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4 dog cast all dogs stuck no order dog a trees alone dogs b and c are treed together so split treed d still on track tree closed on a while scoring tree tree for b and c close dog d still on track dog a scores tree now as option to let go under new rules srikes back in then you score dogs b andc so 2 dogs out on track turn dogs b and c go dogs dog a score on track is what so what does dogs b and c come back in i think this onemight cause a problem in some hunts under new rule

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Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Morrison TN
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Everybody goes in at 25. Why?

Because when you turned dog A loose only 1 coon had been scored, dog D had 25 strike and no dog can be struck in over another dog unless it is a "non working dog" per the rules (1 hour or coon seen in 2 trees). Since A can't be struck in over D at this time, he has to go in for 25.

After you score B and C's tree you can apply the non working dog rule to dog D, (provided coon had been seen in both trees), and he is a non working dog. Strike would be back open at 100 EXCEPT you still can't strike in above dog A, who is carrying 25 strike. Therefore B and C have to go back in for 25.

The non working dog rule allows you to strike back in above the dog that is "non working" but you still can't strike in above other dogs on the cast that are not considered "non working" dogs.

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Rip.......let me see if I understand this correctly.
We cast Abbi, Jessi and Fancy. Fancy is struck for 100, Abby 75, Jessi 50. Abby treed for 125. Jessi split for 125. Fancy still trailing. We score Abby plussed both ways. Recast Abby to Fancy. Abby restruck for 25. Score Jessi plussed both ways. Recast Jessi to Fancy and Abby. Two coon have been scored on two separate trees so Jessi is eligable to to strike in under rule 7 Non-Working Dog Rule. But Jessi can't come back for 100 because Abby is not a non-working dog and is carrying 25. So Jessi can only come back in for 25 even though she is casting to Fancy WHO IS a non-working dog. Is that correct?

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that what i would say but in some of the hunts i go to the ones that judge the nite champ cast will tell you if you dont know the rules your gonna get screwed and where i live theres not alot of hunts were you dont draw out with the same 3 or 4 that always need to be the judge so one nite its called one way the next the other way so then they say your be and a,, for asking about the rules

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Yes because there is a specific rule stating that you can not strike in above another dog on track.

The exception is the non working dog rule, meaning that you CAN strike in above dog X PROVIDED he meets the requirements for a non working dog.

See the rule doesn't make jessie "eligible" to strike in, the rule EXEMPTS Fancy from the protection of not being struck in over. Fancy is the dog the non working dog rule pertains to.

So, just because you and any other dog can legally strike in above Fancy, since she is now considered a non working dog, the rule about not striking in above a dog on track still applies to all the rest of the dogs because they are still working as part of the cast. You don't punnish the rest of the dogs because Fancy can't work with the cast, all you are doing is taking away the ability for one non treeing dog to lock up strike points on everybody else.

Does that make sense?

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Last edited by Rip on 02-12-2009 at 01:00 AM

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Yes. Thank you.

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Registered: Nov 2005
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A, B and C would all strike back in for 25. Rip, you are wrong to apply the 'non-working' dog rule, if B & C have a coon. When A, B or C are under a SECOND coon, then that rule applies. Just because A had coon and B & C had a coon, that don't mean 2 coon have been scored over any one dog. When A, B or C are under another coon seen, then the 'non-working' rule can apply and 100 strike would be open. Take care, Ron.

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Rip & JiM- Didn't have a similar conversation as this just awhile back and you both said differently?
Maybe I am mistaken. I know I am confused already!

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Brogy, no I have said it this way all along, others didn't agree but that's what I stated then as well. There were other circumstances but it was basically the same question. Search it, I promise you I said the same thing LOL.

Ron, the only requirement is that two coon seen in two different trees while one dog holds a strike position or one hour of hunt time. It does NOT have to be the same dogs in two seprate trees, only that the cast scores two seprate trees with coon in them and one dog not operating with the cast.

Here's the exact rule, word for word and it just says two coon scored. Doesn't matter if dog A wasn't in on the second coon or not, the CAST scored on two coon while that one dog was holding the same strike.

"7. NON-WORKING DOG:

If dog is not working as part of cast and is holding first strike or second strike, etc., all strike points will be open to other dogs after coons have been treed and seen in two separate trees, or one hour of hunting time has elapsed."

So, yes you would apply the non working dog rule, the thing that keeps them struck in at 25 is the fact that a dog that IS working with the cast has 25 and you can't strike in above them.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Rip
Brogy, no I have said it this way all along, others didn't agree but that's what I stated then as well. There were other circumstances but it was basically the same question. Search it, I promise you I said the same thing LOL.

Here's the exact rule, word for word and it just says two coon scored. Doesn't matter if dog A wasn't in on the second coon or not, the CAST scored on two coon while that one dog was holding the same strike.

---

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It was the same situation then though, you had one dog that was working as part of the cast that got caught struck in for 25 or so, so it was the exact same situation. Even though the non working dog rule applied the strike couldn't be opened back up because of the OTHER dog, not the one that was the non working dog.

I'll find it and post a link.

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Last edited by Rip on 02-12-2009 at 03:36 AM

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Here's the link to the other discussion.

http://forums.ukcdogs.com/showthrea...threadid=249624

What you have to remember is the non working dog doesn't allow the other dogs to do anything, it takes the protection from being struck in over from the non working dog.

The protections from being struck in over still apply to all the dogs that are still working with the cast.

The standard is to not strike in over another dog.

The exception is you may strike in over dogs that meet the requirements of a "non working dog".

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Registered: Aug 2006
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thats a good ? but would you be better off to keep your dog on a leash & score other tree then be able to strike back in at 100 or 75 or should you loose that when you opted to release your dog ?

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That's where handling comes in.

You have the option to release to that dog, or if you suspect that the other dogs have a coon and your dog is a first strike dog keep it on a leash so the non working dog rule will allow you to open up the 100 strike.

If you got a 2 or 3rd strike dog that's a first tree dog then you may be better off turning the dog loose and getting 25 strike and 125 tree and keeping "mr automatic strike dog" your competition has from being able to take advantage of "carryin a hunnerd with him".

See what I mean? The answer to whether or not to turn loose will depend on what you draw. You can bet if I draw the "automatic strike dog" I will be turnin mine loose every time keepin him from gettin a chance to get 100 strike on his babble.

Thin coon? probably turnin loose cause time is important.

Every situation is different but bottom line is it pays to know the rules and know when and how to apply the non working dog rule can be a big plus.

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Registered: May 2006
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Suppose you have dogs a and b split treed from dog c, dog d still on track, after scoring dogs a and b handler of dog a wants to recast and handler of dog b does not, Does dog a recast and dog b keep his on the leash ?

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Yep cause it says the handler has the option. Wouldn't be a good move cause if one gets turned loose the one keepin his on the leash is putting himself behind the 8 ball, but it would be legal.

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