Registered: Jan 2004
Location: MICHIGAN
Posts: 194

How many of you have ever tried to breed a son to his mother? This was talked about at a hunt and I was wondering how many people out there have tried this kind of cross or know of any dogs that are from a mother/son cross?

Any information would be interesting to hear.

Thanks

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Registered: Dec 2009
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Posts: 504

Have heard some race horse people talk about this, They say its OK to breed mother to son but NOT father to daughter, Not sure why and I know your not talking horses, But it is very common in horses. I did have an accident litter with mother son on a coonhound I registered them and they made some darn nice hounds, Although the papers did say "INBRED" on them. I've never did it with Beagles though. Interested in hearing from others.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: NORTH CENTRAL WV
Posts: 571

Cattle Horses and other livestock it is quite common, I have seen it done with Mt Curs with good results if no major faults in the dogs as it will bring out the bad as well as the good if you have two really good hounds with no major faults go for it, you will get as close to a clone in the actions of the offspring you will see the sire and dam in the actions of the pup thats for sure

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Registered: Mar 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 142

I always went by the opposite. Father to daughter, but not mother to son. I have did it quite a bit with running hounds, and a couple of times with beagles with great results. I strongly believe in line breeding, and that is exactly what it is very close line breeding. My experience is some are oustanding and some are not worth feeding, brings out the good and the bad. If you are affraid to cull the bad pups, I wouldn't recomend trying it. BREED CLOSE BUT CULL HEAVY!!

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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: MICHIGAN
Posts: 194

That is what the guys were saying they said there was book or something on this but some of the things they said made sense to me and yes they did say all the fault would show as well that is why you have to be carefully doing this. I have never made a cross like this and though is was crazy but after thinking about it over the weekend it kind of makes sense if you wanted a dog just like the mom and the son the best way to make another one is breeding them together.

Scott what did you see in the coon dogs on the cross that you had by misake?

Still seems wrong to do or strange to do but the guy said if this kind of cross was made he would buy every pup from the litter so he was confindent that it would make the kind of dog he was looking for which in this case he is looking for a dog just like the mother and son which both have the same hunting abilities brains, nose, speed, hunt, etc... . He said this was the best way and the only way to make more just like them???? Bob have you ever made a cross like this?

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Registered: Mar 2005
Location: Missouri
Posts: 142

quote:

---

Originally posted by NATE BUTLER
which in this case he is looking for a dog just like the mother and son which both have the same hunting abilities brains, nose, speed, hunt, etc... . He said this was the best way and the only way to make more just like them????

---

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Registered: Aug 2005
Location: coshocton Ohio
Posts: 244

nate this fall i made father daughter cross only had two pups they both seem to be full of hunt tend to act alot like there dad .before all this stupid snow they started running pretty good . brains seem to be ok . a old coon dog man told me never breed mother son for whatever reason but father daughter was a good cross and ok to make

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: AUBURN, IN.
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that is the way they breed to get walkie/talkies dogs --but you have to keep the whole litter and pick out what you were looking for

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Northern Indiana
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I've seen a couple of nice hounds out of this type of breeding. What happens when you breed this tight is you lock in all the dominant traits on both sides, whether they be good or bad. So if the sire or dam have similar faults I wouldn't do it. Regardless when making a cross like this you should be prepared to cull and cull hard. Dogs out of the this type of breeding have also been known to produce very well when outcrossed on another linebred hound.

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Registered: Feb 2010
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I bred a bitch to her grandfather missed the first time one pup 2nd breeding that pup turn out good looks and hunt breed him back to his mother got 3 pups only 1 ran good and she looked like her mother out crossed mom and that daughter
to 2 different studs.mom had 5 daughter 2 all these pups
started 9weeks to 16 weeks they are 6 and 8 months old know and doing alright.I never inbreed to the the other side of the family cause its no longer around. The book I read was by Rev John parks I found a copy on amzon.com Akc did say nothing about it . I hear ukc will wright inbreed on the papers.But that half brother to half sister would not have that written on the papers.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Coshocton,Ohio
Posts: 2613

Here you go, read for yourselves.

http://www.nrta.com/breedforfoundation/breedingfor.html

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Registered: Dec 2009
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Posts: 504

Brad, You might be right. I may have quoted that backwards
My uncle had race horses when I was growing up, and that was AWHILE ago lol.
Nate My coonhound had 5 pups 4 made real nice dogs , I only kept 1, the 5th had some problems and was culled. They seemed to have most of the traits of the parents, I only kept 1 myself and had him till he died.

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Registered: Apr 2004
Location: Milton, WV
Posts: 2551

Nate,

keep in my by making such a cross you will not create any new defects or faults that aren't there already. If both dogs are exactly what you want with zero faults I say go for it and raise the litter.

Walkie talkie dogs weren't created from one cross like this. However we must use good judgement when planning such crosses. If either dog or any grand dogs show signs of a physical fault I wouldn't consider such a cross.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: NORTH CENTRAL WV
Posts: 571

(Bob have you ever made a cross like this?)

Brad
no I havent made the cross myself but I have had a dog from Father X Daughter cross and he was a very good dog natural tree dog trained hisself and he had 4 brothers from his litter and they all made nice dogs
So from my exsperience if you like what you see and no major faults GO FOR IT and if there is any that need culling do it. If you cant bring yourself to cull then leave this type of cross to someone who will

Its an old wives tale about three eyes and five legs and all that other BS if you want what you have and want to keep it you have to LINEBREED and in some cases Inbreed

UKC does write INBREED on papers for mother x son - father x daughter - brother x sister

AKC does not

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Millersburg,Ohio
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Nate, I have seen this done several times in coondogs, as mentioned your intensify the good but also the bad. As long as you make outcross after that. I have seen some outstanding dogs come from this. Is it unethical? Guess that would depend on the person doing it. We are not talking about people with morals we are talking about strengthing genetics.
I myself have been considering something along those same lines.. Good luck.

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