posts: 3747

Please forgive me..........I don't know what got into me thinking the way I do.......I am not allowed to say anything on my own or have any thoughts........can you forgive me ???????? I will ask you from now on before I post on here.....By the way..........What is old Blue out of out there in your pen ???????????

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John M. Vaught

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