Registered: Jul 2009
Location: Wolverine State
Posts: 387

(Proposal 1) PASS 6-0
(Proposal 2) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 3) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 4) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 5) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 6) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 7) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 8) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 9) FAIL 1-5 W/AMENDMENT
(1) Require Master of Hounds to be licensed.
(2) Each club will be allowed to grandfather (1) Master of Hounds
(3) Each Club will be allowed the option to use the Master of Hounds format or the Hunt Director format.

(Proposal 10) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 11) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 12) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 13) FAIL 6-0
(Proposal 14) FAIL 6-0

(Rule clarifications)

(Rule 15b)
At time rabbit is seen, Judge
or majority of cast if hunting Judge is used, must
decide whether to allow dog(s) to continue on
trail or pick up dog(s) in order to find new
ground or another rabbit. (Exception on split track: must be unanimous decision when Hunting Judge is used)

(Rule 7)
Changed; may call time out, to "must" call time out.

(Rule 3d)
It will say dog's must be restruck by handler when turned in on a split track.

(Rule 6b)
Cast will not move with dog(s) on five minute clock.

Individual's will be able to single register dog's at WQ events.

Individuals 55 and older will now have the option of participating in a veterans cast at clubs provided there are 3 or more participants. World Hunt's, WQE'S and others to be determined will be excluded from having this option.

Last edited by Jed Nichols on 08-11-2009 at 12:58 PM

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: IOWA
Posts: 155

So if I'm 55 and bring 3 dogs and 2 friends 55 we would hunt along?

If so will these dogs be earning points towards a title? I hope this is not the case if so UKC titles will become meaningless, these dogs will never have to face the rest of the competion to get a title.

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Registered: Apr 2007
Location: Beckley, WV
Posts: 675

Just for future reference, you can single register AND hunt the same day at a WQE?

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Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 2789

Who was on the committee? I hope it wasn't some who always win with the current rules and do not want to change anything.

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Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Elkins, WV
Posts: 337

Nope. I think it was a bunch of losers who decided changing the rules wouldn't help them win. (Sarcasam)

Do you ever think about how the things you type sound?

Last edited by SRB on 08-11-2009 at 02:13 AM

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Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 2789

This is something I have seen. I have seen folks who always insist on carrying the scorecard and find a hole every time their dog fails on a track, and almost always wins every cast. I hope no one like this person was on the committee. Someone who wins this way would not want to change the hole rule. Now, if that offends some one, so be it.

I hope the most honorable, honest people were selected for the committee.

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Coshocton,Ohio
Posts: 2613

Mr. Haugh, I think this was the post for the rules committie.

UKC Field Reps to Meet on Rules Proposals

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Registered: Jul 2009
Location: Wolverine State
Posts: 387

Chad, yes you will be able to single register and hunt the same day. Keep in mind that rules will not change however until 2010.

Last edited by Jed Nichols on 08-11-2009 at 01:41 PM

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Danville, IN
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When do these new rules go in to effect jed. I hope chad dosent drive all the way to lagrange this weekend thinking he can single reg. And then can't because rules aren't enforced yet.

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Registered: May 2006
Location: Mount Jackson, VA
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quote:

---

Originally posted by M and M KENNELS
When do these new rules go in to effect jed. I hope chad dosent drive all the way to lagrange this weekend thinking he can single reg. And then can't because rules aren't enforced yet.

---

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Registered: Feb 2006
Location: Danville, IN
Posts: 432

Thanks Jar242 I see that Jed edited his post and added that 20mins after I posted my post. He probably should of replied instead of edited.

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Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 2789

Will someone explain to me the difference between this committee and the vote on whether to make any rule changes? I am sorry but I hunt coon dogs, squirrel dogs, and beagles in at least 3 different registries with several different sets rules and ways the rules are established, so sometimes, it can be confusing. Were these committee members elected or appointed? I know in the coon hound division with UKC, the rules changes are approved or disapproved by breed representatives and I get to vote on the election of officers of my favorite breed of coon dog. So, I at least get some say in the proceedings.

I thought it was interesting how everyone agreed on every issue except one vote on one issue. It seems like getting 6 guys to agree on one issue would be difficult, let alone 11.

I see the appointment of the State Representatives by UKC. I reckon I can assume they were appointed, not elected. What if one of these guys was one who always insisted on carrying the score card and always found a hole when his dog failed on a track? I know I sure wouldn't vote for a guy like that to represent me and my state. I don't even want to be on a cast with someone like that. And, I know for a fact there are guys just like that that I intend to avoid like the plague. It is just not fun to have to deal with people who will stoop to doing anything to win.

One final statement and then I will be ready to move on. Like I said before, I have lots of opportunities to compete with my dogs. If I can't vote any other way, I can certainly vote with where I spend my money and more important, my time. If worthless dogs can easily make Champions by rule manipulation, maybe I will spend my time and money somewhere where better rules are used and their Champions are true Champions. There are registies that get very little from me. I expect the best from UKC.

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Michigan
Posts: 9282

Dave,

FYI - All UKC Hunting Beagle Field Reps were invited to review, discuss and vote on rule proposals submitted by individuals who took the time to send in a proposalk they felt should be considered.

Not all the Field Reps could make it to the meeting. However, we had six Reps in attendance. All of which took each proposal seriously. Reviewed them. Had quality discussions on how they might have an affect on the UKC's Beagle Program from all angles. And then voted on each one separately.

There was no bribery, no elementary bs. It was a group of knowlegeable individuals who made decisions based on the best interest of the sport. Be assured any ideas of personal agenda's were tossed in the trash before they ever sat down. Then again, no one came with any to begin with.

Dave, some of your comments suggest we had a group of idiots making decisions on rule proposals this year. You are entitled to your own opinions of how the rules should be as is everyone else. But........don't forget that there are those that will think your opinions are not always in the best interest of the sport or everyone else. What would you think if you were on the committee and you'd have to read some of the comments you posted in regards to the "group".

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Registered: Nov 2004
Location: Fresno Ohio
Posts: 2212

Rules committees are not as easy as you think.
Example I sent in rule proposal #5 (Rule 15b) Eliminate handler's ability to call a dead track after a line has been called. Reason because this is what happened to me on a cast.
3 dog cast. Dog A strikes for 100 Dog B strikes for 75 and Dog C (my dog) strikes for 50. We get a line and all dogs break down before line. Dogs A & B swing out without us seeing them and start running again. My dog hits and scores the line for 100. At this time I am instructed by the judge to pick up my hound and get her with the pack as we have a split. I pick her up and strike back in for 50. I am told that she needs to run majority of the circle before she can get a line (which I knew). We get a line 50 yards after I strike in. Both handlers agreed to score the line and pick up the dogs. It went to a vote and of course I was out voted and we picked the dogs up. The score looked like this Dog A 200 - first strike first line. Dog B 160 - 2nd strike 2nd line. Dog C 100 - 3rd struck 1st line, line drawn thru 50 strike points and minus 50 for not meeting the requirements of plus strike points. Which I am talking about the second set of strike points. Was this fair YES it is by the rules!!!

Now with that said most people would agree it needs changed. But the rules committee's job is to understand why that rule was there to begin with and determine what is best for the program.

It is my understanding that the rule was put into place to allow handlers to pickup hounds that were running a baby rabbit. This would keep it from being caught. The intent for the rule is to protect the population of rabbits without punishing the hounds.

I believe the committee looked at every rule and gave each equal consideration. Just because they didnt change alot doesnt mean our proposals were not looked at. I believe they looked at my proposal and felt that protecting a baby rabbit was more important than someone munipulating the rule, to which has only happened once to me. For that I have to agree with thier judgement and thier ruling!!!!

REMEMBER IT IS THEIR JOB TO DO WHATS BEST FOR THE PROGRAM AND THIS MEANS LOOKING AT ALL ANGLES WHICH IM SURE THEY DID.

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: ohio
Posts: 593

WHY WOULD YOU TAKE A MINUS AFTER YOUR DOG COVERED THE 1ST LINE THAT WAS CALLED ORIGINALLY ,SEEMS LIKE THE OTHER 2 DOGS SHOULD BE MINUSED FOR QUITTING SAID TRACK ALTHOUGH I KNOW YOU SAID THEY WERENT SEEN .WOULDNT YOU JUST NOT GET THE LINE BECAUSE SHE WASNT IN ON THE ENTIRE 2ND TRACK OR WERE THEY VOTING SHE WAS ON A DIFFERENT RABBIT ? THE BUDDY SYSTEM MAYBE ?

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Registered: Dec 2004
Location: wv
Posts: 458

Eddy,

It is because it was a split track and he did not lock that set of strike points in by scoring the line.


Gotta love those splits.

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Registered: Jan 2006
Location: ohio
Posts: 593

I know this but she came through the line just wasnt in on majority (right ) I can see why he was upset .

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Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 2789

I have always been outspoken, especially on the rules, and I always will be. I sure could tell an interesting story about the beagle rules that being developed by another registry. I was very vocal about them to the point of upsetting the CEO and his Vice-President. They were making rules based on statistics and never broke brush behind a beagle. They implimented their rules and I reckon, because I was friends with the CEO and very much against the rules they wanted, as a last resort, came up with a set of rules I favored and had 2 sets of rules. All I can say is that registry now only uses the rules I favored and is becoming very popular with some beaglers. I might add that the CEO has sold the buisness and the Vice President is with another registry. I hope they are still my friends. I didn't mean anything personal against them, I was just very sure what may work and what wouldn't.

Allen, you may know I have an axe to grind against one person and why I have it.

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Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Greensburg, IN
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what if a dog is on the five min. clock and the other hounds are running a rabbit does the cast have to stay with the dog on the clock or can you try to score a line?

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Registered: Oct 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 287

Why should us fellow beaglers waste time to try to make ukc better and to get the nonhunting dogs out faster if all the rules committie just denys all proposals but 1?????????????????JMO JMO JMO

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Registered: Oct 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 287

So if im 55 or older and only three people show up and run vet.cast. and i win that counts as a win.Why would ukc try to make it easier to champion or grand out a dog????????Just dont make sense.

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Millersburg,Ohio
Posts: 1976

I don't think it has any thing to do with championing dogs. I think it has to do with UKC.
They are welcoming your entry if you are a little slower running for lines, and catching dog etc. I myself have all but quit going to hunts for awhile because I felt I couldn't keep up and was a burden to the cast. I was just as enthusiastic as ever but had some health issues. Kinda of the same thing for senior casts. Lets see how it goes before we dump it. Will it make ch's easier who knows but what about sportsmanship and including everyone in our hunts not just the physically fit. Its for everyone to enjoy.
JMO

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Registered: Oct 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 287

So your saying you win a cast you have a win towards champion or grands only if your 55 and over.Dont sound good to me.What does age or being a little slower have to do with it?you still have to get up there to score lines.You get three or more that cant get around then that would just be bad.How would they score lines?????Atleast in a mixed cast you might get young guys that can move and score more points.JMO Not trying to get any one stirred up.I just think it would hurt instead of helping the elder.

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Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Millersburg,Ohio
Posts: 1976

My understanding is the senior cast will have its scores entered just like every other cast. For instance in reg. or open if there is a senior cast and the score for their cast winner is in the top 4 high scores, they would go to winners pack.
In champions if the senior cast winners score is high for all champion cast they would get a win, if another ch. cast scores higher they get the win. They scores compete with all other scores in their category.
That is how I understand, could be wrong.

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Registered: Oct 2003
Location: mid-michigan
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quote:

---

Originally posted by VICKY B
..... For instance in reg. or open if there is a senior cast and the score for their cast winner is in the top 4 high scores, they would go to winners pack.

---

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